battle of loos Posted 4 July , 2016 Share Posted 4 July , 2016 (edited) good morning, I researche all police men who served in France . because, I have finded near the battle field (artois - zouave valley) one cap badge of the ROYAL IRISH CONSTABULARY with another cap badge (CANADA). this is the cap badge : thank's in advance for your anser regards michel Edited 5 July , 2016 by battle of loos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jervis Posted 25 July , 2016 Share Posted 25 July , 2016 Hi Michel I am not exactly sure what information you are seeking? While the badge does resemble the RIC badge it seems odd to find a civilian police badge on a WW1 battlefield. Are you sure it is an RIC cap badge? I am no expert but could it be from an Irish related regiment such Tyneside Irish, London Irish, Royal Irish regiment etc. The Tyneside Irish cap badge seems to look similar regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoEssGee Posted 31 August , 2016 Share Posted 31 August , 2016 Michel, I am not an expert on badges either, but the one you have found certainly appears to be a Royal Irish Constabulary badge. There were many hundreds of former RIC policemen who served during the war, with probably the majority serving with the Irish Guards. It is very likely that some of these former policemen carried their RIC cap badge with them during the war as a memento, so I'm not surprised that some were lost. Congratulations on a rare find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
battle of loos Posted 23 September , 2016 Author Share Posted 23 September , 2016 good morning, sorry for the long time without no anwser. this the basck about this cap badge : when i have find this cap badge badge I know for the London Irish Rifles but for the "British Military Bagde forum" are the ROYAL IRISH CONSTABULARY. I would like find how many Irish Policemen are coming in France during the 1st World War. regards michel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony paley Posted 30 January , 2017 Share Posted 30 January , 2017 (edited) Michel, This is almost certainly the cap or shoulder badge of the London Irish rifles. It is not an 'Angel Harp'. The Tyne Side Irish wore the cap badge of the Northumberland Fusiliers with the Harp above NF on the collar, also Tyneside Irish on the banner below the harp. the other Irish regiments with a Harp badge usually had the regimental title on. tony P Edited 30 January , 2017 by tony paley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony paley Posted 30 January , 2017 Share Posted 30 January , 2017 just re read your text Michel, the London Irish famously went over the top during the battle of Loos kicking footballs, it was reported widely in the British press at the time and is fairly important in their regimental history. The Regiment still exists at company strength in the reserve London Regt. Tony P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Broomfield Posted 30 January , 2017 Share Posted 30 January , 2017 1 hour ago, tony paley said: just re read your text Michel, the London Irish famously went over the top during the battle of Loos kicking footballs, ... The Regiment still exists at company strength in the reserve London Regt. Tony P 'D' Company, but not sure how much longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrel Posted 30 January , 2017 Share Posted 30 January , 2017 Only one football was kicked over the top at Loos by Rifleman Edwards of the London Irish Rifles. 3 hours ago, Steven Broomfield said: 'D' Company, but not sure how much longer. It is the 50th anniversary of the formation of D Company this year. St Patrick's day parade on 19th March will mark the occasion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony paley Posted 2 February , 2017 Share Posted 2 February , 2017 There you go Michel, no doubt the London Irish Rifles, they were in 141st Brigade 47th (London) Division. The 47th Division was on the extreme right of the attack at the southern end adjoining the French 21 Corps. This I believe is near the village of Loos. The Division captured Loos Crassier. This could tie up with where you discovered the badge. Tony P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony paley Posted 2 February , 2017 Share Posted 2 February , 2017 Michel, I'm here again! in March 1916 the 47th London Division were in the area once more. they were holding the Northern part of Vimy Ridge in the area of Souchez and Carency. Tony P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoEssGee Posted 2 February , 2017 Share Posted 2 February , 2017 (edited) I'm still not an expert on badges, but I still do think this is a Royal Irish Constabulary badge. I have attached some photographs for comparison. The first one is from the British Military Badges site, and is that of the 1/18th (County of London) Battalion (London Irish Rifles). The second picture is from the Irish Constabulary.com website and is an RIC Officers badge. Picture three is Michel's badge. Picture four is another variant of the RIC badge. Are there any other variants of the London Irish badge that I have missed, because the similarities between the RIC badge and Michel's badge are quite striking. Edited 2 February , 2017 by TwoEssGee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrel Posted 2 February , 2017 Share Posted 2 February , 2017 (edited) The LIR badge does not have the strings of the harp voided whereas the RIC badge does. But then, the one found by Michael does have the clasp on the side of the harp which I have not seen on an LIR badge before. Even so, I lean towards the badge being LIR unless someone in the LIR was wearing his RIC cap badge from previous service? Bit of a mystery there... Edited 2 February , 2017 by squirrel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Pegum Posted 2 February , 2017 Share Posted 2 February , 2017 I agree with TwoEssGee. This has to be an officer's badge of the R.I.C., as the curly bit on the left side of the harp, the column, does not appear on the L.I.R. badge. The owner of the badge found on the battlefield probably had the badge in his pocket, rather than on his cap. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoEssGee Posted 2 February , 2017 Share Posted 2 February , 2017 1 hour ago, squirrel said: The LIR badge does not have the strings of the harp voided whereas the RIC badge does. But then, the one found by Michael does have the clasp on the side of the harp which I have not seen on an LIR badge before. Even so, I lean towards the badge being LIR unless someone in the LIR was wearing his RIC cap badge from previous service? Bit of a mystery there... Squirrel, I noticed the voided strings too, and that does raise the question of whether it is an RIC badge, or not. I found another picture (via Google) which has unvoided strings, but to be honest, it looks like a crude, modern reproduction, rather than a genuine RIC period badge, so I'm reluctant to post it here as the source appears to be a retail or auction site with unknown provenance. Can anyone clarify what badge was worn by Officers of The London Irish? Did it differ significantly from the OR's badge? As I mentioned in Post #3, and as Michael reiterated above, an RIC badge could have found it's way to the find location in the pocket of a former RIC officer, who was carrying it as a memento of his previous service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrel Posted 2 February , 2017 Share Posted 2 February , 2017 (edited) LIR Officers wore a rifle green cord boss with a small version of the cap badge as per other rifle regiments. Photograph of Lieutenant H Stubbing MC attached. Note also the shamrock collar badges. Incidentally, I have never seen (never say never but it's true) a LIR cap badge with top and bottom lugs - they usually had a slider. The post WW1 Officers and Senior NCO's badge for wear with the caubeen and adopted by all ranks in 1993 has a lug on each side but is a much larger badge and also has a square ended lug in the centre to hold the hackle - St Patrick's blue for Officers/Senior NCO's Green for OR's.) Edited 3 February , 2017 by squirrel attach pic.& comment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Mc Posted 25 April , 2017 Share Posted 25 April , 2017 Most definately NOT an RIC cap badge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Broomfield Posted 26 April , 2017 Share Posted 26 April , 2017 13 hours ago, Peter Mc said: Most definately NOT an RIC cap badge Not arguing, but can you tell us you are so certain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 26 April , 2017 Share Posted 26 April , 2017 I found this photo on this forum a while ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Mc Posted 26 April , 2017 Share Posted 26 April , 2017 2 hours ago, Steven Broomfield said: Not arguing, but can you tell us you are so certain? The RIC used the voided string harps on a red cloth ground for the forage caps from 1880 to 1922, badges suppled by different makers had to conform to the sealed pattern. The only exception I have ever seen was a smaller, differently shaped 'non-voided' officers badge worn on the side cap (source Smith and Wright Pattern Book, badge maker Gaunt) but it is unclear if this pattern badge was ever accepted into use. The example shown corresponds very closely to the Ulster Home Guard pattern but as the OP has said he found it near a battle field the dates do not line up. An indication of the size, and a picture of the reverse, may have helped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Broomfield Posted 26 April , 2017 Share Posted 26 April , 2017 Thanks - something to be learned every day! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
battle of loos Posted 26 April , 2017 Author Share Posted 26 April , 2017 good morning, thank you very much for all answer aboiut this cap badge . this is the back : size : 49 mm / 25 mm bindings resembles those for the officier cap badge. 2 brackets at the top and bottom. Kind regards michel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Mc Posted 27 April , 2017 Share Posted 27 April , 2017 OK so a cap badge size rather than collar, but the fastener bases possibly suited fir blades rather than lugs? but look at post 8 in this thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoEssGee Posted 27 February , 2018 Share Posted 27 February , 2018 Just seen this thread again, linked from a more recent post. Glad to see that a real RIC expert has cleared this up. Thanks Peter. Every day is a school day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
battle of loos Posted 27 February , 2018 Author Share Posted 27 February , 2018 (edited) Good evening I found the similarities between my cap badge (paint in black) and the RIC's. : These surrounded in yellow : While nothing sticks with that of the 18th London. Kind regards Michel Edited 27 February , 2018 by battle of loos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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