Portuguese Uniform?

[19mac79]

Does anyone have any information on the ww1 portuguese uniform particularly from 1916 onwards. I have searched photos on the internet but unfortunately theyre never very clear. Who made their uniforms? Did they use french tunics (as they appear to be horizon blue).

I have several portuguese helmets and a set of 1916 dated Mills webbing (US manufactured) supposedly made for the portuguese army and wish to create a uniform set up- though again there is very little information relating to this on the internet.

Any help would be much appreciated.

Andy

[ARABIS]

Try getting a copy of Army Uniforms of World War 1 by Mollo & Turner, Blandford Press. Out of print now but second hand copies should be available. There is a colour plate showing a Portuguese infantry NCO, an officer, & an artilleryman and another colour plate showing the Portuguese web equipment with a general description of the uniforms worn.

[Chris_Baker]

Are you a Facebook user? Search for CORPO EXPEDICIONARIO PORTUGUES 1916 - 1919. Stacks of photos.

[The Prussian]

There are two pages in the book "Uniforms of word war I" (Jonathan North, Lorenz books, 2012)

[19mac79]

Hi

Thanks to Chris, arabis and the Prussian. That's great, I'll have a look at those.

Cheers guys

Andy.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Does anyone have any information on the ww1 portuguese uniform particularly from 1916 onwards. I have searched photos on the internet but unfortunately theyre never very clear. Who made their uniforms? Did they use french tunics (as they appear to be horizon blue).

I have several portuguese helmets and a set of 1916 dated Mills webbing (US manufactured) supposedly made for the portuguese army and wish to create a uniform set up- though again there is very little information relating to this on the internet.

Any help would be much appreciated.

Andy

Andy,

A new Portuguese member has just joined the Forum today, and has posted an offer regarding information on the colour etc. of Portuguese WW1 uniforms, so you may find their input very useful.

Regards,

LF

[johnboy]

http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=239630&hl=

[19mac79]

Hi LF and JB

That's great. Thanks for pointing rui out. Hopefully we'll see some nice clear pics of Portuguese other ranks tunics etc now. Has anyone ever seen one for sale in the UK? I know I haven't. I try Google every week but to no avail.

Cheers

Andy

[RuiC]

Hi Ryan,

Basically the Portuguese Expeditionary Force (CEP) used two types of tunics during their time in France. When it first arrived they used a Portuguese model which was plain grey (check the following video between 1:27 and 1:54, I believe that it is a modern replica but it’s accurate: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hHDJbUh9-g ). These tunics were made of a poor quality mesh of wool or cotton and didn’t last long in the field. I have never seen an original.

In 1917, due to logistics issues, it was decided that the Portuguese uniforms would be manufactured in Great Britain. To save time, the British factories simply used the British tunic model made of grey fabric instead of khaki. The grey fabric used by the British was not dull grey but more of a metallic bluish grey, hence the idea that the Portuguese tunic was similar to the French blue horizon. To complicate things further the bluish tone varied depending on the manufacturer and batch produced.

The only photos I could find of original tunics are these two from a book on the uniforms of the CEP (I've been trying to get my hands on a copy since it came out but it's sold out):

On the right it's an officer’s tunic of British design (officer’s tunics remained dull grey no matter the design). The other is the new British made other ranks tunic, in this case it retained the Portuguese upright collar but it would usually have the British style open collar. Despite the damage, in some parts we can still see the difference in tone between the old and new model. The shoulder "rifle" patches seem to have been removed for some reason but you can still see the contours. The helmets are also in the correct colours. From what I know, the commoly seen green ones were painted so post-war.

In my opinion, the colour of the British made model would more or less resemble this reenactor’s uniform (disregar the fact that he is wearing a replica of the old model):

During my research I stumbled upon an inaccurate replica exposed in the Brussels Military museum and some period b&w photos showing some oddities that I'll post in a later date, if you're interested.

Regards

Rui

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Basically the Portuguese Expeditionary Force (CEP) used two types of tunics during their time in France.

Rui,

Nice photographs and information.

Regards,

LF

[19mac79]

Rui

That's fantastic information. Thank you so much. From what I can gather then it appears my quest for an original tunic is going to be pretty much impossible. I wonder if anyone makes a museum quality replica?

Thanks again for the information rui

Andy

[19mac79]

Rui

Are Portuguese buttons plain for other ranks or do they have a crest/regimental badge?

Regards

Andy.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

I found these images of Portuguese military insignia on line, unfortunately, the text is in French, hopefully Rui may be able to answer any questions arising ?

Regards,

LF

[The Prussian]

Here is a link about the PEC

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portuguese_Expeditionary_Corps

[Lancashire Fusilier]

More coloured images of Portuguese Army Uniforms.

Regards.

LF

[RuiC]

Rui

Are Portuguese buttons plain for other ranks or do they have a crest/regimental badge?

Regards

Andy.

Buttons were plain for any rank bellow officer. Officers had buttons with the arm-of-service.

I found these images of Portuguese military insignia on line, unfortunately, the text is in French, hopefully Rui may be able to answer any questions arising ?

Regards,

LF

The ranks are correct and the arm-of-service badges also seem to correspond to my list but the colors are wrong. Other ranks patches were blue stripes over a black background and officers' patches were gold, worn above the sleeve. As far as I know, arm-of-service badges were made of oxidized metal like the buttons.

Regards

[Lancashire Fusilier]

The ranks are correct and the arm-of-service badges also seem to correspond to my list but the colors are wrong. Other ranks patches were blue stripes over a black background and officers' patches were gold, worn above the sleeve. As far as I know, arm-of-service badges were made of oxidized metal like the buttons.

Rui,

Many thanks for the information.

Regards,

LF

[19mac79]

Rui, LF and the Prussian

Thanks again for more information. I have a friend who knows a friend.... You can guess where this is going haha, who reckons they know someone who has a ww1 Portuguese tunic. I have asked them to get in touch with me. We shall see if anything comes of this. Fingers crossed. Even if it's just a close copy.

Keep the info coming as Ill need all the ammunition I can get if this guy does have a tunic and considers selling it.

Thanks again

Andy

[Mike Sampaio]

I’ve recently been to the Military Museum (Museum Militar ) here in Ponta Delgada Sao Miguel island. They have many interesting ww1 Portuguese equipment items such as water bottles and Mauser Mills webbing dated 1917. I know I wasn’t meant to touch the webbing but I did to get some decent photos. This is the larger 4 pocket Portuguese pouches. Different to the 08 British 303 pouches.

[Pete_C]

Great photos Mike, thanks for sharing - I've never seen this pattern in closeup before. The lineage to the British infantry pattern is clear to see.

The Mills Equipment Company adopted an innovative and ambitious global marketing campaign for its products after orders from the War Department largely dried up prior to 1914 - the Portuguese pattern illustrates their flexibility in adapting the basic product to individual customer's requirement.

Pet

[cmf]

Thanks Mike, for the excellent close-ups . . . the Mills designed and manufactured web equipment, the Equipamento para Soldado de Infantaria m/911 was first introduced in 1911 (it's also found with the designation m/912 for 1912). After the initial supply, Mills began sending webbing articles direct to Portugal, to be finished off and assembled by  the Fabrica de Equipamentos e Arreios ('Equipment and Harness Factory’) in Lisbon. With the start of the war in 1914, and despite the massive requirements of the British Army, dispensation was granted by the British government for Mills to supply thousands of complete sets to Portugal, often utilising webbing imported from Mills’ sister company in the USA.

The Portuguese designation of the cartridge carrier appears to have been the Porta cartuchos m/912; the rounds carried were those for the Portuguese service rifle of the time, the 6.5mm Mauser-Vergueiro (properly, the Espingarda 6,5 mm m/904), although for the men of the Corpo Expedicionário Português serving in France and Flanders during WW1, the 303-inch SMLE was standard.

The two water bottles are each of a type introduced in 1916, the top being the pattern with carrying strap, the Cantil com correia m/916, and the one below being the type hooked directly to the waistbelt, the Cantil com francalete, gancho e travanca m/916.

[Mike Sampaio]

Thanks Pete and CMF for your replies. It’s a strange often undocumented part of the Mills webbing story. More often than not most available photos are not ww1 issued webbing but general cavalry issues webbing systems in various museums around Europe.

[FROGSMILE]

49 minutes ago, Mike Sampaio said:

Following on from my visit last year to the Museu Miltar in Ponta Delgada in the Azores Sao Miguel island I realised I had some photos of a tunic I believe is post ww1 but gives a good idea of colour and  the shape of buttons. From what I remember this tunic was a 1921 model.

I wonder if the cloth was supplied by Britain.  I say this because the shade of grey seems very similar to that which was an alternative hue to the ‘drab’ (brownish khaki) adopted by some auxiliary British units in the years straddling the 2nd Anglo/Boer War.  There are photographs of such units attending annual training camp in the grey uniforms that was cut identically to the drab type.  When the Territorial Force was established in 1908 the grey service dress was abandoned by those units using it and by 1914 everyone was in the iconic drab associated with the British army in WW1.  It seems possible that the grey cloth was also sold to Portugal.  In the enclosed image the uniform can be seen second from right featuring a slouch hat.  The shade of colour was known as ‘Elcho Grey’ and the cloth initially made by the Hainsworth. Co.  The company still exists.

Edited 14 November , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[Mike Sampaio]

Got myself an original Portuguese ammo pouch. No Mills markings. Is black thread normal on Mills webbing ? Interesting that it has a small pocket for a stripper clip and probably a rear pocket for an ammo box. Any suggestions ?

[Mike Sampaio]

Here is an update on my recent purchases. Almost a full set of ww1 Portuguese webbing.