First Soldier to die in the War

[Andrew Marshall]

I don't understand why, but everyone forgets that actually the first British casualties of the war (2 of them) died when Fort Loncin blew up outside Liege. Their fathers were Belgian, but they had British mothers and both lived in Britain - one, I think in Gravesend.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Do you have any names for these two men? And what makes you say Gravesend?

Regards

Andrew

[TD60]

Hello

I noticed this grave in peronne

Probably one of the first british airman to die.

I do not know the circusmtances, when flying on ground of his death ?

On CWGC database he is noticed

commonwealth war dead, which excluded he was

killed when fighting.

Regards

[larneman]

Extracted from BE+C" shall mean "British Empire and Commonwealth"

`St Symphorien military cemetary also contains the grave of the first BE+C soldier to be killed on the western front ...Pte J Parr Middlesex Regt 21st Aug 1914 (originally believed 23 Aug but since confirmed as the 21st) There is also the grave of Pte G E Ellison 5th Ryl Irish Lncrs who is also claimed as "the last to die before the armistice" however he may have been wounded earlier and many men continued to die from wounds and injuries long after the armistice (my own Grandfather by example ) the same book explicitly states that the Canadian Geo Price was killed at exactly 10:58 on the 11th Nov. so he really does look like the "last man". To further muddy this "last casualty" situation...I have been looking on and off into the action on the Milina River , Portuguese East Africa on the 12th Nov 1918 between the !st batt 4th Kings African Rifles and Lettow-Vorbecks forces , the KAR history describes the action as "brisk" but I have failed to find mention of any casualties , or indeed , confirmation that there were none. Irrespective as to whether this action did have a "last casualty" it was, without doubt the last action fought by BE+C forces in the Great War. `

[Pierre]

Here is a response on website Centre for First World War Studies of the University of Birmingham

John Sneddon asks:

It appears to be accepted that the first soldier to be killed in the war was L/141916 Private John Parr, 4th Battalion Middlesex Regiment, kia 21 August 1914 near Obourg. The regimental history states that on 21 August the battalion went into billets in the village of Bettinnies (8Km north of Maubeuge). Two Platoons of ‘D’ Coy were part of a Brigade outpost line 2 miles north of the village but the history states that the night of 21-22 passed without incident.

I can find no reports of enemy patrols anywhere near the 3rd Division outposts for the night of the 21/22 and his battalion did not come into action until the morning of the 23 August.

Do we know for sure that he was killed on 21 August or should this really be 23 August?

Dr John Sneddon

Friend of the Centre for First World War Studies

John Bourne replies:

The currently accepted story is that Private Parr and another soldier were sent as a two-man cycle patrol to locate the enemy, an endeavour in which they succeeded too well. I am not at all sure how we know this, though, or when the story became accepted as ‘fact’. Perhaps the battalion war diary has the answer.

Dr J.M. Bourne

Director of the Centre for First World War Studies

http://www.firstworldwar.bham.ac.uk/qanda.htm

Regards

Pierre

[Blackie250]

The answer to this lies back on the 10th of August, the battalion was ordered to provide 1 NCO and 10 men for a Brigade Cyclist Platoon which was being formed, so essentially they were detached from the battalion.

The entry lies at the bottom of the war diary page and is timed at 6.15pm.

Hope this helps

[Boreenatra]

Here's an early one from the 26th August. Regards Steve.

[WASMAN]

The first casualty of any war is the truth.

[iain mchenry]

Whilst driving the Withdrawl from Mons last November I remember seeing the CWGC headstone of a soldier who died on 18 August 1914. It was not the RFC Corporal shown above. I am nearly sure that the grave was in Landrecies communal cemetary. I will hunt thru my photos and see if I can find him. Any other help would be appreciated.

Iain

[Bob Coulson]

Iain,

This had me intrigued so had a look through the register for Landrecies Communal Cemetery and you are quite right.

Private A Walters

1st Bn East Surrey Regt

Date of Death 18/8/1914

1st East Surreys would have been moving up towards Mons at the time.

Bob.

[Blackie250]

SDGW List's Private Walters as having Died rather than Killed in action though.

[Bob Coulson]

Yes would agree he probably died through illness or accident, wasn't suggesting he was KIA.

Bob.

[Moonraker]

Second Lieutenant R R Skene of Number 3 Squadron was the first officer to lose his life in the war when he took off from Netheravon to fly to France on August 12 and died when his Bleriot hit trees. His passenger, Keith Barlow, also died. Four days later, the same squadron's Second Lieutenant E W C Perry became the first British officer to die on active service in France when his plane crashed. A M Parfitt died in the same crash.

The RFC was then part of the British Army, so I guess these four were all soldiers. Funny, though, I couldn't find Barlow or Parfitt on trhe CWGC register.

[Moonraker]

I guess this string has just about run its course, so I'm taking the liberty of stretching it to embrace the first American casualties - only because I've come across details when re-reading "The Monocled Mutineer".

This states that the first US casualties were one officer and three other ranks who were killed on September 3, 1917 when the Germans bombed the American-run hospital at Etaples. The news was relayed to the US in a confused manner, with the New York Herald reporting it on September 11 and wrongly retracting it on the 13th; the latter issue made much of the death of a recruit who had died in a Long Island training camp of "acute indigestion". He had never worn a uniform or carried a rifle but briefly had the status of the country's "first war dead".

I guess that this title can be claimed by other US citizens who had joined the Allied (or even German) forces before the US entered the war. Indeed the five Etaples casualities had volunteered for service with the Red Cross.

("The Monocled Mutineer" by William Allison & John Fairley was first published in 1979 and was made into a BBC TV series in 1986. It described the life of Percy Toplis, who joined the army in 1915, deserted, re-enlisted, got involved in the postwar black market and was shot by the police near Penrith in 1920. The book and film connected him with riots by British and Canadian soldiers against the barbarous training regime at Etaples. A "Toplis" search within this forum will lead to other strings.

[Landsturm]

Matt,

According to Rose Coombes Major William Henry Abell of the 4th Middlesex was the first officer to die, J E Knowles was his second in command and was killed soon after.

Is there more detailed account of the events?

[daggers]

Here is a very early casualty, but not in action:

Name: COHAN Edward Molyneux

Rank: Second Lieutenant

Regiment: Royal Field Artillery

Unit Text: West Lancs. Bde.

Date of Death: 05/08/1914

Grave Ref: N. New. 11/12.

Cemetery: HALEWOOD (ST. NICHOLAS) CHURCHYARD, near Liverpool

Territorial commission 1911 in 1st West Lancs Brigade RFA (LG 17/5/11 -2/Lieut). When at TF camp on Salisbury Plain in Aug 1914 the Brigade was preparing to return home to mobilise. He had a serious fall from his horse which bolted when a tractor passed and suffered serious head injuries from which he did not recover. “…the first of the deathless legion to yield his all for the greater glory of England”. Born 1889, aged 25. One brother, WMC served in the same brigade, another, HMC, died in 1919 while serving in Ceylon, also commemorated by CWGC.

Daggers

[centurion]

The first German soldier to die may also have been on a bicycle as German cyclists were the first units to make contact with the Russians. However the first person of all to die would have been an unfortunate Serb or an equally unfortunate Austro Hungarian!

[kildaremark]

First 'friendly' fire incident -

Bombardier James Ketteridge, Royal Field Artillery, killed by the French on 23 August 1914 - the same day as the other first casualties on the Western Front.

Mark

[Krstyna]

Have just found this thread! Gran (nee Parr) told me John Henry Parr was the first "man" to be killed on the Western Front. He was 16 not 20, I think they have amended the grave now. John, or Jack as he was commonly called was Grans cousin. She had a brother "Jack" also called John Henry, he was also in the Great War, came back shell-shocked and was never the same.

I have been trying to find that documentary that was shown,I think it was called "The First and Last" my video didn't record it. I also have 2 lockets with photos in them, I sent copies to Chris but he says they were not John's regiment. I thought they may have been one of him as Gran used to always cry when speaking about him. I'm in touch with Gran's Parrs , they are descended from Frederick Parr, who was the younger brother of Edward T. Parr, the father of the first man killed. No-one knows anything about it, one said they dimly remembered hearing something but that was it. Wonderful isn't it?? These wonderful men and boys gave their lives to keep us free and again in the 2nd. War and the family doesn't "know" anything.!!!

Still, I've made sure my children and grandchildren know so the memory lives on. Also, on their fathers side, Rumsey, 3 brothers lost their lives too.Great uncles to my husband. Remembered on a memorial in Brundish Suffolk. I think it is very important that no-one forgets.

[keithmroberts]

Captain Jonathan Edward Knowles of the 4th Middlesex is one of my Greengates War Memorial men. His records don't appear to have survived unfortunately as I spent quite a lot of time at Kew yesterday attempting to trace them. I ran out of time before I could get to the war diary, which is piece no WO 95/1422 , but that,s for next time, unless anyone has a copy.

Bob Coulson is quoted above as saying that Rose Coombs stated that Major Abel also of the 4th middles was the first officer to be killed. I can't find that statement in "Before Endeavours Fade". Does anyone know the source?

Keith

[keithmroberts]

I have just found the following narrative on this site dedicated to the Middlesex Regiment. http://www.prole.demon.co.uk/middlesex/gw1914.html

The 4th Battalion landed at Boulogne on August 14, and was entrained next day. After a brief stay at Taisniéres, it started on a thirty-mile march northwards, and on the evening of August 22 bivouacked outside Mons.

The 4th Middlesex was in the 8th Brigade and 3rd Division, which formed part of the 2nd Army Corps under Sir Horace Smith-Dorrien. In the battle of August 23 the 8th Brigade was on the extreme right, the 4th Middlesex having charge, between Nimy and Obourg, of the north-east face of the salient which was formed by the bend in the canal to the east of Mons; whilst of the other regiments in the brigade, the 1st Gordon Highlanders and 2nd Royal Scots were thrown back on the right, and the Royal Irish were in reserve. The canal salient was the post of danger, and it was upon the 3rd Division that the brunt of the battle fell.

The attack on the Middlesex position began about 10.30 in the morning of Sunday, August 23, with a heavy artillery fire, which had lasted some while before the German infantry began to advance, "disregarding all cover and firing erratically from the hip." Our men were well placed and protected, and offered a stubborn defence against desperate odds. Major Davy’s company on the left was hard pressed, and its commander was wounded early in the day. As Major Abell with his company came up to its support he was shot down, as also were Captain Knowles and 2nd Lieut. Henstock. A third of this company fell in the advance; but the rest reached their comrades in the firing-line, and for the time made the trenches in this part secure.

The centre of the Middlesex line was held by Captain Oliver’s company, who from a well-concealed trench took a heavy toll from the enemy, "peppering away for all they were worth as if at manoeuvres." Here, also, as the day wore on, the pressure became severe, and two companies of the Royal Irish were brought up in support. On the right, at Obourg bridge, Captain Roy had been killed, and Captain Glass was wounded.

On the extreme left, to the west of Mons, the German attacks could make Little progress. But about three o’clock in the afternoon the 9th Brigade, which had put up a gallant fight on the west of the canal salient, was compelled to retire. The 8th Brigade, however,’ maintained its original position till past midnight. Captain Glass’s company at Obourg held on to the last, and was practically anni-hilated, only one subaltern and about thirty men escaping.

Keith

[Guest goran]

The BBC Radio programme "Making History" has just had an item on Bicycles in the Boer war. It carried on with some snippets of later use.

The throwaway comment was made that the first soldier to die in WW1 was on a bicycle. Does anyone have more infomation on this man or even know whether this is true?

The programme should be available for the next week on the BBC website (BBC.co.uk/radio4)

Nigel

Austro Hungary declared war to Serbia on 28. July 1914. and attacked the same evening.

Serbian troops destroyed the railway bridge over river Sava 1:30am 29.July 1914. and the Austrian ship "Altkomany" ("Altkomanj") was under the bridge at that moment. First casualties were Ištvan Balohi (Austro Hungary) and 16 year old volonteer Dušan Đonović (Serbia, born in Montenegro). The ship sunk together with it's captain Karlo Eberling.

[Guest Joycoster]

Thank you mr Betts, I've scrolled down so far I can't remember how to address you.The incident between Arthur Ransom and Alfred Davis was news to me and I only discovered it by chance while looking an old achive site for photographs of Peterborough and surrounding villages. I had known that my uncle Alfred Davis had lost a leg in the war but I did not know how or when but now thanks to you I do. Neither did I know of the accidental shooting of Arthur Rawson. That was very sad news.The funeral procession photo shows the funeral cart going past some houses do you know if these houses were kings dyke area of Whittlesey if so this is were my family lived until the end of the war.