Best Novel of the Great War?

[Guest Marijke]

Hi Tom,

haha think that won't help you as the book is not in German but in Dutch. (the writer is Dutch)

regards Marijke

[truthergw]

Hi Tom,

haha think that won't help you as the book is not in German but in Dutch. (the writer is Dutch)

regards Marijke

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks again for your help. Seems I will just have to wait for this one. At least I don't have to relearn German.(yet).

[ian turner]

Going along with Gareth's/Dolphin's choices - Winged Victory has a Henry Williamson connection - he promoted the book. Williamson's 'The Wet Flanders Plain' is also worth a read. Not a novel, rather than a recounting of his visits to the battlefileds after the war, but some of his descriptions in the book are splendldly witten, as was his 'Chronicle'.

Also not to forget T E Lawrence's Seven Pillars of Wisdom!

Ian

[Antonio83]

"All quiet on the western front" is surely a great and terrible book, but Remarque's style is slightly old-fashioned for the modern reader's taste, isn't it?

Amongst the most famous novelists (Remarque, Sassoon, Blunden, Jurgen and my beloved Graves) I place Joseph Roth and his beautiful "The Radetzky March" (a work on the decline of habsburg empire)

[PBI]

The machine gunner or soldier from the wars returning or some desperate glory or a subalterns war.

[Audax]

The first book I read on the Great Wat was 'A Covenant with Death (John Harris), followed soon after by 'All Quiet on the Western Front' and 'The Road Back'. Both made an impression and I am still reading both Non fiction and Fiction books on the war.

Have also read 'Middle Parts of Fortune'. The 'Regeneration' Trilogy (Pat Barker) 'Birdsong' 'Patriot's Progress (Williamson) A Very Long Enagement' and '1915' by Roger McDonald (1979). I also include 'Goodbye To All That' as 'Literature'.

Anyone got any recommendations for others that are easy to get hold of?

[PBI]

as an ex soldier of 10 years service..may i suggest the following books...

of those we loved..a fantastic acount of the life of a PBI in Kitcheners Army and his subsequent involvement in the Somme Battles,Promotion,Battle for Kemmel,written in plain soldiers prose..i particularly find this book will make the reader refer to it again and again..my God how did these Men on both sides see it through.

my next suggestion would be..The Bells of Hell go Ting a Ling a Ling.

Some desperate Glory

Soldier From the wars returning

Her Privates we

Undertones of war

the Machine Gunner

With Machine Gun to Cambrai

I love these books as they strip away all the trappings of Glorious War and simply tell the stories of Men who where caught up in the Chaos of Warfare...Warm Regards....Poor Bloody Infanteer.

[Desmond7]

I'm with War Letters to a Wife/Feilding. Awesome.

[PBI]

Forgot to mention Somme Harvest and Storm of Steel.I Also have in my Possession a Diary by A.E.Broughton DCM who was one of the Youngest RSMs in the British Army and served in 16th RB and this brief A4 sheet covers his Battles at Guillemont,and after that Paschendaele,and Cambrai,where he was shot at point blank range and left to die on the Battlefield,he recovered and was repatriated and was killed in a tragic accident at the Vickers Factory and lies in Darnell Cemetery Birmingham.

[AndyMacdonald]

Interesting topic!

I believe the best is All Quiet on the Western Front, but there are other pretenders to the proverbial throne. Why do I believe this book is best? Well, it's fluidly written, makes points succinctly and captures the futility of it all. While Remarque is moved to make some points that seem exaggerated, the overall imagery and themes he gives are quite believable. Having said that, many veteran novels (not including memoirs, narratives etc) are of a high standard. Novels written by non veterans don't impress me one bit. On that note, I've purged my shelves of Bird Song but it seems every Christmas or birthday someone gives me a copy. Dammit! Frankly, I think it's the worst book I've ever read (or tried to) and send every copy to the tip. By the way, Remarque's writing style is beautiful in its simplicity. It's timeless and that's why forums such as this mention it. That's also why you'll find it in nearly every first world library on the globe, while other novels of the Great War are banished to the shadows whether deservingly or not.

Andy M

[PBI]

I was under the impression that Remarque was discovered to have somewhat embellished the Details of His Military Service in WW1,and was exposed as a bit of a fraud,so he is consigned to Book Hell along with any of the Godawful Regeneration Series,Birdsong,and any Lynn McDonald Books..I might have stirred up a Few People here by mentioning Miss M,but the fact is that much of the Material she uses in Her Books has been lifted from a 3 volume series called I WAS THERE,which is a truly Great set of vets Memoirs actually written by Men who were there.Plus in Her Book 1915..she mentions that Freyberg won His VC at Gallipoli.These little mistakes tend to run throughout her Books,another Boob that comes to mind is her picture of a Destroyed German Bunker in the Quadilateral..when in fact i was informed by my French Historian Friend that this was a destroyed Radio Station.Sorry if i have diverged somewhat,i will now get off my soap Box and leave the Building...Rant,rant,rave,rave.

[staffsreg]

'Bury him among Kings' a novel by Elleston Trevor was a good read also,and really gives you some

insight to life at home too, although from a middle to upper class one!

[AndyMacdonald]

All Quiet was a novel... not non fiction analysis or purely autio-biographical. As a novel it stands in a class of its own. Elements of it may be auto-biographical but the thrust is always fiction. Regardless of Remarque's personal circumstances and allegations levelled at him, his book is a minter. For fiction readers it remains the standard reference on the subject. That is endorsement enough. Besides, you show me a better book if you can.

Andy M

[Desmond7]

Is Thomas Kennealy still alive?

If so, and if he could do a WW1 version of 'Confederates' it would easily become the best .. I know he did 'Gossip from the Forest' but it was only 'alright'.

Confession: I hated 'All Quiet' the book AND I detested even more 'Under Fire' by Henri Barbusse (or whatever he was called).

Big plu g for 'Confederates' .. easily the best war novel I've ever read.

Des

[Guest mythago]

I would agree with Andy M that however Remarque may have embellished his war service is irrelevant to his fiction. Of course, if he had written what were supposedly 'memoirs' it would have been a completely different matter. Much like the controversy currently sweeping the American author James Frey.

It's a long time since I read AQWF, but I recently read The Way Back and thoroughly enjoyed it. I like Remarque's style. However, I think The Middle Part of Fortune/Her Privates We is a superbly written piece of work on any assessment, and for me has to be the number one novel of the Great War.

Cas

[withcall]

Here's my short list:

1. 'Covenant With Death' (John Harris) The grand-daddy of all Great War books. The final paragraphs are almost unreadably poignant. It has the best last line of any book , let alone a war novel "Two years in the making. Ten minutes in the destroying. That was our history"

2 'Birdsong' (Sebastian Faulks) The passages where the tunneller gets a succession of ever-more gloomy letters from his wife about the declining health of their young son is truly heartbreaking.

3. 'The Ghost Road' (Pat Barker) Bitter and sometimes not for the squeamish, but an account of soldiers and the civilian world which shows real insight

4. 'The Wood Beyond' (Reginald Hill) A Dalziel and Pascoe novel which shows good historical knowledge and an awareness of the powerful resonance which the Great War still has on our modern world.

5. 'The Poppy Factory' (William Fairchild) Again, another book which reveals the power the Great War has had over society and convention during the last 80-90 years.

Finally, by no means a novel, but in my mind the most perceptive book ever written on the Great War and its impact - 'The Great War and Modern Memory (Paul Fussel) Probably will have WFA members reaching for the sharpened stake, the hammer and the garlic, but hey-ho!!

[Paul Hederer]

I was under the impression that Remarque was discovered to have somewhat embellished the Details of His Military Service in WW1,and was exposed as a bit of a fraud,so he is consigned to Book Hell along with any of the Godawful Regeneration Series,Birdsong,and any Lynn McDonald Books..I might have stirred up a Few People here by mentioning Miss M,but the fact is that much of the Material she uses in Her Books has been lifted from a 3 volume series called I WAS THERE,which is a truly Great set of vets Memoirs actually written by Men who were there.Plus in Her Book 1915..she mentions that Freyberg won His VC at Gallipoli.These little mistakes tend to run throughout her Books,another Boob that comes to mind is her picture of a Destroyed German Bunker in the Quadilateral..when in fact i was informed by my French Historian Friend that this was a destroyed Radio Station.Sorry if i have diverged somewhat,i will now get off my soap Box and leave the Building...Rant,rant,rave,rave.

I guess we better throw "The Red Badge of Courage," "A Farewell To Arms," and "The Forgotten Soldier," on the scrap heap as well. All three written by authors who either didn't serve, or embellished their war records.

Seems that perhaps non-soldiers, or tale-telling ex-soldiers write the best war novels

Paul

[PBI]

re the forgotten soldier,are we talking about the Guy Sayer Book ?,if we are then i seem to recall that he served on the Eastern Front in WW2.The other two Books i have scanned,but how can anyone who has not personally experienced the abject terror and violence of Modern Combat possibly have ANY idea as to what their fictional charachters were supposed to be feeling ???.

[F.Vaudour]

Hello,

> I'm curious what the members here feel is the best novel to come out of the Great War.

For me, the best is

Wooden Crosses (Les Croix de Bois in French)

By Roland Dorgeles

Her Privates We (Nous étions des hommes in french, prefaced by William Boyd)

by Manning

Storm Of Steel

Ernst Junger

and not in the best but humorous :

Silence of Colonel Bramble

Andre Maurois

François

[Paul Hederer]

re the forgotten soldier,are we talking about the Guy Sayer Book ?,if we are then i seem to recall that he served on the Eastern Front in WW2.The other two Books i have scanned,but how can anyone who has not personally experienced the abject terror and violence of Modern Combat possibly have ANY idea as to what their fictional charachters were supposed to be feeling ???.

You'd have to read the books yourself and make your own decision. "The Red Badge of Courage," is considered a classic, and Crane wrote it with reference to works of history he had read, and Tolstoy. It's an awesome work of fiction and well worth a read.

Here is an snip from something I found on "The Red Badge of Courage,"

"The Red Badge of Courage" is a subtle impressionistic study of a young soldier trying to find reality amid the conflict of fierce warfare. The book's hero, Henry Fleming, survives his own fear, cowardice, and vainglory and goes on to discover courage, humility, and perhaps wisdom in the confused combat of an unnamed Civil War battle. Crane, who had as yet seen no war, was widely praised by veterans for his uncanny power to imagine and reproduce the sense of actual combat.

Guy Sajer's war record is very suspect. There are even people who think the book was written by more than one person. Don't get me wrong, I've read "Forgotten Soldier..." more than once, and it's powerful stuff, but some of the details he includes are just plain wrong.

Does the fact that Sajer makes mistakes about such fundamental things as his uniform, or the words of popular German march songs detract from his work as a whole? I'd say not in the least.

Who can say what the characters are supposed to feel? Everyone is different, combat is a very personal and unique experience, and there is no formula that says everyone will respond the same to the stimulus.

It's all a matter of communication-- good evocative writing.

Can someone who hasn't experienced the exact experiences he/she is relating do it in a powerful and deep fashion? Absolutely yes.

"All's Quiet On The Western Front," is arguably the best novel of the great war, or let's say it is regarded as such by a large number of people. Remarque's time at he front was limited, and he even got into trouble with the authorities after the war for appearing in public wearing an officer's uniform.

What strikes me about the episode with the uniform is that Hemingway did almost the same thing, appearing in public in a tailor-made "arditi," uniform--how similiar the episodes are!

It would seem looking at war and fiction, that a strong case can be made for literary ability over first-hand experience.

Paul

[Ozzie]

I have been following this thread with trepidition. But the last post by Paul gives me hope. Not that what I am working on will ever meet this forums expectations, but I will finish it. After that, well, who knows?

Cheers

Kim

[PBI]

As many ww1 and ww2 vets have often commented,"If you were not there,you could not possibly undestand what it was like".I rest my case.

[AndyMacdonald]

I hate to be picky, but... We need to differentiate between fiction and non fiction works. The two are being intermixed, which really runs against the thread's purpose.

Andy M

[Ozzie]

Here's a bit of quizz. Which is real and which is fiction?

Letters from the War.

No.1

I was lying down in a bit of a hole with my head a bit lower than my body. The bullets were singing very close to my ears, when one took the rim off my cap and caught my back. It was just as well I had my head a bit lower than my body or it might have put a hole through it. I have got quite used to hearing the bullets flying about me now. Dead men are quite a common sight. When I was getting back to get my wound dressed I had to crawl over a dead man in a trench. Another time, in digging a trench in the firing line, I put my pick into the leg of a dead man; he was lying on the surface of the ground with the dirt thrown over him. This would not appear a very nice thing for me to do, but I am quite used to seeing dead men; not that I take no notice of it.

No.2

The morning we arrived the fight for Hill 60 was going on. There were thousands of bombs thrown and we could hear it till the early hours of the morning. The place reminds me of a rabbit warren. Along the hillside are all these dugouts made out of corrugated iron and timber supports but higher up, it’s just a hole in the dirt. The trenches are terrible, very narrow and dead bodies come through every now and then. There are corpses all over no-mans land and the stench must have been terrible when the weather was hotter. It is getting colder of a night now that it is Autumn, but the days are still warm.

What is your choice and why.

Cheers

Kim

[PBI]

I totally agree with you on that account.My Main point is that i think that many of the non fiction books were written by people who would have only a limited knowledge or none at all about the emotions and conditons that they were attempting to portray so why attempt to write about emotions and sight and sounds if they have not experienced them first Hand ?.This thread can and will rumble on for ages.I am off to the Pub to clear my Head.