1st Bn Cheshire Regiment 1914

[Nick1914]

Dear All, I'm having a few problems tracking down some 1st Cheshire regiment casualties from 1914. Without initials or forenames using the medal roll is not easy. Here's what I have. In particular I suspect that quite a few of these 2nd Lts were commissioned from the ranks in October 1914 given the battalion's very heavy losses early in the campaign:

2nd Lt L Fairweather - Regular - comm'd June '14 - can't find route as didn't come up on a search of the Sandhurst site - PoW - Action at Elouges - 24th Aug '14

2nd Lt J S Jacobs - Special Reserve(SR) - comm'd 1912 - casualty as above

2nd Lt W L Stewart - SR - comm'd 1913 - casualty as above

Captain S Butterworth - SR - PoW - Festubert - 13th Oct '14

Lt H N Harrington - SR - comm'd 1911 - PoW/wounded Festubert as above

2nd Lt W Thomas - ?? - comm & when? - PoW as above

2nd Lt E Andrews - comm & when? - wounded Violaines 19th Oct '14

2nd Lt ?? Woodhead - comm & when? - wounded Pont Logy 28th Oct '14

2nd Lt E G Carr - comm & when? - wounded Herenthage Wood/Ypres 14th Nov '14

Sorry for such a long list but with a few "clues" I can often fill in alot more info but anything on general bio age/schools etc also most welcome!

Thanks in anticipation. Nick

[johnboy]

Captain S Butterworth is reported as arriving 24th September.

http://grandadswar.mrallsophistory.com/sept_diary.html

[Manxman5]

I have the History of the Cheshire regiment in the Great war on my desk right now if you would like me to have a search?

I have found;

2nd Lt E Andrews: In the book it mentions that 2nd Lt E Andrews is wounded along with Sidebotham and Napier and 20 other men while 9 men were killed while holding the line at the Violaines road on the 19th Oct 1914, Andrews was awarded the Military Medal for this.

Captain S Butterworth: 12th October 1914 During the occupation of outposts of the La Bassee canal captain butterworth and six NCO's and men were reported missing.

[clk]

Hi Nick,

Looking at the MICs (searched by surname only, with keyword = "Cheshire"), I think that I've got a few of the names.

Butterworth - Stanley. Card refers to Exonerated Officers List B

Jacobs - is probably "G.S" rather than "J.S". The card doesn't expand

Stewart - William Lee. Card refers to Exonerated Officers List 27

Harrington - Henry Nazeby. Card refers to Exonerated Officers List M

Woodhead - Arnold Hugh. Card notes wounded on 28.10.14

Carr - Edward Gamble

Regards

Chris

[Guest]

Dear All, I'm having a few problems tracking down some 1st Cheshire regiment casualties from 1914. Without initials or forenames using the medal roll is not easy. Here's what I have. In particular I suspect that quite a few of these 2nd Lts were commissioned from the ranks in October 1914 given the battalion's very heavy losses early in the campaign:

2nd Lt L Fairweather - Regular - comm'd June '14 - can't find route as didn't come up on a search of the Sandhurst site - PoW - Action at Elouges - 24th Aug '14 promoted 18th Nov 1914. No mention in war diary. Medal roll records disembarking 18th Aug 14.

2nd Lt J S Jacobs - Special Reserve(SR) - comm'd 1912 - casualty as above comm 10th Feb 1912. under 'attached' to regular battalions from SR

2nd Lt W L Stewart - SR - comm'd 1913 - casualty as above originally Cheshire Regiment no dates.Shown under 'attached' to 3rd SR Battalion.

Captain S Butterworth - SR - PoW - Festubert - 13th Oct '14 promoted 24th May 1913. 3rd SR Battalion. War diary records arriving 24th Sep and MIA on 12th Oct 14.

Lt H N Harrington - SR - comm'd 1911 - PoW/wounded Festubert as above promoted 28th Jun 1913 3rd SR Battalion. War diary records as a casualty on 13th Oct 14

2nd Lt W Thomas - ?? - comm & when? - PoW as above comm 15th Aug 14. 3rd SR Battalion. War dairy records arriving on 16th Sep and casualty on 13th Oct 14

2nd Lt E Andrews - comm & when? - wounded Violaines 19th Oct '14 Reserve of Officers comm 26th AIg 14. Army List has E Andrew not E Andrews. 3rd SR Battalion. War dairy records as casualty on 19th Oct 14

2nd Lt ?? Woodhead - comm & when? - wounded Pont Logy 28th Oct '14 A H Woodhead 3rd SR Battalion comm 13th Aug 1914. War diary records arriving on 16th Oct with large draft and other officers.

2nd Lt E G Carr - comm & when? - wounded Herenthage Wood/Ypres 14th Nov '14 comm 10th Aug 1914. 3rd SR Battalion. War diary records arriving on 16th Oct (ditto) and wounded on 14th Nov 14.

Comments in blue gleaned from War Diary and Army List. Nothing on any in Bond of Sacrifice Vol I or Vol II so presumably survived to Jun 1915. MG

[Nick1914]

Dear All, please forgive not naming everyone but be assured I've read all contributions. The more one digs the more it seems to throw up! My first reaction is I've never come across a battalion with so many Special Reserve{and new) commissions.....partly reflects I suspect the 18 officer casualties at Elouges on 24th Aug of which 15/18 were PoWs including many wounded and 3 kia.

Your references to exonerated lists are helpful as goes a good way to confirming PoW status.

With regard to E Andrews Harts 1914 Army List does spell with an s. Interesting he is classified as a "Reserve of Officers" but a little unusually, to my experience, as a very junior 2nd Lt in the OTC with straight commissioning to the Special Reserve at wars outbreak. William Thomas may be a similar commission. However, no record of junior or senior OTC mentioned.

Finally Henry Nazeby Harrington - a solicitor- later becomes a Sir.

E Andrew(s) is mentioned as wounded alongside Sidebotham and Napier on 19th Oct. Are these officers? I can find a Lt M A Napier?(2nd Bn) in the Army List but nothing on Sidebotham.....can you dig up any more details?

Again many thanks......still lots of gaps if anyone reading after work! Best Nick

[Guest]

Dear All, please forgive not naming everyone but be assured I've read all contributions. The more one digs the more it seems to throw up! My first reaction is I've never come across a battalion with so many Special Reserve{and new) commissions.....partly reflects I suspect the 18 officer casualties at Elouges on 24th Aug of which 15/18 were PoWs including many wounded and 3 kia.

Your references to exonerated lists are helpful as goes a good way to confirming PoW status.

With regard to E Andrews Harts 1914 Army List does spell with an s. Interesting he is classified as a "Reserve of Officers" but a little unusually, to my experience, as a very junior 2nd Lt in the OTC with straight commissioning to the Special Reserve at wars outbreak. William Thomas may be a similar commission. However, no record of junior or senior OTC mentioned. 1914 Star medal Roll shows OTC and also shows Andrew not Andrews.

Finally Henry Nazeby Harrington - a solicitor- later becomes a Sir.

E Andrew(s) is mentioned as wounded alongside Sidebotham and Napier on 19th Oct. Are these officers? I can find a Lt M A Napier?(2nd Bn) in the Army List but nothing on Sidebotham.....can you dig up any more details?

Again many thanks......still lots of gaps if anyone reading after work! Best Nick

The number of SR men is very typical for a battalion in 1914. Regular battalions in the UK typically required five or six Officers to come up to War Establishment. Infantry Officer casualty ratios for August disembarkations were typically over 95% meaning the limited pool of Regular Officers was depleted within weeks. The OH Vol I claimed barely one officer per battalion of the originals remained at the end of Dec 1914.This is a battalion that was being commanded by a Lieutenant only two months after disembarking. At least 21 of the original 27 Officers were battle casualties in 1914 and 22 of the 30 reinforcements became battle casualties. 43 out of 57 or 75%. Hundreds of SR officers served and died in 1914-15. The war diaries in 1914 and 1915 often made point of identifying the SR suffix by way of differentiating the relative experience of the surviving officers.

2 Lt J O SIDEBOTHAM comm 12th Aug 14. Note there was also a E M SIDEBOTHAM comm 16th Dec 14 (too late for this date)

2 Lt A J R NAPIER comm 10th Aug 1914. Disembarked 25th Sep 1914 (1914 Star Medal Roll)

Both Temporary Lts as at 16th Nov 1914 and both annotated as being with the 1st Battalion.

Source: May 1915 Army List.

Edited: Temporary Lt for 2 Lt

[Manxman5]

Yes, Andrews, Sidebotham and Napier are all officers all are 2nd Lieutenants

Gerald Sidebotham is said to have been a student in 1910 and was at Manchester University and part of the Officer Training Corps.

Sourced from forces war records and the history of the Cheshire regiment in the great war

[Nick1914]

Thanks again Martin. An additional Q! Both Sidebotham & Napier were Gentlemen Cadets(Sandhurst) when commissioned. Even though they were commissioned into the Regular Forces(Army List 1914 Promotions page 28) were all such appointments at this time Temporary ones?

Nick

[Guest]

Thanks again Martin. An additional Q! Both Sidebotham & Napier were Gentlemen Cadets(Sandhurst) when commissioned. Even though they were commissioned into the Regular Forces(Army List 1914 Promotions page 28) were all such appointments at this time Temporary ones?

Nick

Apologies. I should have said temporary Lieutenant not 2nd Lieutenant, (now amended) i.e. their promotions to Lt were temporary from that date. MG

[Perth Digger]

Very late on this and probably of little interest now, but I've just come across the MIC for Fairweather. He was Ian, not L....  The Ancestry reference to the MIC is garbled as 1st Battalion Oreshire Regiment.

Mike