On a Charge

[Guest LauraEJT]

Please forgive my lamentable ignorance.....!

I thought I knew a bit about the Great War until I found this site and now realise that I KNOW NOTHING compared to others-please believe that I am a) enthusiastic & ask in total humility!

According to my dear late grandmother,my dear late grandfather (a private in the ASC who was a driver-a chaffeur/mechanic before & after the war he apparently pulled the big guns into position) spent a fair proportion of his military career "on a charge".I'm not sure what one had to do to achieve this dubious distinction-presumably drunkeness (not impossible in this case) He didn't go AWOL or do anything too serious I think,but my Nans dark mumblings never included details,& I wondered what else men could get "done" for,& what the punsihments were.I suppose I should have asked while she was still around,but you know what you're like when you're young...

Any information would be appreciated!

Thanks,Laura

[steve chilton]

Hi Laura,

welcome to the forum. As for your question, well, you can get on a charge for anything, I know I did............. In my day it was section 69 of the Army Act 1955, cant remember the exact wording but it said roughly "Behaving in an un-soldierlike manner", you can fit most things into that, again, I know I did when I got a bit of power and people upset me.......

Regards

Steve Chilton

[Captain Dave]

As mentioned previously, charges could fit anything in the Army Regulations, but they were normally for breaches of Kings Regulations and Routine Orders issued out by units on active (and non) active service.

There is a popular conception that charges were handed about willy nilly. However they had to be heard by the OC (Officer Commanding) to decide weather or not they warranted punishment, or, if they should be handed up to the CO to a Court Martial if the charge was serious enough.

Any OC, (or officer with the powers of a subordinate commander )who has to hear the charge also has to organise the time and place for the hearing, ensure the paperwork is correct, investigate and then either dispose of, award punishment or pass the charge on. Basicaly it's administrative time that can be spent better somewhere else.

Also any overzealous NCO who feels the need to charge for nebulous crud at the drop of a hat is soon seen by his superiours for what he is, a pedantic little ****** with a power complex who needs a hobby. Remmeber, any NCO can charge, but the charge has to be heard by an officer. Officers don't like being messed around by petty infringements and any decent officer would dismiss trumped up charges, then ask the NCO what he was doing to correct the behaviour of the master criminal in his midst.

For a soldier to spend 'most of his time' on a charge implys he was either a terrible soldier who did not take well to military discipline. (soldiers in these situations were often transfered to dirty nasty jobs) or they like to embelish their war service for civillian ears. Chances are he probably did get charged a few times, (check his records if poss) and his OC saw him, awarded extra dutys with a wave of his hand and he continued on with his war. Possibly he was not the criminal he likes to make out.

[Guest LauraEJT]

Hi Steve,

Thanks for that! I can unfortunately easily believe that Grampy occasionally acted "in an unsoldierlike manner"especially as he was less than enthusiastic about the whole thing from beginning.

I smiled at your recollections as my husbands exwifes husband(now a good friend) spent his quite distinguished career in 2 Para being bumped from sergeant to corporal and back again.I think he sees it as "the mark of a good soldier" quote unquote and perhaps it was ever thus...

Regards,Laura

[Guest LauraEJT]

Thanks Captain Dave!

I don't think my grandfather did sit easily with military discipline,but his Life of (relative)Probity after the War suggests he wasn't so bad.I think he was a bit fed up with my Nan endlessly comparing him to her younger brother who got a DCM and you may be right about him trying to be more interesting in a rock n roll way!

My money is on drink & gambling but I will check his records.

Many thanks,Laura

PS He was an absolutely fantastic grandfather and would be very amused by this....

[PhilB]

The usual catch all in my day was " Conduct prejudicial to good army order and discipline" or words to that effect. That could mean anything, such as dumb insolence, haircut etc. I often wonder why there isn`t a similar law in civvy street to prevent toerags getting off on technicalities - and lawyers showing that the law is, indeed, an ass! . Phil B

[Guest LauraEJT]

That's an interesting idea Phil & I can think of many candidates for the dumb (really dumb) insolence charge!

An ex naval friend of mine would have said "I don't like the cut of his jib" & that maybe should be enough !

Thanks,Laura

[Essexboy68]

Yes, Section 69 of the Army, Navy or Air Force Act 1955, does say "Conduct prejudical to good order & Air Force (in my case, as an Airman) discipline", & it is a catch all to ensure the charge sticks, speaking as one who "tapped the boards" a couple of times. I understand my grandfather was charged in Italy during Worls War 2 for being a bit too enthusiastic in celebrating his birthday!

Cheers

Mark