assafx Posted 13 May , 2015 Share Posted 13 May , 2015 Hello, This cartridge was found on an excavation together with 10 WWI cartridges and bullets. As far as i know, SBP is Sellier & Bellot. My problem is the lack of date on the headstamp, was it in use during WWI ? Thank You Assaf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoppage Drill Posted 13 May , 2015 Share Posted 13 May , 2015 I am pretty sure that the two identical marks are "neroxin" symbols, indicating the use of this non-corrosive compound in the primer. If so, this only started to be used by SBP (Sellier & Bellot, Prague) from the mid 1930s. Can you post a pic of the cartridge from the side ? Is it 7.65 Browning, or 7.65 Parabellum ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikB Posted 13 May , 2015 Share Posted 13 May , 2015 Can you post a pic of the cartridge from the side ? Is it 7.65 Browning, or 7.65 Parabellum ?From the relative sizes of primer and casehead, as well as the rim chamfer, it looks very much like 7,65 Browning/32 ACP. Regards, MikB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assafx Posted 13 May , 2015 Author Share Posted 13 May , 2015 Tomorrow I will try to sneak to the studio again and photograph it from its side. from what i remember it looks more like the browning. Assaf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikB Posted 13 May , 2015 Share Posted 13 May , 2015 It'd be bottlenecked if it were Parabellum. Whether or not it's WW1, I'd guess it's tens or maybe hundreds of times more likely to be Browning, in view of the quantities of pistols of that calibre in circulation. There's a lot of clearance between the firing pin and its hole in the breechface as well, giving rise to that cratering around the indentation - and that's also far more likely in a pocket pistol in the Browning calibre - probably a cheap one - than in a Luger. Regards, MikB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radlad Posted 14 May , 2015 Share Posted 14 May , 2015 I think that headstamp dates it to post 1940. Probably part of the large contracts that the company had with Israel in 1948 ( the Israelis were desperate for ammunition at that time and bought where they could) . The fact that some WW1" ammunition was found near the same place is not indicative of WW1 use as it could well have been sourced from old stock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assafx Posted 14 May , 2015 Author Share Posted 14 May , 2015 I think that headstamp dates it to post 1940. Probably part of the large contracts that the company had with Israel in 1948 ( the Israelis were desperate for ammunition at that time and bought where they could) . The fact that some WW1" ammunition was found near the same place is not indicative of WW1 use as it could well have been sourced from old stock. This excavation was done In Beer Sheva. The WWI cartridges comes from one area and the yield is what i learned to expect in my research. There are spent cartridges together with looted ones, meaning primers and powder were removed from live rounds. this was done by the locals to use in their old guns. The only exception in this WWI assemblage is this pistol cartridge. The other area had a few cartridges from 1948 including remains of an iron cartridge, sadly without his bottom. and it included british 0.303 ammunition and one Czechoslovakian made cartridge fired by a besa machine gun. here's the side view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoppage Drill Posted 14 May , 2015 Share Posted 14 May , 2015 7.65 x 17, aka 7.65 Browning, aka .32 ACP for sure, and as per my post #2, no earlier than the 1930s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assafx Posted 14 May , 2015 Author Share Posted 14 May , 2015 7.65 x 17, aka 7.65 Browning, aka .32 ACP for sure, and as per my post #2, no earlier than the 1930s. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radlad Posted 14 May , 2015 Share Posted 14 May , 2015 My opinion for what it's worth. Brass case, non corrosive priming, no date ( indicating civilian production) . Stoppage Drill is mainly correct but I feel the case is post WwII. Non corrosive priming was first produced by Sellier & Bellot in 1940. Nazi occupation ammunition produced by them was all steel cased . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikB Posted 14 May , 2015 Share Posted 14 May , 2015 My opinion for what it's worth. Brass case, non corrosive priming, no date ( indicating civilian production) . Stoppage Drill is mainly correct but I feel the case is post WwII. I'd agree with that. I've only memory to go on, but I think the headstamp's the same as on the S&B 7,65 I used to shoot in my Colt 1903 and Browning 1910 back in the '80s, and that was new commercial ammunition then. Presumably it's Berdan primed, with 2 flashholes? Regards, MikB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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