2nd Battalion Scots Guards

[ThirdYpres]

Greetings all --

I have been looking for information regarding my great grand uncle, Pvt. E.G. Wise 3950, of the 2nd Battalion Scots Guards for some time. Specifically the area of operation the day he was killed, Oct. 26, 1914. Just yesterday, I found a treasure trove of information on this site:

https://1914intheirownwords.wordpress.com/2014/10/01/st-vincents-war-notebook-written-by-vincent-2/

This gold mine identified the location as well as accounts from several of the officers of the events of that day in the area of Kruiseke, near Ypres. There are descriptions of how the companies were deployed on the east side of the town, as well as accounts of the action and the events leading up being taken prisoner. It seems certain that a member of 2nd Battalion killed on this day was in the area immediately E/SE of Kruiseke.

My question for the knowledgeable members of GWF is how can I tell which company my uncle was with? Plus, once identified, are there any sources of additional information regarding the actions and movement of that company on and the days leading up to Oct. 26?

Thank you in advance for any responses!

[neverforget]

Incredible stuff! Thanks for posting.

Sorry I can`t help with your enquiry. I`ve been researching three of my relatives for years now, and haven`t been able to find which company either of them were in. Good luck with your search.

[clk]

Hi ThirdYpres,

Soldiers' Effects http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/60506/42511_6117462_0019-00274/785883?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3dUKArmyRegistersEffects%26rank%3d1%26new%3d1%26so%3d3%26MSAV%3d1%26gss%3dms_r_db%26gsfn_x%3dXO%26gsln%3dwise%26gsln_x%3dXO%26dbOnly%3d_F00061C3%257c_F00061C3_x%26dbOnly%3d_F8007A65%257c_F8007A65_x%26_F8007A65%3d3950%26_F8007A65_x%3d1%26uidh%3drc2&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults records Edward George Wise (3950) death at what I think reads Gheluvelt ?? (but transcribed by Ancestry as "Gheliwelt") with a date of 29th October 1914.

http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=15&lat=50.83385&lon=2.99391&layers=101464642

Gheluvelt, on 29th October would seem to fit with the war diary transcript you found on https://1914intheiro...n-by-vincent-2/ Begs the question though that whether he was wounded at an earlier date and died on that date, or if he received a wound (possibly even from "friendly fire") on that date and died.

Regards

Chris

EDIT: It also shows that he was born in London; enlisted 17.06.01; and was a labourer when he enlisted

EDIT2: There is a will available for download (£10) https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/Wills?Surname=wise&SurnameGrants=wise&YearOfDeath=1914&YearOfDeathGrants=1914&IsGrantSearch=False&IsCalendarSearch=False#soldiers It probably won't contain that much info, but a covering sheet would probably name the place of death, and clarify the discrepancy in the dates.

[draperju]

There is a history of the Scots Guards in the Great war available from Naval and Military Press

draperju

[ThirdYpres]

Incredible stuff! Thanks for posting.

Sorry I can`t help with your enquiry. I`ve been researching three of my rerlatives for years now, and haven`t been able to find which company either of them were in. Good luck with your search.

Oh my -- that is grim news indeed! Well I hope you end up having some luck in your search. Thank you for your response!

Hi ThirdYpres,

Soldiers' Effects http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/60506/42511_6117462_0019-00274/785883?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3dUKArmyRegistersEffects%26rank%3d1%26new%3d1%26so%3d3%26MSAV%3d1%26gss%3dms_r_db%26gsfn_x%3dXO%26gsln%3dwise%26gsln_x%3dXO%26dbOnly%3d_F00061C3%257c_F00061C3_x%26dbOnly%3d_F8007A65%257c_F8007A65_x%26_F8007A65%3d3950%26_F8007A65_x%3d1%26uidh%3drc2&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults records Edward George Wise (3950) death at what I think reads Gheluvelt ?? (but transcribed by Ancestry as "Gheliwelt") with a date of 29th October 1914.

http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=15&lat=50.83385&lon=2.99391&layers=101464642

Gheluvelt, on 29th October would seem to fit with the war diary transcript you found on https://1914intheiro...n-by-vincent-2/ Begs the question though that whether he was wounded at an earlier date and died on that date, or if he received a wound (possibly even from "friendly fire") on that date and died.

Regards

Chris

EDIT: It also shows that he was born in London; enlisted 17.06.01; and was a labourer when he enlisted

EDIT2: There is a will available for download (£10) https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/Wills?Surname=wise&SurnameGrants=wise&YearOfDeath=1914&YearOfDeathGrants=1914&IsGrantSearch=False&IsCalendarSearch=False#soldiers It probably won't contain that much info, but a covering sheet would probably name the place of death, and clarify the discrepancy in the dates.

Ahhhh -- the plot ever thickens! Thank you so much for your post -- I used the CWCG archives for the date of death, and hand never thought to even check further?!? I, too, found some info from his earlier life on this site: http://www.btphg.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/BTPHG-WW1-RoH-Bio-Info-Jan-2014-RS-R.pdf which indicates he was a policeman for the railroad. This site also supports Oct 26 as the date of death, citing CWCG and the Naval and Military Press publications.

I have ordered the will (thank you for that lead!). The site says it may be up to 10 days to upload the info, but I'll let you know what I've found. Again, thank you for your help!

There is a history of the Scots Guards in the Great war available from Naval and Military Press

draperju

Good call! I'll be ordering this as well as checking out this Soldiers Died in the Great War database © Naval and Military Press Ltd 2010 Thank you for your suggestion!

To all: I can't tell you how thankful I am for your help. I am very new at this, and sometimes feel fairly lost. I only found my "lost" uncle on my first tearful visit to the Menin Gate in the summer of 2013. Having no known relative in the Great War, I adopted the first Wise I found, Edward George Wise, on Panel 11. I will have the honor of taking my Dad to the Salient this April. We will be there for the centenary of the start of 2nd Ypres as well as ANZAC Day. In addition, our primary goal is to trace the steps of the 2nd Battalion Scots Guards from their arrival in the Salient to the place where Edward fell (or as close as I can divine, anyway!). All of your responses are greatly appreciated in helping us reach that goal.

We will remember them.

Brent Wise

Dallas, TX

[Derek Black]

SNWM entry also has the 26th. Born Twickenham, died of wounds.

Derek.

[TwoEssGee]

Thanks so much for posting this.

Great to read such detailed accounts, and to see some wonderful photographs of the men of my old Battalion including the Sergeant Major, Jimmy Moncur.

Soory I can't help you identify which Company your Great Grand Uncle served with.

[ThirdYpres]

SNWM entry also has the 26th. Born Twickenham, died of wounds.

Derek.

Thanks Derek -- another great site! I ordered the Roll of Honour Extract and Certificate of Casualty from them.

Thanks so much for posting this.

Great to read such detailed accounts, and to see some wonderful photographs of the men of my old Battalion including the Sergeant Major, Jimmy Moncur.

Soory I can't help you identify which Company your Great Grand Uncle served with.

Indeed -- what a wealth of information. On our trip next month, my Dad and I are going to start out at Zeebruge, have a short visit in every town Lt. Saumarez mentions on their way to the Salient. We will (hopefully) finish up overlooking the very fields in which he fell. From this diary, I've got a good idea where each company of the 2nd Battalion was positioned on the 26th of Oct., so we are doing pretty good already. If I happen to figure out which company specifically will be icing on the cake! Thank you for your post.