Unidentified armed trawler discovered.

[Guest belgrano]

Hi I hope the experienced readers here can help us.

I am a technical diver and recently we have found a wreck that we cannot yet identify. It was found by chance, and does not appear on any charts yet. It appears to be a armed trawler which we think may have been sunk in the first world war. Just aft of the bow there is a huge rent as if the ship was struck by something like a large mine. She sits upright, but listing to the port side, where the front side has spilled out into a debris field. The gun is missing.. however due to the awful visibility of just over a mtr recently we have not be able to conduct a perimeter search to locate it. The bell is also missing, however what we have found makes us pretty confident that the wreck has never been found since it sank.

We have now reported the wreck to the receiver of wrecks, however the exact location is still guarded, however its located no more than 15 miles from Swanage, English channel.

The wreck itself is steel hulled and estimated to be 125 feet long by about 20-25 ft across. It has a old trawler type stern (large overhang), and has a 4 bladed steel prop about 5 feet across.

The bow has a hause pipe with a large admiralty anchor which has fallen but of about 6 feet.

The main winch which is pretty large has 4 capstans and 2 drums. The engine as far as we can make out is a triple expansion stm engine.

On the main steel deck were found a row of brass ringed portholes about 6 inches across with like a bulls eye type glass.. the super structure is gone but appears to have been wood construction. (portholes were set into wood).

We also found a flare gun on the main steel deck, which appears to have been discarded after discharge.

I found a open rack of shells within the debris field close the the destroyed shell plate. They were live, but have splits so the insides are soaked. I have cleaned off the end and revealed the following letters.

Shell case exact size 3" by 12". markings CFF- which is cordite 2nd charge, and A in a circle which I believe is case re-annealled. However also have 11N96.with a Z below the N, and an arrow pointing up above it. Also on the shell is the number 1 in a circle and a strange motif which is a N followed by a capital K backwards with two lines through them, both encased in what looks like a can shape. Also on shell is number A3.

Can we identify the gun..as it could lead to the the wreck. We have also some go-pro film, but it is shot is awful viz.

Really appreciate any help anyone can offer.

private e-mail alanclark_1@hotmail.com

[ss002d6252]

Is this diagram any good ? -

Craig

[johnboy]

It seems that if a submarine was involved a few ships could have been lost in that area over a period of a few days. Most seem to have been captured and then sunk.

Are there other wrecks in the area that are reported as having been mined?

http://www.naval-history.net/WW1LossesBrFV1914-16.htm

[johnmelling1979]

Could it be a WW2 trawler , as an example T106 HMS Coverley, , a dance class boat, armed with guns?

Something like this ... as an example ?

[ph0ebus]

Any chance for any photos? If we can determine the age of the shell casings that might aid with identification.

You may want to also cross post this in uboat.net, if you haven't already.

There are a few people who may be quite helpful in this effort...if they don't appear shortly I will alert them to this thread.

Daniel

[jp1885]

Might also be worth asking on the Ship's Nostalgia forum (http://www.shipsnostalgia.com/forum.php) if you haven't already done so.

[johnmelling1979]

The Round Table class trawlers were 125 ft built in 1941/42 ??? something of that size if you google it,

as for the shell how about Type 41 3-inch (7.62 cm) 40 calibre gun used from 1894 to 1945, a MARK 5 version used for shore battery , and on decks of trawlers, destroyers

positioned on the front of the vessel

[Guest belgrano]

Great reply s, that you chaps please keep them coming.

Certainly lots of information to think about. I'll post a shot of the shell casing, its still mostly covered in barnacles, but the end has been cleaned off. Also lifted off a couple of old oil lamps, but as you know any ship still floating and any gun that fired would have been pressed into service in the second world war.

This was the first mention about this wreck today, it has not been posted anywhere until now. I waited until we had contacted the receiver of wrecks, and also asked the gentleman who found the wreck if he minded.

Its fairly difficult getting even a clear picture of the wreck in your mind when the viability is barely a meter and utterly zero light. Cant stay that long on her either as it racks up some serious deco time fairly rapidly. There is a great pile of tangled lobster pots in the debris field where a whole string has become entangled..one is stuffed full of crabs..they act like black holes of death for many years after being lost..I'll try to cut it open next time to let them out. Where the shells were located is stuffed full of wildlife, with a huge conger right by my arm as I had to use a lump hammer to ease one of the shells out for the coral type growth that covers everything. There were plenty of plate sized crabs everywhere as well as a old looking large lobster. We expect to dive on her very soon, however I fear this will be the last time this season as the autumn and winter storms close in. I will report what we find. Also see about downloading the recorded footage as it can be much easier to view when your not task loaded with 3 cylinders and loads of kit, or feeling the effects of "the raptures of the deeps".

[trajan]

... I had to use a lump hammer to ease one of the shells out for the coral type growth that covers everything...

Happy diving, but if you mean gun shells and not sea shells - don't bang them at all if you can help it!

[rolt968]

All the Round Tables survived WW2.

A lot of WW1 RN standard trawlers together with a vast number of commercial trawlers were requisitioned in WW2.

The WW1 Mersey class were 125 feet long. The Merseys had a long overhanging stern which the trawlers of 1930s and 1940s RN design tended not to. Unfortunately there would have been plenty of requisitioned commercial trawlers from both wars with long overhangs.

R.

[johnboy]

Maybe if the manufacturers plate is still on the boiler or engine that might help.

If one of Daniels pals has access to U-boat logs one may give a name. It would be a very long shot though without having a time period.

[ph0ebus]

I am assuming the HMS Warwick Deeping wreck has been ruled out?