help please with a document ramc

[steph9755]

Hi I'm new to family tree and the military, I was wondering if anyone would be willing to look up my gr8 grandfather's service records and perhaps help explain them a little better? My grandfather was called Frederick William Hobbs born 1888 in Camberwell. He married Ethel white in London. His father was called William f Hobbs. He was in the RAMC as a field ambulance person I think. His number is 88839 I think. Any help would be very much grateful as in struggling with this a little. Many thanks again steph

[TEW]

There is a Medal Index Card to 88839 Frederick William Hobbs of the RAMC and he is listed on the Silver War Badge roll. BUT, his age is wrong. 88839 Hobbs was discharged 'sick' in May 1919 aged 25y & 5mths, which makes him born about 1893/4, unlikey to pretend to be 5 years younger than he was.

The Fred Hobbs that married Ethel White seems to have been born in 1888/9 and claimed to be 22 when 88839 Hobbs would have been 18. Are you sure these are not 2 different people?? He may of course made himself older at his wedding.

There are 10 service records to the name Frederick William Hobbs, none in RAMC but he may have joined up into another unit.

There are 4 pension records to the name Frederick William Hobbs, again none in the RAMC.

I'd suggest going to your local library and using ancestry or findmypast, find the above records and read through for anything that tells you it's your grt grandfather.

You really need to sort out his date of birth issue, possibly 88839 Hobbs is not your grt grandfather or he fibbed when getting married or Ethel is not your grt grandmother!!!!

TEW

[steph9755]

Hi many thanks for getting back to me. Definitely the correct person you refer to. Ethel white Definitely my grandmother to. I had a copy of his papers from kew but lost them when I moved. I can't find him on ancestry but he has to b there somewhere. He served in 2nd field ambulance with ramc in salon's grease discharged. I just wonder if any of you kind people could find him so I could print them off and perhaps understand them better.Many thanks for your help I appreciate it very much steph

[John_Hartley]

Steph

If you originally found the papers at the National Archives, then they should be there on Ancestry, as the NA originals were used to digitise them. When you've tracked down whatever you can track down, this link will help you best understand what you're looking at - not least in explaining the jargon that we "old timers at this" can easily lapse into. http://www.1914-1918.net/soldiers/research.html

Good luck

John

[TEW]

You're absolutley certain the papers you had were for 88839 Frederick William Hobbs? If so it makes it a little more difficult to find him as his birth is either 1888 or 1893.

His SWB says 1893 but he may have joined originally into another unit with another number and date of birth. He may then have transferred to the RAMC during the war and that information and the 88839 will not be indexed by ancestry. You say he is there somewhere but he may be under eg 2374 Alfred Hobbs RFA. His papers (either service or pension series) may be under:

Frederick William Hobbs

Frederick W Hobbs

Frederick Hobbs

Alfred Hobbs

Alfred William Hobbs

Alfred W Hobbs

Fredk Wm Hobbs

Or even Frederick William Bobbs!!!

TEW

[TEW]

Found some complicated issues to deal with.

There is #1 Frederick William Hobbs born in Camberwell Dec 1893. This one is same age as 88839 Hobbs of RAMC on SWB roll.

And another #2 Frederick William Hobbs born in Camberwell Aug 1889. This one is same age as the one that married Ethel in 1911.

Another #3 Frederick William Hobbs is on 1911 census, born in Thornton Heath to Henry & Sarah Ann abt 1888.

#1 has parents Frederick James & Emily

#2 has parents William Frederick and Hannah

#3 as noted, Henry & Sarah Ann

So, at present it looks like to me that 88839 Frederick William Hobbs is #1 and not your grt grandfather. #2 seems to be your grt grandfather.

The papers you had were for 88839 Frederick William Hobbs?? Or might the number be different?

Kew may have found correct papers for you but due to indexing and transcribing issues they are not showing on ancestry. I've hunted for various combinations of name, spouse, parent, location, date of birth and not found any good contenders.

I did find him & Ethel on 1919 Electoral Rolls living at 114a Beaufoy Rd, Battersea.

TEW

[TEW]

Things get stranger and stranger.

Findmypast have a record for 88839 FWH, on this record his DOB is given as 1888 whereas the SWB roll works out to 1893.

One record on FMP says he was 31 when discharged which makes his DOB 1888 so why the SWB roll says 88839 Hobbs was 25y & 5m is a mystery.

Anyway, the good news is that 88839 Frederick William Hobbs' record shows his wife to be Ethel White and children Ethel Queenie, Violet Elsie and Frederick William Jnr. all born in Windsor where Fred & Ethel were living when he joined up and after his discharge.

He served in Salonika 26/12/16 to 9/4/19 with 36 General Hospital.

He had previous service with the 2nd Home Counties Field Ambulance and possibly had 2 previous 4 digit numbers.

FMP library link

TEW

[steph9755]

Many thanks for all the help, 88839 Feb definitely my grandfather I have a copy of the marriage certificate from the file. It has been confusing with two different dates but that is the same man from your kind research. Would he have been In the 2nd home countries field ambulance before the war as a full time soldier or a territorial solider? I wonder whether he was doing in battersea in 1919 as the whole family stayed in Victor to windsor for the rest of their lives ? The plot thickens lol. Many thanks again for your help I can't tell you how much I appreciate it. Because Feb is now coming alive and not just a name. Steph

[TEW]

Steph,

Hi, I spotted your post on another forum and see someone beat me to it in finding his record for you. Anyway, you now have his service record and it's quite a full record, there will be a lot you can work out about his history from the records.

It seems that he was already in the 2nd home countries field ambulance before the war, I can't remember his enlisting date from his service record, his SWB roll says 28/11/14 which coincides with the date the 2nd home countries field ambulance moved to another division and became the 82nd Field Ambulance. I think he joined the 36th Field Ambulance on 28/11/14 but that needs checking. So he did have Territorial Service before the war started.

There are many forum members here that could help with lots of detail on the RAMC, the 36th Field Ambulance, the war in Salonika and abbreviations used in his record. I would suggest doing a new post in Interpreting service records and medal index cards entitled something like 'RAMC service record help'.

Anyone want to look the records are on FMP HERE, I don't have an account.

It makes life a lot easier if you can put copies or bits of the original form with your questions. If you have trouble doing that PM me and I'll try to help with the images.

There is still a big oddity with his SWB roll entry. 88839 Hobbs was discharged in 1919, his SWB says for sickness and I think he had malaria at some point. But there is his age difference problem, why does it say 25yrs and 5mths?? When his service record says he was discharged aged 31?

I think the army has made a big error and mixed up two people both called Frederick William Hobbs and both in the RAMC. See the image below for 88839 SWB and note his age and then at second image of Births of Frederick William Hobbs. I think your grt grandfather is marked with a * and there is another man marked * who is the right age to be 25yrs and 5mths at that time. Either the 88839 number for the SWB is wrong or more likely they've put in another man's age.

Lastly, an extract from the Electoral Rolls for Battersea 1919. With all the different Frederick (William) Hobbs around is is possible there is another one who married someone else called Ethel and they are nothing to do with you.

TEW

[steph9755]

Hi I've just read through all the info thank you very very much. I do think you are correct about the Ethel in batteries as Ethel and Frederick moved to windsor at some point but not sure when. But they would have decently bee there in 1919. To be honest all the dates are a mistery to me just like why they moved to windsor. If you could explain his papers to me thAt would be great as i don't understand any of it, I've been looking and looking at it but it Chinese to me. I would greatly appreciate it very much. Many thanks for your help so far kindest regards steph

[TEW]

Steph,

I think you should do a new post in Interpreting service records and medal index cards entitled something like RAMC service record help. More people will see your request.

Copy and paste this text into the new post -------- His records are on FMP HERE, as number 88839 and on Ancestry as 2829. I can also add images of his record.

There are 22 sheets but some are just army correspondance about his discharge papers.

There are other posts about the 36th General Field Hospital including some nice photos

TEW