Finding regimental diary from soldiers number

[David F Marks]

I am currently trying to find more about the activities of Leonard Lewis Kilcoin who was transferred to a signals division of the Royal Engineers in about Feb 1915 following recovery from shell shock sustained whilst serving in the Irish Guards at Ypres. I can find no trace of his service record which is presumably amongst those destroyed in WW2. However I wonder if it is possible from his service number with the RE (33982)

to identify which division of the signals he would have been with and at least be able, from the regimental diary to ascertain where he would have served. He survived the war but died in March 1919 and has a military grave in Bedford (from where the soldier number was obtained). Any helpful suggestions would be much appreciated.

[John_Hartley]

Had he been serving with an infantry regiment this would have been an easy task - the medal rolls at the National Archives record the battalion(s) with which a man served. However, I understand the rolls of the Engineers are not so helpful and have no listed units.

Your local main library probably has a copy of the CD Soldiers Died in the Great War. It may be possible to do some analysis of men with service numbers close to his, checking against the War Graves Commission website to see if there is any consistency of unit. Even if there is, then you would need ot make the researcher's leap of faith to say that Kilcoin probably served with the same unit.

[johnboy]

There is no mention of Irish Guards on CWGC.

Where did you get that info from?

As he is buried in Bedford, he could have died in a hospital there or been in a signals depot in the area.

[David_Underdown]

Curiously his medal card shows his forename as Arthur (as well as his RE service number being mistranscribed - semi-understandably as 23982, his surname as Kilcoln and his initial regiment merely as Guards - he took a bit of finding) http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=D3240684 this confirms he was transferred to RE on 20 February 1915. His CWGC entry http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/2745828/KILCOIN,%20LEONARD%20LEWIS shows he was stationed at a Signal Depot at the time of his death (Spanish flu is an obvious suspect at the date of his death). As others have said, the medal roll is unlikey to show much detail of his other RE units, though the only way to be sure is to check, it is now held as WO 329/394 at The National Archives - http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=C4435612. These record are not digitised, so can only be viewed in physical form at Kew.

RE signallers were largely in the Divisional Signal Companies (though there were a few other signal units as well), and each company kept a diary. As the name suggests, there was one signal company per division, and taht was the unit that kept the war diary. In general they were divided into severals sections, one with Divisional HQ, and one with each of the division's brigades, as the war went on additional sections were added for otehr supporting arms within the division, but the war diaries will all be gathered together as one. However, that's no great help without being able to establish which Div Sig Coy he was with.

Normally the guards regiments maintain their own service files, and they can be obtained by contacting the respective Regimental HQ, but I don't know if they'd have kept a copy after his transfer. It may be worth contacting them to see if it's a possibility, but normally a proper search cost about £30, which I don't think is refunded in the event they find nothing.

[johnboy]

There were several RE Signal depots in Bedfordshire and North Herts. He could have been returned to a depot after illness or as I said before he could have been in a hospital. You could try and find hospitals in Bedford and see if they had any records.

[johnboy]

Further to the above. Could you check 1911 census to see where he was living?

I am not sure if he would have been in a hospital as most of the other RE men buried there lived in Bedford.

[David F Marks]

Thanks for the suggestions folks. I understand from his grandson that Leonard died of blood poisoning after pricking his thumb on a rose. This seems to be confirmed by his death certificate which gives the cause of death as 1. Pneumonia and 2. Toxemia. The reason I know about his time in the Irish Guards is that I have his diary (mentioned elsewhere in this forum) which describes day by day his involvement in the retreat from Mons, the First Ypres and his repatriation with shell shock followed by transfer to the RE Signals. I have had discussions with the RE Museum and the National archive who were of limited help and suggested searching Ancestry and Find My Past with soldier numbers on either side of Leonard's. No luck there unfortunately. One other clue ... In a pocket at the back of the diary are two maps which have been cut from newspapers.One is annotated in pencil in Leonard's writing -Lloyds weekly news Sunday 17-9-16 and also -"Ground gained and held on 16th Sept 1916 - The maps are of the Somme around Combles.

[johnboy]

Does the death certificate show place of death?

[David F Marks]

Yes. Place of death was the Military Hospital, Kempston, Bedford

[johnboy]

Thanks David.

I thought that originally but was thrown by the number of RE men buried there that had Bedford addresses.

I'll have a look and try and find an RE unit in that area.

I wonder why his nok left him to be buried there rather than one of the London cemetaries? Perhaps it was the cost of the transport.