M1895 "KNIL-Artillery" Bayonet

[wulfrik-the-wanderer]

Hey everyone,

Thought I'd share this to interest those on here interested in bayonets with a rare one!

I recently saw a Friend on facebook wanting an I.D. on a peculiar bayonet I'd not seen before, it has its scabbard and frog and was eventually Identified as a M1895 "KNIL-Artillery" Bayonet later converted to be like the standard dutch M1895's numbered 370 A (see bottom of the page of the link, the one in the link is numbered 54 A)

http://www.muetstege.com/m1895_knil_artillery.htm

By sheer coincidence I found one at the weekend! The dealer had falsely labeled it as "odd 1888 pattern?" so it wasn't too expensive luckily.

They saw service between 1904 and 1938 with the Dutch with a maximum of 2000 made. That's 76 years out of service, wonder how many of the approximate 2000 made have survived? The link says only a handful are known of, does anyone on here have one to see what numbers what survived.

Mine is an example that, like most, has been crudely converted to be like more standard dutch 1895 patterns, numbered 475 A.

regards,

Haydn

-

[trajan]

A joy to have and to hold! It is always especially fun to get something well out of the ordinary. And quite understandable with that pommel that it was thought to be a P.1888 version, although the OEWG mark should have aroused suspicions...

[Luke0000]

Wow...how lucky indeed.

[trajan]

Wow...how lucky indeed.

Luck, yes, but also memory and experience and studying the books, methinks... Took me a while (I only got into this thing about 4 years back) to learn and how to spot the odd bayonets, which is how I got my crummy condition but still very odd Gras variation, discussed on another GWF thread (and still only one of three or so known examples!), and it is also how I built up my WWI Greek bayonet collection, most of them uncommon, some very rare.

Now, if I had been in Wulfrik's shoes I would have gone "Now what the heck is that? Looks like a P.1888 pommel but that crossguard, blade and no ricassso markings? Summat odd here....One to buy and sort out what it is later!" And loo and behold, a really nice and rare find!

So, well done Wulfrik! Now, will somebody PLEASE identify my crummy but very odd Gras variation? - http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=210983#entry2084708

TIA,

Trajan

[Luke0000]

Luck, yes, but also memory and experience and studying the books, methinks... Took me a while (I only got into this thing about 4 years back) to learn and how to spot the odd bayonets, which is how I got my crummy condition but still very odd Gras variation, discussed on another GWF thread (and still only one of three or so known examples!), and it is also how I built up my WWI Greek bayonet collection, most of them uncommon, some very rare.

Now, if I had been in Wulfrik's shoes I would have gone "Now what the heck is that? Looks like a P.1888 pommel but that crossguard, blade and no ricassso markings? Summat odd here....One to buy and sort out what it is later!" And loo and behold, a really nice and rare find!

So, well done Wulfrik! Now, will somebody PLEASE identify my crummy but very odd Gras variation? - http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=210983#entry2084708

TIA,

Trajan

Yes...it is rather irritaiting nobody being able to identify it....Actually...I have a odd marking of me own...that fuse ive been talking about, I worked out 1 marking as the Payload marking, because it cant be anything else...Yet the problem is...its not a payload I can find in the common payloads...Id love to know what a F3 payload would be....Time to hunt for identification for you

Well now ive searched it doesnt seem to be anywhere I can find some marking IDENTIFICATION...but I have found something interesting for you

It would appear the Yugoslavians at some point in the late WW1/early WW2 used these bayonets...only afew made...but if it is a YUGOSLAVIAN one possibly somehow then ending into Dutch possession, that would explain why the markings were changed to be more standard...

And now after more searching http://www.muetstege.com/ <- a dutch bayonet site...reading it now...

1 thing is its not the KNIL ARTILLARY but the more standard post 1900 army one.

http://www.muetstege.com/m1895_rifle.htm

http://www.muetstege.com/m1895_knil_artillery.htm

Now the manufacturer marking is the confusing part

It must be post 1900 considering lack of hooked quillion...

So ive given you info that its not the KNIL artillary and its post 1900...should help

[trajan]

But those Dutch bayonets you show are T-backed, Wulfric's is is a parallel edged bayonet... If you go back to

http://www.muetstege...l_artillery.htm click on the bottom right hand corner and that will show you the M1895 "Converted KNIL-Artillery" Bayonet, with its parallel (or double-) edged blad and P.1888 type handle...

[wulfrik-the-wanderer]

thank you for the kind words, yeah it is definitely a Knil artillery carbine bayonet (the one without pommel or grips) but has been converted to be more like the standard Dutch M1895, like many of them where, the way to tell is that the pommel is much more crudely made than the blade. you can see the rough way the pommel has been fixed on (my first picture), and out of my pictures the one bottom right shows the extra wooden insert where the original blade recesses in.

The next step would be finding a carbine to match it number wise ha ha!

regards,

Haydn