muddymule Posted 28 April , 2014 Share Posted 28 April , 2014 Hello All, I am a new member and I have found some very interesting info here.... I have recently picked up a p14...but I was wondering if anyone could help me ID her? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4thGordons Posted 28 April , 2014 Share Posted 28 April , 2014 Hi Muddymule, Welcome! Well, its a Remington (as opposed to WInchester or Remington/Eddystone) built Pattern 1914 MkI* (No3 MkI*) The * indicating enlarged bolt lugs (and the matching receiver recesses) these are far more common than the MkI without the * I would guess it does not have the volley sights complete (probably just the dial sight base) - likely indicating it was refinished to the Weedon Repair Standard (WRS) in 1939-41, Beyond that what were you looking for? If you can provide the serial number TonyE can give you the date of acceptance. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddymule Posted 29 April , 2014 Author Share Posted 29 April , 2014 Thank you for the reply... serial number is as follows...200407 I cant seem to find any year markings...when I took her down to clean her up...i found no other legible markings except an "R" on the barrel under the top handguard. And yes...rear volley site was removed just the front dial remains.. I would really like to know what year she is....and what does "enlarged bolt lugs" mean?....is that bad...lol Thanks so much for any help here.. muddy.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4thGordons Posted 29 April , 2014 Share Posted 29 April , 2014 TonyE (member here) should be able to give you the acceptance date(month) from the serial. Remington made about 403,000 Pattern 14 rifles - mostly in 1916/7 so it is likely that your acceptance date will be somewhere there but as I said TonyE should be able to narrow it down "Enlarged bolt lugs" - early in the production cycle the design was modified by slightly lengthening the locking lug on the front of the bolt body (and of course slightly deepening the recess in the rear face of the barrel to accommodate this. This is what gives the rifle the MkI* designation - it was a minor model improvement. British nomenclature used * to indicate alterations that were not deemed sufficient to be an entirely new model. here are the two bolts photographed side by side: So no - it is not bad! MkI* rifles are far more common than MkI (which command a bit of premium among collectors) Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyE Posted 29 April , 2014 Share Posted 29 April , 2014 Your rifle was accepted by British inspectors in week ending 17 February 1917. It would probably have been made some days earlier depending on the inspection backlog. Approximately 65,000 rifles were accepted that week. Regards TonyE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddymule Posted 30 April , 2014 Author Share Posted 30 April , 2014 Wow...Gentlemen I really thank you for all the information...was more than i could hope for! I think i'm gonna like it here! muddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Hywel Davies Posted 10 May , 2014 Share Posted 10 May , 2014 TonyE , I hope you don't mind me asking about my own P14 which is a Winchester receiver numbered W100148 or have you only got the Remington numbering? Seems incredible now that this rifle could have superceded the SMLE if they'd had more time to work on the .276 round before war broke out. Its a lovely rifle to shoot but I cant see how a five round magazine was an improvement over the SMLE's ten. I think i read somewhere that five was all they felt was needed in most situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyE Posted 11 May , 2014 Share Posted 11 May , 2014 No, I have the data for all three manufacturers. Your Winchester was accepted by British inspectors at the factory in week ending 20 January 1917. Of course it may have been made some little while earlier depending on any inspection backlog. Regards Tonye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Hywel Davies Posted 11 May , 2014 Share Posted 11 May , 2014 Thank you so much Tony I have no idea where else I'd have got such info.Very satisfying to know precisely when she was made.Where on earth do you get such detailed info re US production,if you don't mind me asking? Kind regards Hboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyE Posted 12 May , 2014 Share Posted 12 May , 2014 The data is in the National Archives at Kew. When I did my Masters dissertation on the supply of rifles in WWI I went through all the Ministry of Munitions weekly reports of munitions acceptance and deliveries and created a spread sheet for each type of rifle by manufacturer. For the Pattern '14 it was relatively easy because we know that serial numbers started from 1. Regards TonyE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sierra49er Posted 3 July , 2014 Share Posted 3 July , 2014 Can anyone help me trace a Winchester P14 Sniper rifle. It is in remarkable shape and still is an accurate shooter to this day. The Serial Number is W219920. I am interested in knowing if someone can give more information as to where it saw action and possible what regiment it was assigned to (if that is even possible). Since the BSA Scope is stamped 1918, it came in late to WWI and may not have been issued until later. I have seen pictures of P14 Snipers as late as 1944 in the South Pacific in WWII. The stamping is as follows: A crown with J R underneath with crossed rifles/swords then what looks like an up arrow further down the receiver. The bolt also has crossed swords on it as well (right underneath the serial number). There is also a star stamped above the serial number on the bolt. Bolt, receiver and scope all bear the same serial number 219920. Thank in in advance for any help you can provide as I am trying to find the history of this old but very excellent shooting rifle that is in excellent condition. There are no scratches on the stock and appears to have been well maintained. I can send photos if needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerhunter Posted 3 July , 2014 Share Posted 3 July , 2014 It is extremely unlikely that you will be able to trace the history of an individual rifle. P14s in the South Pacific? In the hands of what troops? Pictures always help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4thGordons Posted 3 July , 2014 Share Posted 3 July , 2014 Photos would indeed be interesting. A complete Pattern 14 with matched scope is a rare beast. The marks you describe are entirely standard inspection marks. The * on the receiver ring indicates it is a MkI* with lengthened bolt-head lugs. Only Winchester rifes were selected for sniper (T) and (F) rifle set up, TonyE when he sees this will probably be able to provide you with the acceptance date of your rifle. As Beerhunter says it is almost impossible to reliably trace the service life of an individual weapon in British service except in very unusual circumstances. Even unit discs are not particularly reliable indicators as they can easily be switched/added and there is a large market for them (both blank and marked). I assume the disc on your Pattern 14 is unmarked? I would be very interested in seeing the pictures of the setup especially the scope/mount and overall views. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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