GraemeClarke Posted 13 March , 2014 Share Posted 13 March , 2014 Hi David I dont think so. The 1st Battalion Welsh Guards is 217 Mb (£3.36) http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=C7351854 The 2nd Royal Scots from July to December 1918 is 42.5 Mb (3.36) http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=C14052986 Regards, Graeme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew_F Posted 13 March , 2014 Share Posted 13 March , 2014 Hi all, The second batch of unit war diaries has actually been made available online today. This second batch contains records relating to the last of the Cavalry and numbers 8-33 Infantry Divisions deployed to the Western Front in the First World War, and covers the entire period of the units’ involvement in France and Belgium, from their arrival on the front to their departure at the end of the war. Those are all available on the site for you to crack on with now (www.operationwardiary.org), let me know if you have any questions and I'll do my best to get straight back to you. Thanks, Matthew IWM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew_F Posted 13 March , 2014 Share Posted 13 March , 2014 Hiya - Sorry if this question has been asked before, but I could not find the answer anywhere. Once some war diaries will have been fully typed out and analysed, how will they be made available ? How will it be possible to search these diaries for events or individual soldiers ? Through a special platform ? Hi there, We're discussing at the moment about how to make the data from the diaries that have been tagged available, there'll be more news on that soon. I'd advise keeping an eye on our Facebook page and the Operation War Diary blog if you're interested in finding out more information about that, and I'll of course make sure to post it here too. The data will also be feeding into Lives of the First World War, which you'll be able to use to research individual soldiers. Thanks, Matthew IWM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David_Underdown Posted 13 March , 2014 Share Posted 13 March , 2014 Hi David I dont think so. The 1st Battalion Welsh Guards is 217 Mb (£3.36) http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=C7351854 The 2nd Royal Scots from July to December 1918 is 42.5 Mb (3.36) http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=C14052986 Regards, Graeme Graeme, I'm surprised the Welsh Guards one is so big I must admit. There wee a fwe chagne sof mind as to how big the files should be (from the point of view of keeping Discovery responsive), it may simply be that that one slipped the net. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraemeClarke Posted 13 March , 2014 Share Posted 13 March , 2014 Hi Forget I mentioned it, then !! Having it said that, I spend a fair bit on WDs as I am researching so many men, and, really, as in the case of Royal Scots above, I probably would not purchase it as it is not 'value for money'. That, therefore, is money the NA is losing out on. Graeme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinaMoffitt Posted 14 March , 2014 Share Posted 14 March , 2014 I keep getting a RUNTIME error when I search for diaries so I've let them know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew_F Posted 14 March , 2014 Share Posted 14 March , 2014 I keep getting a RUNTIME error when I search for diaries so I've let them know Thanks for letting us know about the bug, did you post that on the Operation War Diary discussion forum? Thanks, Matthew IWM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 14 March , 2014 Share Posted 14 March , 2014 Generally it depends how voluble the original diary keepers were. The chunks should be broadly similar in terms of file size/number of pages. Some units siply wrote more, and it will also depend whether the related appendices happen to have been kept. The file size and the number of pages of War Diary are not particularly well correlated. As you intimate David, it depends on how active the diary keeper was. In my experience the average diary is about 9,000 words for the 1914 campaign (5 months); diary narrative, including personal Diary accounts and dedicated accounts on specific actions but not including the appendices of Orders and signals etc. The range is very wide however. The largest diary in terms of written words is about 20,000 words and the smallest is about 2,500 for this 5 month period based on Infantry battalion War Diaries. All cost exactly the same so it is rather a lottery. I have old diaries from the £3.50 days which have been sliced thinner, so now costing more. To be fair I suspect that the best argument is that the value for money before was incredible and now it is just slightly less incredible. The TNA pricing strategy bears no relation to dates, pages, content or anything else from what I can figure out. Perhaps a very loose correlation with MB, but this is slightly misleading as many files are padded out with masses of Appendices, particularly signals, messages, admin sheets. - particularly the Bde HQ diaries. I suspect when TNA has a better understanding of the content of each diary a more efficient pricing strategy will evolve. Until then it would be useful if TNA decided on one strategy such as, say £3.36 for x MB or £3.36 per Y pages or £3.36 per Z months' worth of Diary. To illustrate the point for £3.36 one can download one of the two below: 1. 2nd Bn Essex Regt from Aug 1914 to Feb 1919 (55 months) (158 MB in 4 files) and 524 pages long 2. 2nd Bn R Inniskilling Fus from Aug 1914 to Dec 1914 (5 months) (6.4 MB) and only 22 pages long. So, for the same £3.36 the 2nd Bn Essex Regt bundle provide 25 times more in terms of MB 24 times more pages 11 times more in terms of dates covered. MG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinaMoffitt Posted 15 March , 2014 Share Posted 15 March , 2014 Thanks for letting us know about the bug, did you post that on the Operation War Diary discussion forum? Thanks, Matthew IWM No, I sent a PM to Luke Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwin astill Posted 15 March , 2014 Share Posted 15 March , 2014 Downloaded quite a few yesterday. I reckon it is good value for money, especially if, like me, you don't live in London. Keep it up, NA. Edwin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 21 March , 2014 Share Posted 21 March , 2014 David Underdown - I can't find where I am supposed to report such things but I have just found that the war diary links for the 17th King's (Liverpool Regiment), which splits to three PDFs, actually lead you to PDFs of the diary of the 19th Battalion. And vice versa: click to download the 19th and you get the 17th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David_Underdown Posted 21 March , 2014 Share Posted 21 March , 2014 Chris, Best to email digitaldownloads@nationalarchives.gsi.gov.uk I'll try to check on Monday that it's been logged. Sounds like the folders of images got accidentally swapped at some point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 21 March , 2014 Share Posted 21 March , 2014 David Underdown - I can't find where I am supposed to report such things but I have just found that the war diary links for the 17th King's (Liverpool Regiment), which splits to three PDFs, actually lead you to PDFs of the diary of the 19th Battalion. And vice versa: click to download the 19th and you get the 17th. Good Luck Chris On 1st Feb I reported a very similar issue to TNA - 1st Bn Lincolnshire Regt War Diaries for Aug-Dec 1914 downloaded, which were in fact the diaries for Jan 1915 onwards. Emailed TNA on 1st Feb, who sent an acknowledgement from the Digital Downloads Team on 4th Feb saying they would be in contact. I responded on the 4th offering to help as I subsequently found the required Diary on the end of the 13th King's (Liverpool Regt) War Diary and asking them (nicely) to fix it. I have dozens of Files with errors. In the subsequent 45 days there has been no acknowledgment, and no response. MG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David_Underdown Posted 22 March , 2014 Share Posted 22 March , 2014 Martin I will try to get a response for you, although obviously it won't now be until next week (I am not in a position to speak for that team). The information about errors is certainly being collated and logged, and remediation work is under way. Clearly these errors need to be corrected, and more importantly we need to understand why they have happened, so we can stop similar things happening in the future. Planning for a second phase of digitisation is now in progress (it's worth mentioning that we've introduced new digitisation standards since the first tranche of the diaries were processed, which should help). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 22 March , 2014 Share Posted 22 March , 2014 Martin I will try to get a response for you, although obviously it won't now be until next week (I am not in a position to speak for that team). The information about errors is certainly being collated and logged, and remediation work is under way. Clearly these errors need to be corrected, and more importantly we need to understand why they have happened, so we can stop similar things happening in the future. Planning for a second phase of digitisation is now in progress (it's worth mentioning that we've introduced new digitisation standards since the first tranche of the diaries were processed, which should help). David. There is no need. I simply highlighted my experience so that others might not have their expectations raised. Thanks for the offer though and thank you for your continued informed input. MG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 23 March , 2014 Share Posted 23 March , 2014 Today I downloaded the 6th Dragoon Guards' War Diary (WO 95/1137/1) to discover it is the Queen's Own Oxfordhire Hussars Way Diary. The Queen's Own Oxfordshire Hussars War Diary (WO 95/1137/2) turns out to be the 6th Dragoon Guards War Diary. Reported to TNA. The 6th DG's War Diary (once unwrapped from its QOOH camouflage) turns out to be 410.5 MB of Diary, covering the whole war (as most of the Cavalry diaries do). For £3.36 it is I think the largest file I have downloaded (split into 9 files) and amazing value. For the same price one only gets 46 MB of the 4th DG War Diary. 88.8% less in terms of file size. MG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David_Underdown Posted 23 March , 2014 Share Posted 23 March , 2014 This switch certainly is already known about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W.J.Caughey Posted 23 March , 2014 Share Posted 23 March , 2014 It seems to be like this from even last year, i thought it was me doing something wrong but some how ended up with 1st Bn R.Inn.Fus War Diary Feb 1918-March 1919 and not digitised yet and cannot be downloaded. Didn't complain until i downloaded what i believed to be WW2 158 Sq flight reports, and got hundreds of photo's which look like clouds to me!!, TNA did agree when i emailed them, they were ref wrong and sent me the files i wanted. Walter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 24 March , 2014 Share Posted 24 March , 2014 On the 19th of March I emailed the team regarding the 45th TMB diary. Today I received a reply to say it was being looked at, and that they will keep me informed. I am quite happy with that, and look forward to their reply. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westkent78 Posted 24 March , 2014 Share Posted 24 March , 2014 Martin, I reported the 1st Buffs issue on 31st Jan. Received an email on Feb 4th that they were looking into it, but silence since. I guess they must be logging all the issues before fixing any of them at a later date? Best regards, Matthew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 24 March , 2014 Share Posted 24 March , 2014 I am in danger of sounding like a stuck record but I feel very passionate about this unique resource and this amazing project. For what it is worth I have transcribed over two million words of War Diaries in my time (now pushing 20 Division's worth). It has provided a fairy deep insight into the raw material. I suspect the combined experiences of the GWF membership would be many multiples of this. TNA might want to think about proactively tappiing into this experience. This is a forum populated by the right kind of obsessive-compulsive types whose collective knowledge of the diaries would have few rivals outside the WFA (and indeed I am sure there is lots of overlap). Collaboration between TNA and GWF would I think be extremely productive.There is a once in a generation opportunity to mobilise (sic) our collective resources and we are in danger of watching this slowly pass us by. TNA would do themselves a lot of favours by simply responding to reported issues within a defined timeframe. MG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David_Underdown Posted 25 March , 2014 Share Posted 25 March , 2014 Martin, I didn't have opportunity to take this up with the relevant people yesterday, but I am donig so today. The main area for participation is of course Operation War Diary, which has already seen the equivalent of about 4 man years of effort contributed, which has led to the tagging of something like 250,000 named individuals (some of these will of course be the same individuals appearing multiple times) and 300,000 places (likewise, obviously many of these will be the same places mentioend at different times and different units) - I'm quoting these figures from memory, so I may be a bit out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 30 March , 2014 Share Posted 30 March , 2014 I hereby give the 7th KSLI the right to share the Royal Artillery's motto "Ubique", for the battalion's war diary is all over the place. It is in four separate parts, some of which include not just the 7th KSLI but the diaries of other units, and in some periods the diary is not in correct time sequence. I'll report it. Likewise a diary of the 17th Divisional Signal Company RE I looked for today is said in the WO95 paper to cover up to February 1919, but the three-part digitised diary ends in February 1918. Not clear if the catalogue is wrong or there's a digital component missing from Discovery. I'll report that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeatherC Posted 1 April , 2014 Share Posted 1 April , 2014 Today I downloaded the 6th Dragoon Guards' War Diary (WO 95/1137/1) to discover it is the Queen's Own Oxfordhire Hussars Way Diary. The Queen's Own Oxfordshire Hussars War Diary (WO 95/1137/2) turns out to be the 6th Dragoon Guards War Diary. Reported to TNA. I also reported this in mid-February when it was discovered through the tagging taking place in Operation War Diary. I got a response on 14 Feb telling me they were "In the process of correcting" the error. Does it really take that long? OWD is finding a lot of smaller errors like upsdie down or sideways pages or unreadable pages and they are being carefully tagged as such. Are we wasting our time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westkent78 Posted 1 April , 2014 Share Posted 1 April , 2014 Martin et al, Just to let you know that I received an email on the 31st March pointing me in the direction of a link where I could download the corrected 1st Buffs diary. It wasn't a lightning fast download, but we got there in the end and all seems to be where it should be, so hopefully the online version has been corrected for future downloaders. On another note, has anyone attempted downloading diaries to their device while at the NA on their wireless system? Is it free as I think it used to be, and how are the speeds? Just thinking about all those Divisional diaries at one month's data a download. Matthew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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