Michael Haselgrove Posted 28 December , 2013 Share Posted 28 December , 2013 Dear Forum Members, I thought I would share some photos of a trench club in my collection whilst, at the same time, asking two questions. The club is 18 inches long and has a cast iron head secured to the wooden handle by two brass screws. This club has been fairly close to the explosion of a grenade, or possibly a shell, as it has damage caused by two significant fragments as well as several other small strikes including a very small piece of metal imbedded in the wood. For many years, although I was not certain, I had thought this club was German. It was described as such in a publication the title of which I now cannot recall. However, I have seen two further publications, one recent, where the club is described as British and is also described as having a cast lead head. My questions are does anyone know for sure whether the club is German or British and has anyone ever seen one of these clubs with a cast lead head? I shall be grateful for any help. Regards, Michael H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike_H Posted 29 December , 2013 Share Posted 29 December , 2013 Michael The trench clubs of this pattern in the IWM's collections are all identified as being German, none of those are cast lead and I have never seen one made of that metal. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Haselgrove Posted 29 December , 2013 Author Share Posted 29 December , 2013 Mike, Many thanks for your response to my questions. Much appreciated, especially as you confirm authoritatively my understanding of the position. Regards, Michael H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dink_and_pip Posted 29 December , 2013 Share Posted 29 December , 2013 Surely cast lead would be too soft! See if its magnetic. Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Haselgrove Posted 29 December , 2013 Author Share Posted 29 December , 2013 Hi Andy, Thanks for your response. It's definitely cast iron. The point was that I have seen two books, one on trench clubs published recently, where it was claimed, incorrectly as far as I am concerned, that the clubs are British and the head is cast lead. Whether lead would be too soft I can't say. Probably not, especially if the lead was an alloy with a tin and/ or antimony content. Regards, Michael H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calibre792x57.y Posted 29 December , 2013 Share Posted 29 December , 2013 I trust you had a good Xmas Michael. I recently purchased a couple of the Pals battalions books, one of which showed a picture of a very similar club, but lacking the radial knobs. The script stated that it had been picked up by a soldier in the Leeds Pals in No Mans Land following a German raid. The haft has two sets of holes drilled at right angles at top and bottom, like ours. - Happy New Year - SW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
militariaone Posted 30 December , 2013 Share Posted 30 December , 2013 http://m.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/30003757 Regards, Lance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calibre792x57.y Posted 30 December , 2013 Share Posted 30 December , 2013 Thanks for that Lance - I have been wondering about those examples which lack the radial knobs. Now we know they are just a variation. - SW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Haselgrove Posted 31 December , 2013 Author Share Posted 31 December , 2013 Dear Sommewalker and Lance, Many thanks for your responses. All interesting information. I am particularly interested by the comment on the IWM website that the type of trench club under discussion is probably the type most widely used by the Germans as personally I have only seen a very few examples. Additionally, although I have seen a number of contemporary photographs showing other types of trench club I have never seen one showing this type of trench club. Anyway, again many thanks for your help and have a very happy New Year. Regards, Michael. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chordate Posted 16 January , 2014 Share Posted 16 January , 2014 Hello: Cylindrical cast iron club bearing seven rounded spikes (projections) mounted to wooden shaft. Parting line is evident on the head where cope and drag were united. Two mounting screws most likely made of iron. Two references by: R. Finadri = Mazze Ferrate Della Prima Guerra Mondiale and D. Machnicki = At Arm's Length Trench Clubs and Knives identify this model of club as British, another reference by J. Fontvielle =Couteaux de Combat identifies this club as Austrian. A photograph will be necessary, which illustrates the club being used by soldiers on specific front. This will assist with proper identification. Photographs are not definitive but do help with identification. Therefore, one must look at the type of materials and how the club is constructed. This will give clues to its origin but only by conjecture. The type of wood, iron hardware, shape of projections (spikes), mounting screws and design lean toward Great Britain. Again, this conclusion is based solely on clues by design. Further research is required. I hope this helps. Chordate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calibre792x57.y Posted 16 January , 2014 Share Posted 16 January , 2014 I think I will stick with the IWM's identification as German - SW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
militariaone Posted 17 January , 2014 Share Posted 17 January , 2014 Greetings all, I saw this attached picture whilst doing some searches online here http://britseps.blogspot.com/2012/11/leeds.html It is of a Trench Clubs’ display at the Leeds to the Royal Armories Museum. Unfortunately, the display’s explanation card is not completely in the photo. Perhaps, some of our forum members are familiar with the specifics of this display and under what nationality the arrow marked club is classified (by this museum)? Just stirring the pot. Regards, Lance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
militariaone Posted 19 January , 2014 Share Posted 19 January , 2014 Similar situation at The National Army Museum (New Zealand), can't tell what country the club is being attributed to. Pictures came from here http://www.warrelics.eu/forum/collections-display/national-army-museum-new-zealand-pic-heavy-233-pictures-387279/ Regards, Lance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shamsy Posted 24 January , 2014 Share Posted 24 January , 2014 I know I am new at this, but the book by David F. Machnicki has a drawing on his 'wish list' page (59) of a club that looks to be a perfect match with your example. It is listed as "British Trench Club. Wood handle with a cylindrical cast iron head bearing seven rounded spikes" Unfortunatly there are no measurements or weight avaliable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Haselgrove Posted 24 January , 2014 Author Share Posted 24 January , 2014 Hi Shamsy, Yes, I saw the book identifying, incorrectly in my opinion, the club as British. It was the identification in the book that caused me to raise the question. Regards, Michael. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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