1916 Luger

[genegwf]

Greetings to all,

A friend of mine has acquired a 1916 dated Luger with a 1918 dated holster.

The front strap of the pistol is marked "J.R. 161" , "11Bn.", "2".

Our guess is the pistol was issued to Jaeger Regiment 161, 11th Battalion, gun number two.

I have not seen the pistol and I am relaying what information he has given me.

Are we even close? In addition, what would be the best way to find out some information about this unit?

Merry Christmas and thanks for any help!

Gene

[Stoppage Drill]

Some options Gene:

The characters "J" and "I" were completely interchangeable in German usage, so it may well simply be Infantry Regiment 161. Usual markings just had the letter "R" but the "I/J" was optional and not rare.

Battalion numbers were not normally marked. There would not be 11 battalions in a regiment anyway, so I would expect "11" to relate to the company, though I note you say that the mark is "11Bn". Check that "Bn" maybe ?

So, pistol Nr 2, 11 Komp. Infanterie-Regiment 161.

IR 161 was recruited in Rhineland/Westphalia and served on the Western Front throughout the war, initially part of 15th Division, then 185 Div from July 1916. It mainly faced the British.

And Merry Christmas to you too, Sir.

[Latze]

Or it is "II Bn" with roman numerals (so making it the 2nd bn). In the Germany army battalions generally were numbered with roman numerals, in order to avoid confusion with the numbering of companies and regiments.

[genegwf]

Hello Stoppage Drill and Latze,

Thank you for your replies and information concerning the Luger. My friend sent me a picture of the markings on the gun,they appear as follows;

J . R . 161 . I I . 2 .

This is a little different than what I was first told. Do the corrected markings change anything?

Gene

[Khaki]

Without my references, I would read it as Jaeger Regiment 161, 11th company, 2nd weapon. (very nice to have)

I will refer to notes and amend if I find it different.

khaki

[trenchtrotter]

The J as stated is for infantry not Jaeger. JR is common for infantry Regiment and often seen on German items.

TT

[shippingsteel]

Thank you for your replies and information concerning the Luger. My friend sent me a picture of the markings on the gun,they appear as follows;

J . R . 161 . I I . 2 .

This is a little different than what I was first told. Do the corrected markings change anything?

Yes Gene, as has been already touched on, the II could be in Roman numerals, meaning the 2nd Battalion

The marking is not in the right order as per regulations, but that is very commonly seen on the various weapons.

So my interpretation is as follows :- (10. Rheinisches) Infanterie-Regt. Nr.161, 2. Bataillon, Waffe Nr.2

(Depending on the actual style of the marking, if it is in Roman or normal numerals, the 11 could also stand for Kompanie)

Cheers, S>S

[shippingsteel]

And incidentally the above stated Regiment is reknowned these days amongst collectors for having had a particularly astute group of unit armourers.!

You see their regimental marking is found on numerous weapons from the war, in such numbers as to be conspicuous amongst the whole Imperial army.

Here is one of their markings that I have on an S98 bayonet. Note that it is marked not too dissimilar to the Luger, lending weight that the 11 is for Kompanie.

Cheers, S>S

[Cnock]

Hi,

it is indeed Infantry Regt and the '11' stands for the compagny number,

Cnock

[calibre792x57.y]

Here is another one. Front of the grip marked to the Bavarian 7th Infantry Regiment, 11th Company, Weapon No.4. Like many early '08s issued to Bavarian regiments it has never been fitted with a 'hold-open' device. - SW