A Bayonet from the Old Army

[calibre792x57.y]

One for S<S. Saw this while buying the Belgian Mle 1889. Although I already have an Enfield made, unissued example I could not resist it. The maker is Sanderson & Neubold & Co. and the acceptance date is April 1909. The Mark I scabbard is also by a contractor, Hepburn, Gale & Ross Ltd and is also dated 1909. The Patt. '08 frog is the very scarce First Pattern with the two-piece rivets sometimes seen on the very early waist belts. It was originally made without a strap for the entrenching tool helve carrier as the design of this was still being finalised, and this was added later, probably in 1910. Overstamp 10. Note how the strap covers the original viewer's mark. It was made by the Mills Equipment Co. and is also dated 1909. The bayonet was 'sleepy' with rust and dirt and the frog was rusted to the locket. Note how the web has left the mark of it's weave on the scabbard locket. The pommel is stamped R. B. for the Rifle Brigade with a R (Reserve) Number. The scabbard mouth is also stamped with a Reserve Number and although this does not match that on the pommel it is made with the same set of stamps. The blade has been sharpened. So we have a bayonet which was in stored pending the call up of the reservists on Mobilisation in the Summer of 1914. It was issued, (hence the webbing and the sharpening, note how the helve strap is green stained and marked by the buckle of the helve carrier which must have been present until recent times,) probably to the First Battalion at Colchester, the Third was at Cork and the Second in India. The 1st Rifle Brigade was mobilised and formed part of the 11th Brigade, 4th Division, it landed at Le Havre on 23th August 1914. Subsequently it was at Le Cateau (26 Aug - 1 Sept.), Battle of the Marne (7-10 Sept) The Aisne (12-15 Sept). It was also in the fighting in Ploegsteert Wood and took part in the Xmas Truce. Somewhere along this road it seems the Army and this bayonet parted company. Enquiries will be made to see if I can find out more and perhaps trace the helve holder. I know that S< S likes them with history. - SW

[calibre792x57.y]

A close up of the same bayonet. The rust stains mate with patches of rust on the bayonet and the marks made by the helve carrier can be seen on the scabbard body. - SW

[jscott]

Fabulous bayonet SW, thanks for sharing. And the scabbard and frog are also great finds. Any chance you could post some close-ups of the markings?

[shippingsteel]

That's a beautiful bayonet in simply amazing condition, and the scabbard ... well that's just unbelievable in that condition.! Truly impossible to top I believe.

It's obviously an early bayonet that has been put away somewhere and has escaped much service. A reservist bayonet - but a beautiful example nonetheless.

The history is always an added bonus but can be hard to substantiate. Without a reissue date or a rack number overstamp any GW service is only speculation.

That being said you can take nothing away from a near perfect example of the iconic hookie & coming as a matching set, a very desirable piece for any collector.

Cheers, S>S

[calibre792x57.y]

I thought you would like this one. The guy I got it from does a lot of buying in Germany which would explain it's original condition. As for being a 'Reservist' bayonet, surely that shows it was issued to a Regular Battn. on Mobilisation rather than T.A. or a N.A. Battn. I 'll make some enqs. Cheers - SW

[calibre792x57.y]

This one is in rather better condition, but has only a Reserve marking on the scabbard mouth, no regimental stamps and is unissued. Made at RSAF Enfield in July 1911 and again c/w a Mark I scabbard. The latter is Enfield made in 1909. Note the way the blueing shades into the polished blade. This seems characteristic of early Enfield blades. - SW

[Grovetown]

More than likely I missing something as I'm only seeing this on my phone, but what makes this a 1st pattern frog, with tab added later; rather than the 2nd pattern, also riveted and tab 'inclusive', introduced with List of Changes #15408 of November 22nd 1909?

Cheers,

GT.

[wainfleet]

More than likely I missing something as I'm only seeing this on my phone, but what makes this a 1st pattern frog, with tab added later; rather than the 2nd pattern, also riveted and tab 'inclusive', introduced with List of Changes #15408 of November 22nd 1909?

Cheers,

GT.

'tis the rivets, they aren't the usual post-and-washer type but are the sort seen on very early 08 belts. They somewhat resemble the US type of rivet used on pattern 14 leather gear, but are more robust and not dished.

[Grovetown]

'tis the rivets, they aren't the usual post-and-washer type but are the sort seen on very early 08 belts. They somewhat resemble the US type of rivet used on pattern 14 leather gear, but are more robust and not dished.

Gotcha.

[5thBatt]

This one is in rather better condition, but has only a Reserve marking on the scabbard mouth, no regimental stamps and is unissued. Made at RSAF Enfield in July 1911 and again c/w a Mark I scabbard. The latter is Enfield made in 1909. Note the way the blueing shades into the polished blade. This seems characteristic of early Enfield blades. - SW

What can i say Sommewalker!! i thought the first one you posted was a beauty, then you post this!

A most excellent pair of '07s thanks for posting them

[calibre792x57.y]

Gotcha.

Rivets principally, as Wainfleet says, but also the strap is stitched right through the webbing and not just through one layer, It overlies the original Inspection mark on the frog and has its own broad arrow mark on the reverse, hence an addition. Also of course it was made in 1909 whereas the LoC didn't appear until November 22 1909, possible but not likely! - Wainfleet, I'll bring it to the next club meeting - SW

[jscott]

Stunning bayonets SW, thanks for posting. You've done extremely well to find those, the condition of both is superb!

[calibre792x57.y]

Given the time spread it was not so difficult - the Enfield version I've owned for over twenty-five years. I sold it in 1999 for £250 but the buyer wasn't happy and said it was too expensive. So about three years later I gave him his money back! There were some really nice P.'07 bayonets about in the early Nineties, the best of which I don't now have was a HQ near mint in a Mk I scabbard with Naval acceptance stamps on the pommel and scabbard and in a Naval Patt '01 leather frog marked 'C.Galle' 1914. Wish I'd kept that one. - SW

[wainfleet]

Wainwright, I'll bring it to the next club meeting - SW

Please do! Maybe we can get one sorted before Christmas? At the last one I recall that you brought the nicest HQ any of us had ever seen, and a couple of other stunning items as well.

[gew98]

This one is in rather better condition, but has only a Reserve marking on the scabbard mouth, no regimental stamps and is unissued. Made at RSAF Enfield in July 1911 and again c/w a Mark I scabbard. The latter is Enfield made in 1909. Note the way the blueing shades into the polished blade. This seems characteristic of early Enfield blades. - SW

Your 1911 dated hookie is one of my wants for my near same condition matching 1911 dated SMLE. I did have a very nice 1911 dated hookie but somehwere in time it got aussie property marked added to the crossguard. Not good enough for my English only 1911 Enfield SMLE. I eventually found and have hung onto a august 1908 Sanderson in decent shape..but it's hilt is marked to I think either Irish or Scots guards. I would not have a problem doing a trade for a similar condition 1911 dated English issue hookie , or one marked to the KRR to match my rifle. I know I'm just wishing.

[calibre792x57.y]

It would be just a matter of chance if Rifle and Bayonet bore the same dates, but post pictures of rifle and the 'o8 dated bayonet, you never know your luck and forum readers will enjoy it with you. Me - I'm looking for a genuine Gew 98 sling. - SW