Very Non Standard Gravestone

[FredJCarss]

I have done soome head scratching as to the stone I photographed at Hazbrouck.

As you can see it stands out somewhat! I though the stone were not to be different so how did they get this through?

Fred

[Matt Dixon]

I have seen other headstones like this, although they have been ones erected by the next of kin. There are a couple around Loos, which appear to have been paid for by the family.

This is only a guess on my part, but perhaps in this case, no next of kin could be traced and the headstone was funded by his fellow officers and now comes under the auspices of the CWGC? Could it be he was buired where he fell and his officers erected a stone headstone which remained in place?

I have to admit I don't know the answer, but you must ask the resident expert Terry Denham and he will doubtless be able to answer more accurately.

[Terry Denham]

Several private headstones were erected by relatives/colleagues both during and shortly after the war.

When the cemeteries were designed and laid out, CWGC made concerted efforts to get relatives to remove these headstones and have them replaced by the official stone. In this they were largely successful with relatives seeing the point of having uniformity.

However, a few refused and CWGC coped with them as best they could. When such a stone falls into disrepair, it is replaced by a standard stone.

[Guest Hill 60]

In Foster Hill Cemetery (Beford) there is at least one headstone in the CWGC enclosure that was paid for by the Private's mates (sorry can't recall the name right now but he was from a Scottish unit).

Also (and again I've forgotten the ruddy name ) I've seen some private headstones to CAMC nurses and at least one Private from another CEF unit. The cemetery is in the UK at the back of a church, and I WILL get the name and post it with a photo!

[Terry Denham]

Lee

Private headstones are not uncommon in the UK as the relatives were allowed to select that option if they so desired. About 18% of all war graves in the UK have private headstones.

Fred's post was about such private headstones overseas in a CWGC cemetery - not such a common animal.

[Guest Hill 60]

Terry - Cheers for that, knew I'd get my wires crossed somewhere

[FredJCarss]

Thanks everyone for all your comments.

The stone itself is I am sure you will agree in very good condition and remarkably clearly cut while the damage looked more intentional than natural. I suspect it will out live most of us.

Fred

[Ken Lees]

There is a very interesting one in the cemetery at Heilly Station on the Somme. It was erected by the comrades of a man who deliberately sacrificed his life by throwing himself onto a grenade which fell amongst them during training.

When I find the pic, I'll post it!

Ken

[Bob Coulson]

Ken,

This was L/Cpl J P O'NEILL of the 13th New South Wales battalion.

His mates paid a local stonemason to construct the column.

Bob.

[Tim Birch]

Terry

I see that the headstone in question was erected by his "brother officers" rather than by relatives. Wouldn't this have given the CWGC more clout to get it changed than if they had been dealing with a grieving family?

Tim

[Terry Denham]

Tim

I doubt it.

His colleagues would have paid for it and possibly had it erected but CWGC would have contacted the n-o-k. It would have been their shout.

You have to put yourself in the position of people at the time. They had no idea that in ninety years time the cemeteries would still be cared for as they are. They would have had no thought of what would happen to the stone over a century or more.

People have different views. Some readily agreed to having a private stone removed, others no doubt wavered before agreeing and certainly some dug in their heels - the result we see today.

Even though, according to reports at the time, determined efforts were made to remove all private stones by agreement, CWGC could not force relatives to do so - and would have recognised the 'bad PR' of pushing that bit too hard!