Freemasonry in the Great War

[Steven Broomfield]

On ‎04‎/‎12‎/‎2014 at 16:06, healdav said:

Bearing their breasts. I didn't think women could join (more sense).

 

I believe (I read it in The Times, so it must be correct) that the reason the breast is bared during the Initiation ceremony is precisely to prove the candidate doesn't have a breast - i.e. is NOT female. Seems reasonable.

 

[Ron Clifton]

One breast is bared during the initiation ceremony - first degree. The other breast is bared in the second degree ceremony, and both are bared in the third degree ceremony. Whilst it does provide a method of identifying women who seek the first degree, I think there must be other reasons - expressing vulnerability, for instance - for persisting in the other degrees.

 

I should also point out that this, together with rolling up one trouser leg and wearing a slipper on one foot, appears ONLY in the degree ceremonies, and therefore only within a Lodge itself. In the eighteenth century there were a number of other secret societies which required prospective members to go through ceremonies involving tests and some physical discomfort. Anyone who has seen The Magic Flute will be familiar with this. Even more modern institutions retain some measure of this secrecy, which has its ultimate roots in the craft guilds of the Middle Ages.

 

On the original topic, there were two distinct kinds of Lodge with army connections: military Lodges which travelled about with their parent regiments, and Lodges which sought members only from certain regiments (such as the Household Brigade Lodge). The first type had reduced to two Lodges under the United Grand Lodge of England by the 1920s, and when they were re-warranted as ordinary Lodges the practice was discontinued. (Incidentally the Grand Lodge of Ireland seem to have been one of the more enthusiastic proponents of this practice.)

 

The second type still exists, but so do Lodges recruiting from particular schools, colleges, hospitals, and even public limited companies. Many local authorities also used to have their own Lodges but over the past forty years or so political and social pressure, based on eliminating potential conflicts of interest, has reduced their number.

 

I am not a Mason but I have researched the published material associated with them. They are very keen to distance themselves from allegations of undue influence, though I am sceptical about some of the cases I have seen mentioned, and a friend of mine has personal experience of what I can only call bullying.

 

Ron

[Interested]

The current issue of Freemasonry Today (No. 43 - Autumn 2018) contains a couple of interesting articles:

Pages 57-58 on the birth of the CGWC,

Page 82 on the "travelling Lodges" inaugurated by the Grand Lodge of Ireland in the 1730's, as mentioned in the thread above.

The magazine can be found here:

https://www.freemasonrytoday.com/magazine

You'll need to select the LATEST issue and use the slider to find the appropriate pages.

[Steven Broomfield]

Read that last night. A good read.

[johnboy]

Thank you for the link

[forester105]

On 30/11/2014 at 18:25, maggie_h said:

I have this photo of freemasons in Soltau POW camp between 1916 and 1917. It is from my grandfather's photo collection, he was a POW in Soltau from 1916 to 1918

The reverse of the photo has their names and lodges:

Daniel Cook - Perseverance 1018 (now Clydebank?)

W.R. Simmonds - Mizpah 35 - Medicine Hat, Alberta (from ICRC records I think this is Pte William Robert Simonds of the 10th Canadians wounded at Ypres and prisoner at Soltau 1916-1917)

Hugh A.R. MacLennan - Langside 955 - Glasgow (from ICRC records I think this is Lance Corporal Hugh MacLennan 1 Cameron Highlanders, wounded at Ypres and prisoner in Soltau

Russell Taylor - St Johns 967 - Coatbridge

Geo C. Hughes - 3323 Lebong - Bangal (he is listed in Freemasons Roll of Honour)

Hope this is interesting to Forum members. Grateful for any more information on these men, and whos's who in the photo. Also grateful for any advice on whether any freemasonry or lodge archives would be interested in this photo.

Maggie

Is that not a Sherwood Forester capbadge in the hat ?

[forester105]

On 10/04/2017 at 18:03, Ron Clifton said:

One breast is bared during the initiation ceremony - first degree. The other breast is bared in the second degree ceremony, and both are bared in the third degree ceremony. Whilst it does provide a method of identifying women who seek the first degree, I think there must be other reasons - expressing vulnerability, for instance - for persisting in the other degrees.

 

I should also point out that this, together with rolling up one trouser leg and wearing a slipper on one foot, appears ONLY in the degree ceremonies, and therefore only within a Lodge itself. In the eighteenth century there were a number of other secret societies which required prospective members to go through ceremonies involving tests and some physical discomfort. Anyone who has seen The Magic Flute will be familiar with this. Even more modern institutions retain some measure of this secrecy, which has its ultimate roots in the craft guilds of the Middle Ages.

 

On the original topic, there were two distinct kinds of Lodge with army connections: military Lodges which travelled about with their parent regiments, and Lodges which sought members only from certain regiments (such as the Household Brigade Lodge). The first type had reduced to two Lodges under the United Grand Lodge of England by the 1920s, and when they were re-warranted as ordinary Lodges the practice was discontinued. (Incidentally the Grand Lodge of Ireland seem to have been one of the more enthusiastic proponents of this practice.)

 

The second type still exists, but so do Lodges recruiting from particular schools, colleges, hospitals, and even public limited companies. Many local authorities also used to have their own Lodges but over the past forty years or so political and social pressure, based on eliminating potential conflicts of interest, has reduced their number.

 

I am not a Mason but I have researched the published material associated with them. They are very keen to distance themselves from allegations of undue influence, though I am sceptical about some of the cases I have seen mentioned, and a friend of mine has personal experience of what I can only call bullying.

 

Ron

Minor correction Ron - there are still two military lodges in existence - St Patrick's lodge 295 (Royal Dragoon Guards) which still travel with the regiment and still recruit from within the regiment and Lodge Glittering star 322  (1st Battalion Worcestershire Regiment) which is no longer attached to the regiment (now Mercian regt) but still has members of the regiment. Both these lodges fall under the Irish Constitution. Happy to provide further history on Glittering Star, as it is my lodge. It has a fascinating history

[Steven Broomfield]

14 minutes ago, forester105 said:

Minor correction Ron - there are still two military lodges in existence - St Patrick's lodge 295 (Royal Dragoon Guards) which still travel with the regiment and still recruit from within the regiment and Lodge Glittering star 322  (1st Battalion Worcestershire Regiment) which is no longer attached to the regiment (now Mercian regt) but still has members of the regiment. Both these lodges fall under the Irish Constitution. Happy to provide further history on Glittering Star, as it is my lodge. It has a fascinating history

 

There are rather more than two military Lodges: my mother Lodge is London Scottish Rifles Lodge No. 2310 and it has (obviously) close ties with the regiment, most Brothers being ex- or serving members. We have connections with other extant military lodges and there is, I believe, a network of militar Modges. The Royal Artillery appear to have several Lodges.

[forester105]

Just now, Steven Broomfield said:

 

There are rather more than two military Lodges: my mother Lodge is London Scottish Rifles Lodge No. 2310 and it has (obviously) close ties with the regiment, most Brothers being ex- or serving members. We have connections with other extant military lodges and there is, I believe, a network of militar Modges. The Royal Artillery appear to have several Lodges.

Hi Steve, Thanks for the update.  I was aware of other military lodges that have been created in later years. I was referring to the last true military lodges with travelling warrants that are still in existence and exercise their warrant.

[Steven Broomfield]

Just now, forester105 said:

Hi Steve, Thanks for the update.  I was aware of other military lodges that have been created in later years. I was referring to the last true military lodges with travelling warrants that are still in existence and exercise their warrant.

 

Fair enough: we celebrated our centenary about 10 years ago; trouble is, 'later years' could still be well over 100 years ago!