6th Dragoon Guards (Carabiniers)

[BillyH]

Could anybody offer an extract from the war diary for the last week in October 1914 please?

Thanks for any help.

BillyH.

[Chris_Baker]

I have a copy from the original at Kew. It is a bit odd, because although the pages are in sequence and before and after it says 1914, the dates from 23 to 31 October are written as 1915. An absent minded Adjutant, perhaps?

25 October, Wytschaete

Remained in billets all day. Heavy firing in direction of YPRES. Lieut Gill and 20 men left by the supply lorries to collect remounts from remount depot.

26 October, Wytschaete

Marched out at 4am and took over trenches from Indian infantry. A quiet day, only a little shelling and sniping.

27 October, trenches W of Oostaverne

Remained in the trenches all day. A good deal of firing but no attack.

28 October, trenches W of Oostaverne

In the trenches all day. Heavily shelled.

29 October, trenches W of Oostaverne

Heavily shelled from 9am until dark. Orders were received during the afternoon for a retirement to line Wytschaete-Messines at dusk. Owing to Bde on our left being shelled out of their trenches our left flank was left in the air and the Germans got infantry and machine guns close up to our left Squadron, who were forced to retire. Retirement was carried out by Squadrons in succession from the left and the new line was taken up at dusk. Night was spent in digging and improving the trenches.

30 October, Messines-Wytschaete line

Quiet in the trenches until 10am when we were heavily shelled with shrapnel and heavy percussion shells. Shelling lasted all day. A quiet night.

31 October, Messines-Wytschaete line

Enemy started shelling early in the morning and very heavy shelling continued all day. During the morning our line was reinforced by part of London Scottish, who remained in support in our rear. At dusk a German band could be heard in the distance playing their national anthem. Nothing happened up to midnight.

[nigelcave]

Not overstated, is it?

[BillyH]

Chris,

Thanks very much for the war diary transcription.

Major William Ernest Watson was KIA on 31st October and "nothing happened up to midnight"

Now although I imagine the Major may have been well behind the line while the heavy shelling went on wouldn't you expect it to be mentioned somewhere in the war diary?

Could you possibly have a look at the next couple of days?

Thanks for your help, BillyH.

[Chris_Baker]

Sorry to say that he is not mentioned. The entry for 1 November is lengthy and describes coming under attack from 1am onwards.

[BillyH]

Thanks for your help Chris.

BillyH.

[Steven Broomfield]

Billy. I've looked in the histories of the other regiments in the 4th Cavalry Brigade (Household Cavalry Composite Regiment and 3rd Hussars) and no mention of your man, but is it possible he was Brigade Major or elsewhere on a Staff post? If he was extra-regimentally employed he may well not appear in the War Diary.

[BillyH]

Steven,

Thanks for your interest.

He is listed "Killed in Action" on SDGW and is also on the Menin Gate. It sounds like he may have taken a direct hit?

I wouldn't have thought that they would have "lost" a Major's grave - although there could be reasons why it may have happened of course.

BillyH.

[Neil Mackenzie]

Billy

Just in case you have not already seen this there is a bit about William near the bottom of this page.

http://www.treanor.co.uk/ancestry/fam121.html

[BillyH]

Thanks Neil,

I did have that one actually, and also managed to get a good photo of him via that site!

Thanks anyway, BillyH.

[Steven Broomfield]

Billy, there are quite a few Majors and above without known graves. Given that his death occurred during a defensive battle in which ground was eventually lost, his body may well have been left behind and not marked.

Incidentally, the Carabiniers are now part of the Royal Scots Dragoon Guards (amalgamated in 1922 with the 3rd Dragoon Guards to form the 3rd Carabiniers, then with the Greys in the 60's to form the current regiment). Their museum is in Edinburgh, so might be worth an e-mail. There is also a history of the 3rd DG produced a few years ago which I don't have but which is said to be pretty good.

[Neil Mackenzie]

The 6th DG War Diary rarely mentions casualties by name or even total numbers. You would have thought it would mention the death of a Major who had been in the unit for such a long time but evidently not.

Neil

[BillyH]

Thanks to Neil & Stephen again for your valued comments.

BillyH.

[BillyH]

Not overstated, is it?

Going back to this one after a few weeks - - -

In post #2 Chris gives an excerpt from the war diary up to, and especially, including 31st October.

i.e. "Nothing happened up to midnight"

Not only was Major Ernest Watson killed but I have just realised that SDGW lists 19 other ranks KIA on this day.

Understated it could be, or had the officer writing the diary been dipping into the Rum jar?

BillyH.

[spof]

Billy

It is possible that casualties were listed in an appendix which is no longer with the war diary. They could be with the brigade diary or maybe the regimental museum has more than the diary available in Kew.

Glen