Sgt RWF Not sure of the Medal Ribbons

[ATNOMIS]

Pals

I've bought 4 postcards,Ive posted them in the Postcard thread.

This Sgt in the RWF has 2 medal ribbons. Any ideas? possibly a 1914 or 1915 star and a IGS or GSM ??

Signed " Yours Sincerely, Rob ". Photo by The American Galleries, Glasgow, Liverpool, Rhyl, Kinmel Park, Rhyl.

Thanks in advance

Simon

[Graham Stewart]

Closest to us, is I believe the Indian General Service ribbon(1908-1935) - http://britisharmymedals.blogspot.com/2010/04/india-general-service-medal-1908-1935.html

[ATNOMIS]

Closest to us, is I believe the Indian General Service ribbon(1908-1935) - http://britisharmyme...-1908-1935.html

Thank you Graham.

[Muerrisch]

If 1914 or 14-15 ribbon, which it may well be, photo must be before the BWM and VM ribbons were issued.

1st RWF were involved in the later stages of the Waziristan campaign, won 4 MMs, and were awarded the IGS 1908-35.

So you can date the photograph fairly narrowly to after his IGS arrived [not before end of campaign December 1921] and before his BWM and VM arrived. Say 1922?

[ATNOMIS]

If 1914 or 14-15 ribbon, which it may well be, photo must be before the BWM and VM ribbons were issued.

1st RWF were involved in the later stages of the Waziristan campaign, won 4 MMs, and were awarded the IGS 1908-35.

So you can date the photograph fairly narrowly to after his IGS arrived [not before end of campaign December 1921] and before his BWM and VM arrived. Say 1922?

Grumpy

Thank you

Simon

[ATNOMIS]

Pals

Ive just looked on the reverse in faint pencil says"_ _ t 13th Batt RWF".

Regards

Simon

[Old Owl]

Simon,

I would actually guess that the near ribbon is that of the 1911 Coronation or 1911 Delhi Durbar, and the far ribbon either the 1914 or 1914/15 Star.

The central stripe on an IGS'08 ribbon is wider than those at either side. In the picture the central stripe appears to be much narrower than those either side and could infact have a central stripe within it--this would match the 1911 Cornation ribbon, in my opinion.

Robert

[Muerrisch]

I take it that my attempt at dating the photo is generally acceptable, perhaps a year earlier, say 1921? And clearly the man is in Great Britain, not India!

The issue of the Durbar medal was to 2nd RWF, and very few indeed were granted.

As for the Coronation, I have not seen the RWF list but it would have to be 1st, 3rd, or 4th to 7th inclusive.

Making the just about valid assumption that the film process was orthochromatic, the central stripe of the near ribbon shows darker so is in fact "redder" than the outers, on a scale red orange yellow green blue. That could, of course, be green between blue so is not very helpful!

[Old Owl]

I take it that my attempt at dating the photo is generally acceptable, perhaps a year earlier, say 1921? And clearly the man is in Great Britain, not India!

The issue of the Durbar medal was to 2nd RWF, and very few indeed were granted.

As for the Coronation, I have not seen the RWF list but it would have to be 1st, 3rd, or 4th to 7th inclusive.

Making the just about valid assumption that the film process was orthochromatic, the central stripe of the near ribbon shows darker so is in fact "redder" than the outers, on a scale red orange yellow green blue. That could, of course, be green between blue so is not very helpful!

A soldier could have changed battalions several times between 1911 and 1921 due to the war/wounds etc., etc. He could also have been discharged and re-enlisted, so the battalion number quoted?? on the reverse of the card is of little relevance in this context.

Robert

[Muerrisch]

except it is a service battalion, did not exist until 1914 and ceased to exist in 1919. therefore attribution prima facie is 1914-1919.

[Old Owl]

except it is a service battalion, did not exist until 1914 and ceased to exist in 1919. therefore attribution prima facie is 1914-1919.

Surely he could have been with another Bn at the time of the Coronation/Delhi Durbar? or even a totally different unit for that matter.

[spof]

The Delhi Durbar Rolls are on Ancestry or can be downloaded for free from the NA in WO 100 which will include all the details of requirements to qualify.

THe 1911 Coronation Medal Roll is not available online but I have a copy and have posted the qualification rules and, by pure luck, the RWF recipients http://1914-1918.inv...25#entry1813241

Glen

[Muerrisch]

The original of the ribbon under discussion does meet the ortho film criteria .......... it is blue, narrow dull red, narrow blue, narrow dull red, blue.

So, assuming that the sergeant was not DEMOTED to that rank, there are only half a dozen possibilities, including the [identical] 2nd RWF at the Durbar.

[Old Owl]

The Delhi Durbar Rolls are on Ancestry or can be downloaded for free from the NA in WO 100 which will include all the details of requirements to qualify.

THe 1911 Coronation Medal Roll is not available online but I have a copy and have posted the qualification rules and, by pure luck, the RWF recipients http://1914-1918.inv...25#entry1813241

Glen

Many thanks Glen.

Robert

[Old Owl]

The original of the ribbon under discussion does meet the ortho film criteria .......... it is blue, narrow dull red, narrow blue, narrow dull red, blue.

So, assuming that the sergeant was not DEMOTED to that rank, there are only half a dozen possibilities, including the [identical] 2nd RWF at the Durbar.

Well it doesn't appear to be the IGS ribbon because its dimensions are way, way off, so what other possibilities are there?

[Muerrisch]

Its not the DCM worn wrong side if film is orthochrome.

I have run out of ideas!

[ATNOMIS]

Pals

I shall scan in the rear of the card tomorrow. As I posted Photo by The American Galleries, Glasgow, Liverpool, Rhyl, Kinmel Park, Rhyl.

reverse in faint pencil says"_ _ t 13th Batt RWF".

Thanks for the info

Simon

[FROGSMILE]

For what it's worth the 13th were subtitled the "1st North Wales" Battalion and raised at Rhyll in Sep 1914. In Nov 1914 they went to Llandudno and remained there until Aug 1915, when they moved for pre-embarkation training to Winchester.