Fake Mills

[auchonvillerssomme]

Another thread stimulated me to go and look at my little store of Mills bombs, at the back I came across this. I must have had it for at least 20 years, no idea where it came from. At first glance it would appear to be an over cleaned relic, but on closer inspection the grooves have been ground out. I'm not sure how it was made or if it was made to deceive, if not what its purpose was, threads work and it takes the inners ok. It feels marginally lighter.

[calibre792x57.y]

Saw a similar example at Euro Militaria 2013. Appeared to be one of many found on the battlefield in a heavily corroded condition and which had been ground down to remove the worst of the rust pitting and presented for sale. However this seems to be a fairly recent practice which would not accord with your twenty years in the collection - SW

[auchonvillerssomme]

When I re-looked at it that was my first thought but it just doesn't look the part, you have seen many relic mills bombs and I am sure if you held this one you would feel it isn't right,.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

but on closer inspection the grooves have been ground out. I'm not sure how it was made or if it was made to deceive, if not what its purpose was, threads work and it takes the inners ok. It feels marginally lighter.

auchonvillerssomme,

You will know these details from your other Mills Bomb/Grenade examples, and for members who may not have an example to check, or may be considering buying a WW1 Mills Bomb/Grenade, here are some statistics.

The shell/body has 2 casting seams running top to bottom on each side of the body directly opposite each other.

Around the middle, or most bulbous point of the body runs 12 individual panels, each is flat and uniform except for the 2 panels, one each side of the smaller panels situated over the casting seam ( this line of panels which runs top to bottom over the casting seam is also not completely flat as although the castings seam has been ground down, it is slightly raised ). The panel to the right of the casting seam is chamfered to the left, and the panel to the left of the casting seam is chamfered to the right. All the other panels which make up the body are flat and uniform.

The distance from the Striker hole on the top of the body to the mid point on the base plug is 4.3/4 inches.

The circumference around the middle or most bulbous point of the body is 7.1/4 inches on the earlier No.5 Mk.I and 7.1/12 inches on the later No.23 Mk.II.

The weight of the WW1 Mills Bomb/Grenade minus the fuse and the explosive is approximately 1lb.

In the attached photograph of a Mills No.5 Mk.I and a Mills No.23 Mk.II, you can clearly see the central casting seam on both, with the chamfered panels to the left and right of the seam.

As you say, the deviations and irregular panels and castings on your example shown in post #1 indicates that it is not standard WW1 British military issue.

Regards,

LF

[calibre792x57.y]

Well, just an outside guess; but if you are satisfied that it is not a ground down relic, have you considered it may be an attempt to copy a Mills produced by such an organisation such as the IRA or EOKA? I had a Mills look-a-like, nicely cast, but about twice the size which was thought to be a relic from the Irish Troubles in the Twenties. I believe other organisations also made copies. - SW

[depaor01]

Does this help?

I've been collecting photos for a library exhibition of Ireland's Revolutionary period. This photo is captioned "IRA manufactured grenades captured by the British" and dates from 1919:

My own grandfather worked in the railway works in Inchicore, Dublin and I believe these types of grenades were made under cover in the foundry there. Not sure if he was directly involved and regrettably it's too late to find out...

Dave

[centurion]

I understand that some of the workshops in and around Lahore made their own "Mills" bombs during the partition period as did insurgents in Malaya during the troubles there

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Does this help?

I've been collecting photos for a library exhibition of Ireland's Revolutionary period. This photo is captioned "IRA manufactured grenades captured by the British" and dates from 1919:

My own grandfather worked in the railway works in Inchicore, Dublin and I believe these types of grenades were made under cover in the foundry there. Not sure if he was directly involved and regrettably it's too late to find out...

Dave

What a great photograph, and how very ingenious!

Most interesting.

LF

[Gunner Bailey]

I understand that some of the workshops in and around Lahore made their own "Mills" bombs during the partition period as did insurgents in Malaya during the troubles there

Illegal copies of Mills Bombs have been mainly made in India, Israel and even Somalia over the years. I would never exclude the possibility of other places emerging as well. The earliest evidence of copying I have found so far dates from the early 1920's in India. The latest was from Somalia in the 1980's. The Irish copies are not strictly Mills copies as they do not have the Mills 'shoulders' for the lever.

There is an increasing trend for people to make copies of the Mills No 5, with fakes appearing on the market all the time. The most obvious being those sold by the firm 'DugUp' as replicas for re-enactors. Recently I saw reference to a fake centrecast No 5 that was sold at the 2012 War & Peace show. Buyers beware!

John

[peregrinvs]

Saw a similar example at Euro Militaria 2013. Appeared to be one of many found on the battlefield in a heavily corroded condition and which had been ground down to remove the worst of the rust pitting and presented for sale. However this seems to be a fairly recent practice which would not accord with your twenty years in the collection - SW

I have a WWI No.36 that has been 'improved' in the same way. I bought it in the mid/late 1990's at a flea market for a token sum, so not that recent a practice.

[Gunner Bailey]

Mick

I would say that your Mills is probably real. It's just that it's been completely disfigured by the 'restorer' who took off all the pitting with the grinder. I've seen quite a few of these for sale on the Somme.Some lightly done, others like yours. The key part of yours is the filler screw. Genuine and worth up to £10.

John

[Guest dave11240]

My Grandfather worked in the GS&W railway works in Inchicore. He was the officer in IRA responsible for co-ordination of the making and distribution of Grenades. His Bureau of Military history number is 476 and he details the making of grenades.

If there is anyone who has any details of photos go Inchicore workers or works or any reference to Joe Kinsella, I would be delighted to share all my info with anyone

Dave