Wynne RWF & Wynne RIR Co Armagh

[ARMAGH]

Wynne RWF & Wynne RIR Co Armagh?

I am researching 10892 Pte WYNNE, P 1 St Bn Royal Welsh Fusiliers KIA 19 6 1915 from Crossmaglen Co Armagh

and

15706 Rifleman P.C.Wynne KIA 16 6 1915 2nd Bn Royal Irish Rifles:

Son of the late John and Margaret Wynne

they may be brothers.

Can any members help with any details?

Many thanks

Joe

[IPT]

According to SDGW;

10892 Patrick Wynne was born Liverpool, resident Crossmaglen, enlisted Cardiff.

15706 (Phillip) Camillus Wynne was born and enlisted in Dundalk.

Here's Camillus on the 1901 census; www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Louth/Dundalk_Urban_No__1/Bachelor_s_Walk/1560051/

I think I may have found Patrick on the 1901 census living in Liverpool with his widowed Irish father James and 4 siblings but I can't confirm it yet.

[ARMAGH]

Thanks IPT

Joe

[widavies]

Wynne RWF & Wynne RIR Co Armagh?

I am researching 10892 Pte WYNNE, P 1 St Bn Royal Welsh Fusiliers KIA 19 6 1915 from Crossmaglen Co Armagh

Can any members help with any details?

Many thanks

Joe

According to the RWF war diary on the 19/06/1915 the battn was in billets near Les Choquax and there was no mention of any casualties. However on the 17/06/1915 there was mention of 1 man wounded near Marais after being relieved, could this be your man.

Regards

Will

[mmm45]

Patrick is buried in Germany he died as a POW from 1st Batt deployed overseas in 1914.

Ady

[ARMAGH]

Thanks Will & Ady

Any date for when Patrick was a POW? any thing in the war diary?

Joe

[widavies]

Thanks Will & Ady

Any date for when Patrick was a POW? any thing in the war diary?

Joe

Patrick is buried in Germany he died as a POW from 1st Batt deployed overseas in 1914.

Ady

So the KIA statement was not excatly correct ( I am researching 10892 Pte WYNNE, P 1 St Bn Royal Welsh Fusiliers KIA 19 6 1915 from Crossmaglen Co Armagh.)

Interestingly just prior to this date of death the 1st Bttn RWF was involved in the Battle of Festubert 15th-25th May 1915. Your man may have been both injured and captured during this attack.

Regards

Will

[widavies]

Thanks Will & Ady

Any date for when Patrick was a POW? any thing in the war diary?

Joe

Hi Joe,

Unfortunately for the rank and file no names for the killed wounded and missing are mentioned regarding the casualties for the Festubert battle. The 1 Bttn RWF war diary for 16th May states the following:

Strength of the Bttn on the morning of the 16th

Officers 25 including MO.

Other ranks 806.

Casualties on the 16th May.

Officers

Killed or Died of Wounds 8

Wounded 9

Wounded and Missing 1

Missing 1

Total 19

Other Ranks

Killed 118

Wounded 271

Missing 164

Wounded and Missing 6

Total 559

This means that after just one day of fighting the total casualties incurred were 578 out of an initial strength of 831officers and men which is almost a 70% casulaty rate.

Regards

Will

[clive_hughes]

Patrick Wynne Pte 10892 landed with his battalion in France 7 October 1914, served with B Company. Reported missing on 21 October 1914 and died as a POW in German hands 19 June 1915. Buried Niederzwheren Cemetery, Kassel.

21 October 1914 corresponds with the Battle of Langemarck as a subdivision of 1st Ypres. On 19 October the 1st RWF with other units of 22nd Brigade had pulled back to slit trenches at Broodseinde after their abortive advance and action at Kleythoek / Kezelberg. On 20 October they held these positions (in the form of a right angle, partly along the Broodseinde-Passchendaele Road) against German attacks and shelling.

The unit spent an uneasy night, with random outbursts of gunfire and the enemy blowing whistles and bugles somewhere to their front. Dawn on 21 October heralded the arrival of the artillery of the enemy's XXVI and XXVII Corps who had emplaced themselves during the hours of darkness. From 10:30am, on the left flank and front, the shells rained down and more infantry assaults were launched on 22^nd Brigade. “A” Company's trenches were badly hit and some of the battalion's machine-guns destroyed. However, the Warwicks' guns on the right were used with effect against attacks on the RWF front, enfilading the enemy waves of infantry and causing heavy losses. The enemy artillery, machine-guns and snipers kept up the pressure nevertheless.

Attempts to drive them back on the left and from a wood in front were unsuccessful. Owing to their right-angled positions, sniper fire was by now coming from the upper storeys of houses behind their left flank, who were able to fire down into the British positions. They were also shelled from this direction, and the houses around Broodseinde crossroads caught fire. All this time the men had little or nothing to eat, while a succession of messages urged their officers to hold on “at all costs”, but eventually the messengers could no longer get through. Dirt flung up by the shellfire was also causing many rifles to jam, the bolts having to be hammered open. Unwilling to withdraw from their battered positions; suffering increasing casualties; and pressed by an enemy who had an enormous superiority in manpower and “weight of metal”, eventually by about 6pm elements of the battalion (especially from “B” and “D” companies) were overwhelmed.

Realising that the line had broken and the critical position, Brigadier-Genl. Lawford ordered the remnants of the RWF to withdraw through the Queens' lines, and into local reserve at Ecksternest, about a mile and more down the road towards Hooge and Ypres. Out of 1,150 soldiers they had lost about 5 officers and 37 other ranks killed; 4 officers and 80 other ranks wounded; while 6 officers and 213 other ranks were missing in action. This left the Colonel and Adjutant, four other officers including the Quartermaster, and 206 other ranks. Of the missing, some were killed or captured but others had simply got lost in the retirement and rejoined the unit over the next few days. What was left of the battalion was then virtually destroyed on 30 October at Zandvoorde.

Clive

[ARMAGH]

Thanks Will & Clive

That is great I can now add the information to the www.armaghwarmemorial.com project have a look gents, we hope in the near future to have the names put on the Armagh war memorial.

Many thanks Gents

Joe