CharlieBris Posted 13 August , 2012 Share Posted 13 August , 2012 German artillery pieces were often rebarreled, rebuilt a number of times during WW1. On 7.7cm FK 96 n.As they were stamped with: "A", "AB" or "ABG" on the left side of the breech ring seemingly corresponding to the first, second or third rebuild. What do A, B and G stand for? My knowledge of German is just about zero. Regards, Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippingsteel Posted 13 August , 2012 Share Posted 13 August , 2012 Can't say for sure Charlie as it's not really my area - but I do know that the key to these marking translations is CONTEXT. Back soon with some ideas .... EDIT. So here are a few possibilities to consider - and with a little extra artillery knowledge we may just get somewhere.! "A" ........ ausbesserung .... repair / restoration "AB" ...... ausbesserung bedeutend .... major repair / rebuild "ABG" .... abgeschliffen .... abraded / worn (I do know for certain that the abg. abbreviation was in period use, as it denoted sawback bayonets that had been reworked / ground down) Cheers, S>S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieBris Posted 13 August , 2012 Author Share Posted 13 August , 2012 Another marking seen in the same place as "ABG", etc on guns with a reinforcing ring added about half way along the barrel is a "D". Any ideas on the meaning of this? A suggestion was it meant "dicke" or fat in English. Regards, Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippingsteel Posted 13 August , 2012 Share Posted 13 August , 2012 Another marking seen in the same place as "ABG", etc on guns with a reinforcing ring added about half way along the barrel is a "D". Any ideas on the meaning of this? A suggestion was it meant "dicke" or fat in English. Could be correct as dicke or dichte can also mean thick, heavy, stout or dense (not just fat as in the "fat lady" sense ie. dicke Bertha.!) Cheers, S>S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieBris Posted 14 August , 2012 Author Share Posted 14 August , 2012 The hypothesis makes sense if it was applied at depot level to indicate what action was required to return a gun to service. "abg" is also used on artillery pieces - the early FK 96 n.As had two dates on the breech ring, for example "geb 1898" and "abg 1906" meaning "geboren (made/manufactured) 1898" and "abgeandert" (umlaut over the second "a") (amended) 1906. I suspect the "abg" on modified sawback bayonets indicated "abgeandert". Regards, Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippingsteel Posted 14 August , 2012 Share Posted 14 August , 2012 I suspect the "abg" on modified sawback bayonets indicated "abgeandert". Nein.!! "Sage abgeschliffen" ... (meaning saw abraded / saw ground ie. saw removed) Yes it was physically ground away. Cheers, S>S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikB Posted 14 August , 2012 Share Posted 14 August , 2012 Nein.!! "Sage abgeschliffen" ... (meaning saw abraded / saw ground ie. saw removed) Yes it was physically ground away. Cheers, S>S Yes, 'abgeschliffen' would mean ground-off as an engineering process. Worn away would probably be 'abgenutzt'? But then 'ABG' could stand for 'abge..' practically anything. Regards, MikB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippingsteel Posted 14 August , 2012 Share Posted 14 August , 2012 Yes, 'abgeschliffen' would mean ground-off as an engineering process. Worn away would probably be 'abgenutzt'? But then 'ABG' could stand for 'abge..' practically anything. Yes abgenutzt does appear to be a very good descriptor for what could indicate a worn barrel. I guess the only way to check it out would be to inspect the barrel so marked.? Just thinking ... were barrels ever 'reground' in the repair process, to sharpen up the rifling or something.? And were oversize shells ever made to accommodate worn barrels.? Cheers, S>S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikB Posted 15 August , 2012 Share Posted 15 August , 2012 Just thinking ... were barrels ever 'reground' in the repair process, to sharpen up the rifling or something.? And were oversize shells ever made to accommodate worn barrels.? Cheers, S>S I'm not sure about German practice, but British guns usually had the rifling in a renewable innermost tube, so that worn barrels were relined. Rifling did get blunted, but the more serious wear pattern was that the lead-in was eroded further down the barrel, so that the shell was moving faster before it engaged, increasing the severity of angular acceleration and the stress on the driving band. Separately-loaded guns would need ramming further to 'ring' the band into the rifling, increasing chamber volume and reducing velocity and consistency, hence also accuracy. Progressively oversize shells were used in the Paris Gun to cope with the severe wear incurred by the high-pressure, high-velocity shooting needed to reach the general area of Paris - and there's a persistent story that one barrel may have been blown up by firing a late-sequence shell early. But imagine the logistic nightmare of trying to supply a whole frontfull of guns with a variety of shell sizes in the same nominal calibre. I don't think it bears thinking about. Regards, MikB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippingsteel Posted 15 August , 2012 Share Posted 15 August , 2012 But imagine the logistic nightmare of trying to supply a whole frontfull of guns with a variety of shell sizes in the same nominal calibre. I don't think it bears thinking about. Very true ... I had heard about the Paris gun sequencing which in a way prompted my question - but of course a totally different situation to the common field artillery gun.! Just trying to understand what type of markings would be required on the side of a barrel ... what would the actions have been and what form would it have been recorded. Cheers, S>S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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