N White Posted 2 August , 2012 Share Posted 2 August , 2012 I was just surprised with an Arisaka. (Tricky wife!) The stock is dented a bit, but the blue is nice and the bore dusty but superb. Reading old topics on the forum I believe it was a British used one, due to the 3 circle stamp over the mum. I have two questions, did the British mark them anywhere, and also, mine has a rough oval of some gray-blue metal nailed to the butt stock and stamped "9.". Has anyone seen that before? Pictures will follow shortly, when I can. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippingsteel Posted 2 August , 2012 Share Posted 2 August , 2012 I think the "3 circle stamp" will most likely be just the arsenal marking where it was produced - (from memory it is Nagoya.? but will have to check - back soon) EDIT. Okay here is a very good website that should answer a lot of your questions about the markings that are found on the rifle. Linked HERE Cheers, S>S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippingsteel Posted 2 August , 2012 Share Posted 2 August , 2012 And here is another relatively recent thread that shows a couple of pics of British markings that can be found on the Arisaka rifles HERE Cheers, S>S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N White Posted 3 August , 2012 Author Share Posted 3 August , 2012 Here's a shot of the disc, on the right side of the stock. The buttplate is horizontal to and about 2 inches below the bottom of the picture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRANVILLE Posted 3 August , 2012 Share Posted 3 August , 2012 We have a photo in our family showing the men with rifles I didn't recognize. It transpires these are the type 30's you are interested in. http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=174994&hl= Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyE Posted 3 August , 2012 Share Posted 3 August , 2012 As I posted in the thread linked by S>S above, most but not all British service Arisakas were unit marked on the tang. A few were marked on the wood of the butt and some Royal Marine issue were marked on the tang of the butt plate. The three circle stamp on the Chrysanthemum is not the manufacturers mark but a cancellation mark showing the rifle has left Japanese service. Only weapons in Imperial service were allowed to carry the Emperor's mark. Your rifle could have seen British service but without more detailed information it is difficult to say. Is it a Type 30 or 38 and what is the serial number? Are there any other stamps on the parts I mentioned? For those of you with a burning desire to know all about British service Arisakas my book is still available (together with the other three parts on RFC, Royal Navy and Land service secondary weapons of WWI). PM me for details. Regards TonyE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippingsteel Posted 3 August , 2012 Share Posted 3 August , 2012 Is the marking you mention overstamping the 'mum'.? Much like the one shown in the photo below on a Type 38.? I think it is actually supposed to be 2 concentric circles, and as mentioned was used for marking out of Army service. Cheers, S>S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N White Posted 3 August , 2012 Author Share Posted 3 August , 2012 Tony- I was hoping you would comment. No marks on the tang or the stock, that I can see at least. Have not checked the buttplate, I will after work. The overstamp on the mum is the stacked cannonball type. Rifle is a type 30, with the hook safety, serial 308621. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippingsteel Posted 3 August , 2012 Share Posted 3 August , 2012 The overstamp on the mum is the stacked cannonball type. Rifle is a type 30, with the hook safety, serial 308621. So that will be the Koishikawa Arsenal stamp with 4 conjoined circles - which was the cancellation mark used on the earlier rifles. (Photos are really helpful.!) Cheers, S>S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyE Posted 3 August , 2012 Share Posted 3 August , 2012 The serial numbers of the Type 30 rifles supplied to the UK were fairly wide ranging, presumably because they were drawn from the whole stock of Type 30s that were by then surplus to Japanese requirements. The lowest number I have recorded is 102651 which was issued to the 2nd Dragoons and the highest 477067 issued to 6th Northumberland Fusiliers. I have notes of two other T30 rifles with 300,000 serial numbers. Picture shows a T30 with similar cancellation of the 'mum to yours. This is the stacked cannonball logo of Tokyo Artillery Arsenal, Koishikawa District and also appears as the manufacturers mark on the left receiver wall. (third picture) The second shows a typical British unit marking to the 4th East Lancs., although this is on a T38. Regards TonyE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyE Posted 3 August , 2012 Share Posted 3 August , 2012 I have just had a look at another database of Type 30 rifles and it is interesting that several in the same serial number range as yours have seen Finnish service. Finland captured numbers of Arisakas from the Russians (who had about 600,000, of which about 130,000 came from the British)) and when the remaining British Arisakas were sold in 1919 it is known they ended up in Finland. It would be fascinating if there was an "SA" mark on yours indicating Finnish service. Regards TonyE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N White Posted 3 August , 2012 Author Share Posted 3 August , 2012 All right, home from work, and I went over it in detail, and disassembled. No sign of British marks on the tang, stock, or buttplate. The only weird marks are the small disc nailed to the stock, and under the barrel I found "HSAK". Is that normal? Pic below. The crevices in the stock are filled with coarse yellow sand. Also, looks like I fat fingered the serial, its 306261. Posting all this from my phone, with moderate success... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyE Posted 4 August , 2012 Share Posted 4 August , 2012 I am no expert on the various internal markings of Arisakas, my interest and knowledge is limited to their British service. I had a look in my copy of "The Early Arisakas" but could see no similar markings. Your best bet is to ask on Gunboards Japanese forum; that is where the real experts like Frank Allan, Doss White and Stan Zielinski hang out. http://forums.gunboa...s=&daysprune=10 S>S - The two concentric ring cancellation you showed is thought to indicate that the rifle has transferred from Imperial Army service to a civil government organisation such as prison guards or police. Regards TonyE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N White Posted 19 August , 2012 Author Share Posted 19 August , 2012 Follow up on my Arisaka. I posted on a Japanese arms specific forum, and the consensus was that the stock disc was a rack number from some non Japanese service. I was then informed that my rear sight is not original, but an Austrian replacement. Original sights are graduated to 2000, mine view up to 2600. Apparently after capturing and reusing a good deal of Japanese weapons the Austrians replaced the rear sights and rechambered them for 6.5x54 ms. The one odd thing is, I happen to have a Mannlicher, and ammo for it. 6.5x54 doesn't come close to chambering, the Arisaka is still in 6.5x50, despite the modified sight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeS0000 Posted 30 August , 2012 Share Posted 30 August , 2012 That is a beauty! Somewhere I have a T30 Arisaka that was Russian used and captured by the Austrians, who modified the rear sight and added their own sight leaf. Beat to ...., but an interesting piece. Will see if I can find the photos. Best regards! - Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khaki Posted 11 September , 2013 Share Posted 11 September , 2013 I have just bought but not taken possesion of an Arisaka rifle 6.5, it has the Tokyo 3 ring receiver marking , no mum, never was one,. Some thought it might be a trainer, however it has a rifled barrel, working magazine, bayonet boss and all the general appearances of a normal Japanese Arisaka, also it has one gas vent hole in the top of the receiver. no serial number and a large Japanes character type cartouche on the right side of the butt. All the wood is one piece. I really dont know what period it is yet until I bring it home and can do some detailed research. Any thoughts in the meantime?khaki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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