Uniforms

[munchkin]

Hi All,

I have a photo of a chap in uniform. One of the pals has helped me out, by telling me that the medal ribbon is of Boar war origin. I was wondering how much the uniform would have changed by ww1. I dont know if this uniform is Boar war or ww1. Any help would be appreciated.

Glynn.

[Joe Sweeney]

Glynn,

The uniform actually changed considerably. He is wearing what is called Service Dress. It was formally introduced to the Army as a classification of wear in Jan 1902 (the articles of clothing that made up Serrvice Dres were all introduced in 1901.). SD was introduced for wear at home or abroad but was initially issued only to Home Stations, excluding Guards, and troops returning from South Africa. Some experimental issue did occur in South Africa but this was minor. Uniforms worn in SA varied considerable to the one pictured.

The uniform worn by this soldier is WWI vintage or could be a few years before.

The Jacket was actually introduced in 1901, but as introduced it looked a bit different from the one in the photo. It had detachable shoulder straps, Pleated waste and the like. This would be very noticable in photos. The jacket would evolve over the next decade. The waist pleats in 1902 removed in 1902. The removable shoulder straps wre replaced by twisted shoulder cords in 1903. The last major change occured in 1904 when the shoulder cord was replaced by fixed shoulder straps like are found in your photo. There were lots of other little detail changes but would be difficult to tell in this photo.

Although this type jacket was introduced in 1904, the photo does not date that early. It would not be until 1906-1907 that this type jacket became more common in wear over the jacket with the shoulder cords. It would not be until 1908 that the army standardized, make mandatory, the wear of the type jacket seen in the photo and all other versions withdrawn.

The photo dates after 1908, because, when in 1908 all other versions of the jacket were withdrawn the wear of brass shoulder titles in lieu of the cloth titles were made mandatory.

So in my opinion the photo post dates 1908.

Joe Sweeney

[munchkin]

Joe,

Thanks, this is one of my ancestors but i dont know his name or anything about him. Your information is very helpful to me. I can now start looking for him as a soldier pre -ww1.

Thanks

Glynn.

[Fromelles]

Joe,

Was there much difference in the colour, cut and/or wool from tunic to tunic? and also was the manufacture of Service Dress (SD) contracted out to private firms etc or was it all kept within the confinds of the War Dept (or who ever it was).

The reason I'm asking is that as a collector of WW1 Aussie I'm almost of the opinion that no two tunics were alike. Partly due to the large number of civilian contractors and partly due to the fact the Aussie SD was only starting to replace the older Commonwealth Pattern uniform, but colour, texture, even sight pattern changes with omissions and additions seem to be the norm. On parade they must of looked a pretty rough lot. Whereas most if not all the British SD I've seen seems to be very standardised. Is this the case?

Does anyone out there know any details concerning British Manufactured Aussie Tunics? any contractor details, dates of initial issues etc (I believe it started in late 16 or most definitely by 1917)

Anyones help would be most appreciated

Cheers

Dan

[Joe Sweeney]

Dan,

You can always find variance of any uniform item compared side by side but the RACD did try to maintain control.

Pre war--The RACD not only pattern sealed the actual Jackets but also the Serge wool used in manufacture. Pre-war manufacture was confined to a small number of civilian manuafturers and the Royal Army Clothing Factory (RACF).

When war was declared the manufacturing base was exponentially expanded to include huge numbers of contract clothing manufacturers. Actually the simplified patterns that were issued in 1914 were to facilitate the rapid expansion of industry.

During the war 6 alternate types of Serge Drab Mixture were approved for use in manufacturing SD Jackets--Serge DM No’s 1, 2,3 and 4 Serge DM piece dyed, and Serge DM Heavy Special.

I have most if not all of the RACD Sealed Pattern approval dates on Australian uniforms to be manufactured under War Office contracts in the UK. I'll look them and post by the week-end.

Joe Sweeney

[Joe Sweeney]

Dan,

The RACD approved the "Jacket SD Australian" with pattern 9027/1916. This was approved during July 1916 and was released to industry there after. It was declared obsolete on 6 Jan 1920.

The "Hat, Smasher, felt mixture, AIF" was approved with 8958/1916 during June 1916.

This pattern was modified and relaced by pattern 9692/1917, 10 October 1917, which changed the material and colour. Change approved by AIF. Obsoleted in January 1920

Breeches dismounted for Australians original pattern approval was not found but the pattern was cut to revised specifications on 14 Aug 1918 and pattern 3019/1918 issued. It was obsoleted in Jan 1920.

Hope this is of interest,

Joe Sweeney

[grantsmil]

Joe,

Do you know where I can get the details of the pattern and the modifications of:

"Hat, Smasher, felt mixture, AIF" approved with 8958/1916 during June 1916, to the pattern 9692/1917, 10 October 1917?

Cheers

Grant

[Joe Sweeney]

Grant,

Sorry for the late reply.

The British RACD recorded very little in the way of information on these articles during the war. They do refere to specific specification numbers but I have not located that information. If I could find that magic repository of specifications my research would be made so much easier.

The LoC kept by the QMG "stores" is far more methodical than the registers kept by the RACD.

Some specifications are included in the RACD registries but most are not to include the AIF uniform items.

The 1916 accepted items are from the one missing ledger in the NA. I had to reconstruct the numbers by back tracking.

That is the 1917 acceptance info stated what was changed on the 1916 pattern. So I know when the first pattern was approved but no details only the change that was made in 1917.

Joe Sweeney