Who was the top escaper during the Great War?

[Lt Colonel Gerald Smyth]

I recently read the autobiography of Major 'Hoppy' Hardy of the Connaught Rangers who was captured in 1914 after only three days of combat and spent over three years as a POW, making 12 escape attempts and succeeding in breaking out in 4 of them, eventually making his way home in the spring of 1918 to rejoin the fighting and add a bar to his military cross (and DSO and later MiD) at the cost of a bullet in the stomach and an amputated leg (not that this stopped Hardy who served as an intelligence officer in the Irish Troubles 1920-22, forged a career as a successful novellist and commanded an anti-aircraft battery in World War 2). In the foreword of his autobiography Sir Arthur Conan Doyle states that 'A more gallant gentleman never lived' I wondered does he hold the record for the top number of escapes? (escapes defined as getting away from his captors/out of imprisonment rather than a 'Home Run' back to an allied or neutral country)

[centurion]

In terms of distance covered etc (China to Germany via Japan and Britain) with a home run at the end of it the ultimate escaper of WW1 has to be the German airman Gunther Plüschow who broke the previous record (India to France) held for over 120 years by Sergeant Bernadotte (yes that Bernadotte) since the AWI.

His grandson was once German ambassador to Britain (the one that Ian Hislop kept poking fun at on HIGNFY)

[Doug Johnson]

I would presume that this would have to be restricted to English (as per the war time definition) prisoners. There are difficulties in establishing the number of break outs even when so limited, researching French, Russian, Germans from France etc would be nearly impossible. The difficulties in researching the "English" are that;

A - We have only a few published accounts of all those officers who made home runs and less for those who made attempts but did not get clean away.

B - Accounts of internment by other ranks are rare, accounts by other rank escapers even more so.

C - Even for officers there is no comprehensive list of home run escapers let alone those who made attempts. (I have compiled a list of over 70 who I think made home runs)

Hardy was, however, celebrated as an ace escaper, actually escaping five times with one being a home run. From my limited notes the nearest I have to that is Thorn with three escapes but no home run. I also seem to remember one of the Kut officers having made numerous attempts but can not recall who. Grinnell-Milne made several attempts but I have no detailed notes to ascertain how many.

Many of the escapers and attempted escapers were decorated after the war and these are listed in the "PoW Gazette" but this does not include all escapers.

Doug

[centurion]

I would presume that this would have to be restricted to English (as per the war time definition) prisoners.

Doesn't make sense weren't there any other escapers during the war (including Scots, Welsh and Irish not to mention Germans, Hungarians, French, Polish Italian etc etc etc)?

[Lt Colonel Gerald Smyth]

Doesn't make sense weren't there any other escapers during the war (including Scots, Welsh and Irish not to mention Germans, Hungarians, French, Polish Italian etc etc etc)?

Yeah I meant everyone both Axis and Allies, I think perhaps Doug just said English when he meant British?

It's odd, the escapers in WW2 are famous and celebrated but you seldom hear of those from WW1, I've never even seen a WW1 escaper film except for Hardy's own 'Everything is Thunder'

[nils d]

By definition the top escaper is someone who doesnt get recaught , so arguably "That madman Hardy" is a bad escaper.A J Evans got out a few times, more than Thorne.

Actually Hardy is a top contender but l dont know how "gallant" he was,as in Ireland he was very rough with IRA prisoners (the ironry).

l read somewhere (On THis site?) of a French officers book MY 12 ESCAPES.

Havent heard of Hardys film before.Any details please? The only one that comes to mind is Jean Reniors Le Grand Illusion.

[Lt Colonel Gerald Smyth]

By definition the top escaper is someone who doesnt get recaught , so arguably "That madman Hardy" is a bad escaper.A J Evans got out a few times, more than Thorne.

Actually Hardy is a top contender but l dont know how "gallant" he was,as in Ireland he was very rough with IRA prisoners (the ironry).

l read somewhere (On THis site?) of a French officers book MY 12 ESCAPES.

Havent heard of Hardys film before.Any details please? The only one that comes to mind is Jean Reniors Le Grand Illusion.

Madman is a bit strong although I'm sure plenty of men such as him would have experienced 'shellshock' and been 'wire happy' (what we now call PTSD) Having been 'on the run' himself so many times and bluffed his way out of so many tough situations Hardy was the ideal man for interrogating prisoners, he'd experienced it from the other side. Remember Hardy is the man who has to pick the corpses of the IRA's victims up from the street so I doubt he had much sympathy for them and nor do I, he and King doubtless saved many lives. He's plenty gallant, you should read his autobiograpy 'I, Escape' and remember this is a man who won the MC with Bar, DSO and a Mention in Dispatches (the latter after he lost his leg), and volunteered to return to the front early after he makes it back to the UK not to mention his service in Ireland and WW2

As for the films he wrote based on his life;

The Key

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0027590/

http://en.wikipedia...._Key_(1934_film)

Everything is Thunder

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0025346/

http://en.wikipedia....hing_Is_Thunder

I'm not sure if you can buy them on DVD or view them online. I'm still looking for the Life and Times of David Lloyd George

[Doug Johnson]

Hi guys,

I actually meant English, in terms of its WW1 German definition which included anyone from the British Empire including Indians, South Africans, the odd American, Chinese etc, etc. all of them appearing in German documents as English.

Researching Central Powers is almost impossible apart from the UK where Graham Mark's book has a list of escape reports. Assuming the Otto Thelen reports all relate to the same person then he got out of Donington, Holyport and Kegworth and was caught digging his way out Holyport for a second attempt there.

WW1 escapers not being famous is an understatement. Many ORs are sure to have made repeated attempts of which there are no records. ORs getting away from their guards was a lot easier than for officers as many ORs worked in the open and many were treated almost as trusted workers able to work without guards. "Three times and Out" which records M C Simmonds attempts and success is one of the few good accounts though Simmonds does not appear to have been decorated for his efforts (I have yet to find out anything about him other than through his book)

The Holzminden tunnel is the most famous escape as far as we are concerned but I suspect that the French and Russians were just as successful but their attempts have gone unrecorded or unrecognised.

The shortage of WW1 escape films may change shortly as I believe one may be in the pipeline.

My notes on Evans are not comprehensive enough to identify how many attempts he made, they merely record where he was interned which is the main purpose of the notes and his final escape (in transit).

One of Thorn's escapes was also at Holzminden but not via the tunnel.

Doug

[tipperary]

I also would regard a top escaper as someone who got away, the serial escapers may have been prolific but if they could not stay escaped they were hardly the best or top of their trade. Having said that each and everyone of them have my respect for what they faced, doubt if i would have been up to them.The again they were also causing the enemy harrasment and wasted manpower so were serving a purpose in that role as well.john

[Lt Colonel Gerald Smyth]

I also would regard a top escaper as someone who got away, the serial escapers may have been prolific but if they could not stay escaped they were hardly the best or top of their trade. Having said that each and everyone of them have my respect for what they faced, doubt if i would have been up to them.The again they were also causing the enemy harrasment and wasted manpower so were serving a purpose in that role as well.john

Who is more admirable, he who escapes once and makes it home first time or he who escapes again and again 'meeting with triumph and disaster and treating those imposters both the same'?

I wonder if anyone ever made more than one 'Home Run'? In which case they would have to have been captured more than once which seems a little careless. I remember hearing one story (possibly by Richard Holmes?) of a pair of soldiers who escaped in the early days of the war and spent almost 4 years in hiding with French civilians?

[wow123]

If I can refer you to my post re POW German East Africa, Charles Black was from Londonderry- born and bred just outside the city-if you wish to PM me

[Lt Colonel Gerald Smyth]

If I can refer you to my post re POW German East Africa, Charles Black was from Londonderry- born and bred just outside the city-if you wish to PM me

Wow, local boy, yes please!

[nils d]

A J Evans technically escaped twice having been recaught by the Turks.Yes thats unlucky if not careless.

"That madman" is a quote by German guards.lts a back-handed compliment.

l agree , repeat escapers deserve credit for failing in such a way as to cause their captors maximum trouble.Pity it seems that the only ones to get a book published were the successful escapers.

[Lt Colonel Gerald Smyth]

A J Evans technically escaped twice having been recaught by the Turks.Yes thats unlucky if not careless.

"That madman" is a quote by German guards.lts a back-handed compliment.

l agree , repeat escapers deserve credit for failing in such a way as to cause their captors maximum trouble.Pity it seems that the only ones to get a book published were the successful escapers.

Well that's always going to be the case, same then as now. On a similar topic was anyone a POW escaper in WW1 and WW2? I remember reading about several men who'd endured capture by the Japanese in WW2 only to be recalled to the colours and captured again in Korea.

[rob elliott]

Hi,

One of the best i know to is drummer Samuel Kydd of the 2nd Inniskillings. He reportedly evaded capture by the Germans behind their lines for 3 years, at St Quentin.

He was caught, sentenced to be shot, but for whatever reason not executed.

How accurate this is i'm not sure as it comes from a newspaper of the 9th February 1939, which reported his drowning in the river Foyle in the City while at work.

He apparently left his drum with a frenchwoman during the retreat who then passed it to the Canadians during the later advance, where it was then returned to the Inniskillings.

He came from 75 Fountain St Londonderry.

Rob

[Lt Colonel Gerald Smyth]

Hi,

One of the best i know to is drummer Samuel Kydd of the 2nd Inniskillings. He reportedly evaded capture by the Germans behind their lines for 3 years, at St Quentin.

He was caught, sentenced to be shot, but for whatever reason not executed.

How accurate this is i'm not sure as it comes from a newspaper of the 9th February 1939, which reported his drowning in the river Foyle in the City while at work.

He apparently left his drum with a frenchwoman during the retreat who then passed it to the Canadians during the later advance, where it was then returned to the Inniskillings.

He came from 75 Fountain St Londonderry.

Rob

My family actually come from the Fountain area, I must ask them if they've heard of him?

Whilst we're on the subject did any Central powers prisoners ever make it home? I know in WW2 there was only one and they made a film of it 'The One that got Away' with Hardy Kruger

[rob elliott]

Hi,

Grandmothers brother was 9th Inniskillings from Fountain St, her other brother 10th Inniskillings from Lower Bennett St and my grandfather

36th division REs'from Lewis St Rosemount.

What were your peopes names, as i have the 1914 UVF rolls, can do a check.

Rob