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The Great War (1914-1918) Forum

Remembered Today:

Sleeve Insignia


DaveR
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Can anyone identify the badge on the soldier's left arm near the cuff? From the shoulder badge and cap badge I believe he served with the King's (Liverpool) Regiment.

thanks

Dave Risley

post-23-1091002564.jpg

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Looks to me like an 'LG' ie Lewis Gunner. I think these were commonly worn from 1917, but somebody else will almost certainly know more precisely than I...

I think you're spot on with King's Regiment badge id.

Cheers

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thanks

Dave

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Concur;LG:~ Lewis Gunner,there was also HG[Hotchkiss Gunner],MG[Machine Gunner]amongst other {some later} worn sleeve badges for such operators

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Notice how he`s posed so as to show off the badge to best effect? It`s an acquired technique! You must have been guilty of it at times, HB! Reminds me of the standard expression in my time - NCO points at stripes and says "What do you think this is - birds*it!" Phil B

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  • 2 weeks later...

Question on sleeve badges:

What would a WW1 sniper cloth badge look like and where would it be worn?

I have a (not-very-good) picture of a relative who served with the "Van-Doos" 22nd (French-Canadians) CEF. From distant memories, it was said that he'd won marksman contests (his metis brother-in-law trained him since he was a kid).

On the picture, he is wearing a badge of cross rifles at the bottom of his right sleeve.

Would that be it? Anyone has a clear picture of one?

Any comments will be appreciated.

Juice

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Juice,

I'm sure the crossed rifles badge you are talking about was awarded to marksmen and snipers wore a Fleur D' Lys badge ( also worn by scouts).

This is off the top of my head, If you don't get a more precise answer I'll look up the details for you.

Roger.

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LG inside a laurel wreath, as worn by my Grandfather, I remember him saying they attached them by two threads so they could rip them off if captured as the 1918 Stormtroopers had a habit of shooting machine gunners.

Aye

Malcolm

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Roger

is this the scout badge you mean?

it's from michael stedmans book, Manchester Pals, hope he won't mind

the text reads ' Scout Sergeant Bert Payne. Also shown is the scouting badge which he wore proudly throughout his service'

post-23-1092089609.jpg

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Thats the one. I'll see if I can find the reference but I'm pretty certain it was worn by Trained snipers aswell as scouts.

Roger.

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From Brassey's World War One British army by Stephen Bull,

Crossed Rifles(and variations) Lower left sleeve, Marksmen, also instructors.

Fleur-De-Lys (or S in wreath) Upper right sleeve, Scout or Sniper.

Roger.

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Roger,

Thank you for your excellent answer. Obviously, the picture I am referring to, was taken while in training in Canada in 1915, before going overseas (he is not wearing the famous "battle order" badges either). At that time, there was a lot less standardization between the army corps. This is probably why he is wearing the cross rifles on the right sleeve, instead of the official BEF way, which would be on the left sleeve.

Many thanks,

Juice

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Your very welcome Juice. I must admit I haven't seen any photo's of the snipers wreathed S badge.

I wonder if any Forum members have?

Roger.

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Here is a picture of my grandfather John 'Jock' Nimmo with his sister. You can see his 'S' with wreath and crossed rifles above his wound stripes. No prizes for guessing the regiment, but have ago anyway

post-23-1092819903.jpg

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Jamie

I would have a stab at 10th Battalion Highland Light Infantry ;)

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Here is a picture of my grandfather John 'Jock' Nimmo with his sister. You can see his 'S' with wreath and crossed rifles above his wound stripes. No prizes for guessing the regiment, but have ago anyway

Sorry, that is not the scout 'S in wreath badge'. Let me explain about this badge. The British Army in India were administered by the [british] Indian Government, who paid for everything as the price for having the army there. They were extremely mean. This even extended to flinching from the first and second class scout badges in either brass or worsted or gold, except for cavalry. The PBI were issued with a small S in a very small wreath, possibly the first badge to use a wreath. I know of a few such badges worn on the Western Front by men returning from India but they were not Issue items to BEF.

In the war the functions of scouts, infantry observers and snipers became rather blurred, but the fleur-de-lys was never specifically for snipers ......... indeed few snipers wore a badge of any sort, although one infantry CO issued a special badge at his own expense. To be captured wearing a sniping badge was to invite a bayonet in the gizzard.

In 1942 a snipers badge was authorised, with crossed rifles at an acute angle [ie close at muzzles and butts]. You needed to be daft to wear it in combat.

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Thanks LangleyBaston for your reply

I never said that the badge worn by my grandfather was a 'Scout' badge, i was following on the previous reply making reference to the snipers badge and wreath. However i neglected to say that the photo shows what i understand is a snipers badge.

Jamie

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Just picked up on this thread --- in regards to the SNIPER/SCOUT( fleur de

lys) badge:

Several months ago I mounted a CEF group for a friend & collector. He had a photograph of the recipient, & this man appears to be wearing the badge that has been under discussion. The fellow was a member of the 2nd Batt'n C.E.F. & saw action with that Batt'n in F & F. He wears the badge on his left sleeve above his two wound stripes.

I will attach a scan of the studio photo & try to also attach a close up of the badge. I am not a CEF collector so any comments on the badge would be appreciated.......

thanks in advance,

Bryan

post-23-1093033072.jpg

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Here (hopefully) is the closeup ..........

post-23-1093033412.jpg

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I notice that the bottom of the badge appears to be different than the one illustrated by harribobs.

Were there variations on this badge??

& I wonder if anyone has a 'real life' example they could show on the forum??

Bryan

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Bryan

re the 'scout' badge (with fleur de lys)

i've never seen one in the flesh but missed out on buying one on ebay very recently ( and i am still annoyed about it and i wish i'd have downloaded his pics)

i'm not so sure the two badges are so different, it's hard to tell from the angle

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Total three badges, plus worsted, gold wire variants. And some unique to a few regiments who made up their own, complete with crossed lances eg.

S in small wreath, not a typical wreath badge; fleur de lys without exteded tail and cross bar [2nd class or company scout]; and fleur de lys with tail and cross-bar, first class or regimental scout. And, yes, I have a full set! But then I did my collecting 20 years ago.

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