Harold II Posted 22 October , 2011 Share Posted 22 October , 2011 For decades we have wondered what exactly these shells are. They were "made" by my wife's grandmother possibly in Whitehaven in WW1 - 90 years of constant polishing has obliterated the markings on the brash tops and there are no markings elsewhere. Very gratefuf for an answer. [ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikB Posted 23 October , 2011 Share Posted 23 October , 2011 First guess might be (L.) 18-pounder, (R.) 13-pounder ? Ogives are both rough and look as if they were turned with a tool that ought to have been reground about 10 pieces ago... Regards, MikB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold II Posted 23 October , 2011 Author Share Posted 23 October , 2011 Are you insulting the good lady's war effort! Seriously would it help if I weighed them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnreed Posted 23 October , 2011 Share Posted 23 October , 2011 These are neither 13lb or 18lb shells not the length or correct driving bands. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Tom Posted 23 October , 2011 Share Posted 23 October , 2011 The diameter of the shells would help more. From the picture they might be some 80 plus mm. I defer to John's artillery knowledge, but note that the 18 pdr was 84 mm. I don't know of other army ordnance of about that calibre, perhaps they are naval. Old Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnreed Posted 23 October , 2011 Share Posted 23 October , 2011 Shrapnel Shell length uncluding Fuze Plug 9.22 inches H.E. Shell length 9.55 inches (there is no Fuze Plug) used in this round. Diameter 3.29 inches. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikB Posted 24 October , 2011 Share Posted 24 October , 2011 Are you insulting the good lady's war effort! No, the responsibility for sharpening the tool would have been the section setter's. This would usually have been a man, precision toolsetting being a reserved occupation. John, having looked at some drawings of a couple of shrapnel and HE marks, I take your point about dimensions, but there aren't very many other candidates so close in size. Regards, MikB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Tom Posted 29 October , 2011 Share Posted 29 October , 2011 We still need an accurate diameter. I wonder if Harold has a pair of calipers, or even flexible tape and a calculator. John has said that the driving bands are wrong for the 18pdr. Does anyone recognise the type this might provide a lead. I'm very curious. Old Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnreed Posted 7 November , 2011 Share Posted 7 November , 2011 I don't think they are British Shells due to the shape of the Driving Bands. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockdoc Posted 7 November , 2011 Share Posted 7 November , 2011 Bear in mind that the British also manufactured shells for their allies at times so these could be for French or Russian guns. Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 7 November , 2011 Share Posted 7 November , 2011 I don't think they are British Shells due to the shape of the Driving Bands. John Would you please give a source for that intriguing illustration? Thanks! Trajan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnreed Posted 7 November , 2011 Share Posted 7 November , 2011 Treatise on Ammunition dated 1915. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truthergw Posted 7 November , 2011 Share Posted 7 November , 2011 I have no idea what kind of shells these are but the fact that the lady was allowed(?) to take them suggests that they may have been rejects and that may be attributed to the rough finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold II Posted 1 December , 2011 Author Share Posted 1 December , 2011 Firstly, please accept my apologies for not posting more information on this Thread - I am not familiar with navigating the site and was unaware that there had been so many contributions. Sorry! I have measured the diameter by two different methods and both shells are the same diameter and the best accuracy I can get is 82 to 83 mms diameter. When I examine the slightly smaller ie the one on the right in the picture above, I believe there are some markings on the brass end piece which read as No 1 E (but very indistinct might be C) GALT c 18" On the body there are some numbers but not in a line 50 35 and possibly a capital C and a P below these marks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Tom Posted 1 December , 2011 Share Posted 1 December , 2011 Harold, Thanks for the diameter, this seems to indicate manufacture for weapons other than British. With luck someone may be able to suggest which. Franch and German field guns were 75 mm or there abouts and larger calibres 100 mm and greater. Do not worry about your delay, as you will have noted your last post is shown at, or near, the top of the list and is soon noticed. Regards, Old Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieBris Posted 1 December , 2011 Share Posted 1 December , 2011 Not many WW1 guns with calibres around 83mm - the most obvious is the British 18 Pounder (83.8mm). The different profiles of the shells may be consistent with HE and smoke rounds. I wonder if the brass plugs were part of the manufacturing process to prevent condensation in the shell casings before filling. Regards, Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RodB Posted 7 December , 2011 Share Posted 7 December , 2011 What would help : Precise (i.e. in fractions of mm) shell length & diameter. 18 pounder diameter tolerances were about 3.28 - 3.29 inches. Photos of shell bases. Fuse socket measurements. Unscrew the plugs - that would show us the thread pattern. 18-pounder fuzes had 2-inch diameter threads, 14 threads per inch. For an 18-pounder HE shell there was no fuze socket, the threads were cut in the shell wall and the fuze screwed straight in; for a shrapnel shell there was typically a fuze socket of approx 2.495 inch diameter - i,e. that was the thread cut in the actual shell wall, and the inner diameter of the socket was 2 inch to take the fuze. Rod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold II Posted 7 December , 2011 Author Share Posted 7 December , 2011 Unscrew the plugs They don't look as though they would unscrew easily and if I scratch them my life will not be worth living. What is the best method - I was thinking of using squared ended bar wrapped in cloth - will I have to put the shell in a vice in order to get sufficient pressure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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