DEATH PLAQUES; were they ever reclaimed...?

[headgardener]

Inspired by a recent thread about a man's medals, and presumably his plaque, being reclaimed and scrapped after the war - I thought I'd ask if anyone knew what the relevant rules were regarding death plaques....?

King's Regulations allowed for the Army Medal Office to reclaim medals under a variety of circumstances, but presumably these rules didn't apply to plaques.

The best way of establishing whether this happened would be be either;

reference to the 'rules' about plaques, OR

finding if someone has a plaque that was issued to a man whose medals were returned to the AMO and were never re-issued.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this.....?

[Old Owl]

Hi,

Memorial Plaques and Scrolls were given/sent to a soldier's next-of-kin and not the soldier(obviously!!), so on that basis I cannot see how the AMO could lay any claim to these.

The only people who reclaimed Memorial Plaques(sadly)were scrap metal merchants--I believe that thousands fell to this fate and into the melting pot--similar to BWMs with the hike in the price of silver.

Regards, Robert

[sutton-in-craven]

Interesting question Headgardener, not sure of the answer I'm afraid.

Like Robert I've heard many instances of medals being returned / claimed back by the issuing authorities, but never once heard of a Death Plaque being sent back.

A lot of people think that casualty medals without the Death Plaque is a 'broken group'. But the plaque was issued independently of the medals and has nothing to do with the medal entitlement.

I have also heard horrific stories, again as Robert mentions, about huge stacks of Death Plaques being spotted at scrap merchants in years gone by awaiting the melting pot.

[clive_hughes]

Not quite reclaimed, but the German bomb which lost us millions of personnel files at the Arnside Street warehouse in September 1940 also deleted many other MOD records and artifacts.

The list of lost items included an unknown quantity of unclaimed Death Plaques and King's Certificates (for those discharged disabled).

LST_164

[headgardener]

Andrew, Robert, LST,

Thanks thanks very much for your comments.

HG

[Chris_Baker]

There is a significant difference in the way that plaques and medals were issued, and it may have a bearing on the chances of a plaque ever being reclaimed.

Unlike the medals, which were automtically sent to the man or his NOK, the plaque and associated scroll were only released after the NOK had completed and returned a form, sent to them by the War Office. This form, which is often seen in dead men's service records, required the NOK to describe the man's parentage, wife, siblings and descendants. The WO would then determine the appropriate recipient (normally the NOK who filled in the form but I can imagine circumstances where this might not be true) and send the plaque and scroll. Unless the "dead" man turned up somewhere later, it is hard to see how or why the plaque would be reclaimed.

[sutton-in-craven]

Not quite reclaimed, but the German bomb which lost us millions of personnel files at the Arnside Street warehouse in September 1940 also deleted many other MOD records and artifacts.

The list of lost items included an unknown quantity of unclaimed Death Plaques and King's Certificates (for those discharged disabled).LST_164

This is very interesting. I knew that perhaps 70% of WW2 service files were destroyed during the 1940 London Blitz, but didn't know the exact location

Unlike the medals, which were automtically sent to the man or his NOK, the plaque and associated scroll were only released after the NOK had completed and returned a form, sent to them by the War Office. This form, which is often seen in dead men's service records, required the NOK to describe the man's parentage, wife, siblings and descendants. The WO would then determine the appropriate recipient (normally the NOK who filled in the form but I can imagine circumstances where this might not be true) and send the plaque and scroll. Unless the "dead" man turned up somewhere later, it is hard to see how or why the plaque would be reclaimed.

Likewise Chris, I wasn't aware of the difference is issuing the medals vesus the Death Plaque/Scroll, so this is all good stuff.

You mention somewhat tongue in cheek "unless the 'dead' man turned up sometime later", I've certainly heard of this happening after WW2 where Japanese soldiers emerge from the jungle 30 years later. I wonder whether this also happened on the battlefields of WW1, where medals & Death Plaque/Scroll were issued to the next of kin, only to find out later that the 'deceased' is alive & well in a convalescent home in the south of England suffering from amnesia?......for example!