~ NZEF ~

[Wendy Macpherson]

Hello all

A question about John EBBETT's sleeve insignia please.

John trained in New Zealand with the 18th Reinforcement Specialists Machine-Gun Section, so what are the two crossed rifles on his left sleeve for.

Would anyone have a close up image of these rifles please.

His collar dogs and cap insignia are embellished with a machine gun and two signallers flags encircled with the silver fern.

Wendy

[Khaki]

The crossed rifles just indicate a marksman qualification, which he probably earned in his basic infantry training before becoming a machine gunner

khaki

[FROGSMILE]

Hello all

A question about John EBBETT's sleeve insignia please.

John trained in New Zealand with the 18th Reinforcement Specialists Machine-Gun Section, so what are the two crossed rifles on his left sleeve for.

Would anyone have a close up image of these rifles please.

His collar dogs and cap insignia are embellished with a machine gun and two signallers flags encircled with the silver fern.

Wendy

The Trained Soldiers annual classification with the rifle consisted of 250 rounds fired at ranges from 100 to 600 yards, with the firer kneeling or lying, for some practices with bayonets fixed, and with a so-called 'mad minute' when he fired 15 rounds rapid at a target 300 yards away. Part III of the classification shoot decided a man's marksmanship standard. He fired fifty rounds from various ranges (distances) at a target with three scoring rings, earning 4 points for a 'bull' (24 inches wide), 3 points for an 'inner' and 2 points for an 'outer'. The highest possible score was 200 points, and to qualify as a marksman a soldier needed 130 points; 105 made him a first-class shot, and 70 a second-class shot. Field Service Regulations defined ranges (distances) of 600 yards and under as 'close', 600 to 1,400 yards as 'effective', 1,400 to 2,000 yards as 'long' and 2,000 to 2,800 yards (which required a special, 'volley firing' sight fitted to the Mark III SMLE) as 'distant'.

Marksmanship did not simply consist of shooting on the range, but also included judging distance and understanding enough theory of small arms fire to be able to aim off for wind or at a moving target, and to understand what was meant by the 'beaten zone' covered by fire at any given range. Rifles were 'zeroed' (correlated) to individual firers, and the rifles butt number (ID) was recorded in a soldiers personal record, his 'small book'. Marksmanship badges of crossed rifles were worn by all marksmen below the rank of warrant officer (as at 1914) and their were special distinctions for the best shot in each company (crossed rifles and star up to JNCO, crossed rifles and crown for SNCOs) and the battalion's JNCOs competed for a crossed rifles and star within a laurel wreath and its SNCOs for a crossed rifles and crown within a laurel wreath. In theory an individual could bear several of these badges simultaneously and the seriousness with which they were regarded is plain.

Initially men selected to be machine gunners were often marksmen and held a 'first class weapon handling certificate', but this was down to battalion policy and as the effect of casualties became increasingly felt there was more pragmatism and less of a 'gold plated' attitude, so that men with lesser standards could apply and be considered on individual merits beyond those relating to marksmanship. The initial reasoning was about a man's dexterity with his hands, ability to think and act fast and his understanding of the marksmanship principles and the theory of small arms fire. All of these attributes had to be well developed in a man holding the marksman qualification and this made him a natural candidate for the machine gun section.

The three larger badges in the centre and top below are of the WW1 pattern.

[Wendy Macpherson]

Thanks khaki's for your speedy reply. I've just found another photo/postcard of another chap who was a sniper with the NZEF 3rd Canterbury Bn , he also has this insignia on his sleeve.

FROGSMILE: Great stuff! Thanks for the great information and picture

Wendy

[Bardess]

Thanks for such an informative post Frogsmile

[FROGSMILE]

Thanks khaki's for your speedy reply. I've just found another photo/postcard of another chap who was a sniper with the NZEF 3rd Canterbury Bn , he also has this insignia on his sleeve.

FROGSMILE: Great stuff! Thanks for the great information and picture

Wendy

Snipers did not officially have a 'special' badge in WW1 (although some units might have created their own), but such a badge was created for WW2 by the simple expedient of adding an 'S' above the crossed rifles.

[FROGSMILE]

Thanks for such an informative post Frogsmile

My pleasure Diane, I have edited the details on badges to show more fully the extent of the motivational scheme.

[Wendy Macpherson]

Thanks for that extra information FROGSMILE, have added it to my folder

[FROGSMILE]

Thanks for that extra information FROGSMILE, have added it to my folder

If you look online for a photo of Prince William at his Sandhurst Passing Out Parade, just as the Queen passes him in the ranks, look at his lower left sleeve!

[Wendy Macpherson]

Found on YouTube thanks