dundeesown Posted 26 May , 2011 Share Posted 26 May , 2011 Hi folks,I am looking for some help to identify this bayonet,is it WW1 ? German,French or British ? I can see no markings on it,any help would be very much appreciated.Length in total is 2Ft 3 inches ,blade is 1Ft 10 inches Thanks for looking folks. Gary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sawdoc34 Posted 26 May , 2011 Share Posted 26 May , 2011 Hi folks,I am looking for some help to identify this bayonet,is it WW1 ? German,French or British ? I can see no markings on it,any help would be very much appreciated.Length in total is 2Ft 3 inches ,blade is 1Ft 10 inches Thanks for looking folks. Gary. [/qu Gary, looks like a british P1856 or P1858 (any chance of a pic of top of handle/muzzle ring), more than likely german made. Aleck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4thGordons Posted 26 May , 2011 Share Posted 26 May , 2011 (edited) Hi folks,I am looking for some help to identify this bayonet,is it WW1 ? German,French or British ? I can see no markings on it,any help would be very much appreciated.Length in total is 2Ft 3 inches ,blade is 1Ft 10 inches Thanks for looking folks. Gary. I'm away from my books and the photo is dark but it looks to me like one of the (fairly numerous variations) of the 185? "Yataghan" sword bayonets. There were several major patterns 1853,1856, 1856/58, 1858, 1860.... with various minot variations. What is the diameter of the muzzle ring? IIRC the standard blade length is 22.8" which would fit and overall about 28" so given the vagaries of measuring and my memory that would fit too. Suggest you have a search for some pictures of the 1858 Yataghan Bayonet and see if that is close. Best guess....there may be other non-British ones that are closer and of which I am ignorant. Chris Curses - too slow! at least we agree HERE IS A LINK TO ONE THAT LOOKS ABOUT RIGHT Edited 26 May , 2011 by 4thGordons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dundeesown Posted 26 May , 2011 Author Share Posted 26 May , 2011 Thank you Aleck and Chris,the bayonet in the link looks spot on, I am useless with bayonets so please humour me,what is Yataghan ? is it the maker ? and the patterns 1853,1856 and so on is that the years ?again sorry for the daft questions.The inner ring size is 3/4 of an inch.outer 1 & 1/8 of an inch approx. Do you think I should attempt to clean her up ? & was it worth the £40.00 I paid for it?. Thanks for your patience Gary. Edit.Now I have the site about Yataghan Bayonets I will leave you all in peace,thanks for the help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4thGordons Posted 26 May , 2011 Share Posted 26 May , 2011 Thank you Aleck and Chris,the bayonet in the link looks spot on, I am useless with bayonets so please humour me,what is Yataghan ? is it the maker ? and the patterns 1853,1856 and so on is that the years ?again sorry for the daft questions.The inner ring size is 3/4 of an inch.outer 1 & 1/8 of an inch approx. Do you think I should attempt to clean her up ? & was it worth the £40.00 I paid for it?. Thanks for your patience Gary. I believe that Yataghan refers to the shape of the blade but to be honest I am not certain. My recollection is that it was originally used in reference to turkish (?) sword blades with this sort of curve. Yes the "185x" years are the Pattern years (the year the bayonet design was approved). The MRD is consistent with all the major types (not the later ones that were bushed smaller to fit Martinis etc) One other way of distinguishing them is to look at the slot where it attached to the rifle as these differ slightly too. I am not familiar with prices for such things and there is going to be considerable variation depending upon which precise pattern it ends up being (some are much much more scarce than others)but I wouldn't think 40 pounds was too high given what bog-standard 1907 bayonets go for. Perhaps a search of completed items on eBay might give you an idea? Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dundeesown Posted 26 May , 2011 Author Share Posted 26 May , 2011 Just spotted one very small knights head mark at the top of the blade under the handle. Gary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sawdoc34 Posted 26 May , 2011 Share Posted 26 May , 2011 Gary, You mean like the 1 in this pic? If so it is german made as many of these were, in this case by Kirschbaum, solingen. Will have to look up the muzzle ring sizes later. Would have thought £40 is a quite reasonable price Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dundeesown Posted 26 May , 2011 Author Share Posted 26 May , 2011 Hi sawdoc thats the very mark,thank you for the information. all the best Gary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippingsteel Posted 27 May , 2011 Share Posted 27 May , 2011 The German maker with the knights-head symbol was W.R.Kirschbaum which later became Weyersberg, Kirschbaum & Cie of Solingen. This company was formed by a merger of the two firms in 1883. The bayonet is probably one of the very similar British P1856/58/60 variations. Cheers, S>S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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