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Remembered Today:

Joseph Marment, Gloucester regiment


jadzia

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Hi all,

I need some help if possible please,I am researching Joseph Marment. He was either my G.G Granddad or his son my G granddad (they had the same names one would have been 42 in 1915 and the other would have been 19, I think it maybe the younger one but i'm not sure). Joseph had three service numbers, 1247TF, 20326, 242306 and was a sergeant. He was not killed during the war but I am really struggling to find out much information about him and his service. I have attached his medal card in case it helps. does it mean anything that some of the writing is in blue and some is in red? I have not been able to find any service records or pension records etc on ancestry. I did find Joseph on a site called ‘soldiers of Gloucestershire’ that says his battalion was 1/5. My brain seems to have stopped working...so I’m a bit stuck, any help would be very much appreciated. Many thanks Vanessa :)

post-59572-0-43826800-1300951529.jpg

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Hello jadzia , from his Mic it states he was in the 1/4 Battalion

Battalions of the Territorial Force

1/4th (City of Bristol) Battalion

August 1914 : in Clifton, Bristol. Part of Gloucester and Worcester Brigade in South Midland Division. Moved on mobilisation to Swindon but very quickly on to Maldon in Essex.

30 March 1915 : landed at Boulogne.

15 May 1915 : formation became the 144th Brigade, 48th (South Midland) Division.

November 1917 : moved with the Division to Italy.

and from his mic he was entitled to the Victory medal, British war Medal and to the 1915 Star. He enter france on 31/3/1915

You are trying to find his service record!!. That could be a problem because in the second world war the German bombs destroyed most of the records and only a few were saved but badly damaged by fire and by water

Best regards

Ian

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The Fifth Glo'ster Gazette (A trench magazine of the First World War) records in the April 1917 edition his promotion to Sergeant .

It lists 20326 Cpl Marment J. No actual date of promotion given.

This would seem to indicate that he was renumbered when he moved from 1/4 Battalion to 1/5 Battalion.

Subsequently in March 1917 renumbered again with number starting 242.

The 5th Battalion suffered many casualties (including around 80 fatalities) on the 16th August 1917 when they attacked near St Julien on the first day of the Battle of Langemark.

Regards

Roger

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In the March 1918 edition of the 5th Glo'ster Gazette he is listed as one of 12 NCO's and men who have received excellent reports from their Schools:-

242306 Sgt Marment J ... Musketry (4 of 12 were for musketry) The others were for L.G. (1) , General (2), P.T. (1), Signalling (4).

Regards

Roger

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"The Gloucestershire Regiment In The War 1914-1918" by Everard Wyrall published by www.naval-military-press.com is a very good book covering the actions of the front line territorial battalions. The 4th was Bristol based and the 5th was raised in Gloucester.

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The Gloucestershire Regiment - 4th Battalion

The 4th Battalion, The Gloucestershire Regiment, was a Territorial Force battalion which was born on 1st April 1908. Its predecessor was the 1st Volunteer Battalion, The Gloucestershire Regiment. The battalion, also known as the 4th (City of Bristol) Battalion, The Gloucestershire Regiment was entirely composed of men from the Bristol area. In early 1914 its headquarters and A to E Companies were based at Queen's Road, Clifton, Bristol. F Company was at St George, Bristol and G and H Companies were also Bristol-based. (Company information courtesy of Ray Westlake's The Territorial Force 1914).

The 4th Gloucesters started numbering from 1 in 1908. Here are some sample army service numbers and corresponding joining dates between 1908 and 1916.

311 (an old 1st VB volunteer) joined on 23rd April 1908

819 joined on 7th April 1909

1056 joined on 9th February 1910

1191 joined on 16th January 1911

1514 joined on 18th January 1912

1798 joined on 21st January 1913

1953 joined on 2nd March 1914

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Wow.....thank you both so much for taking the time to help me. I'm off now to have a read through all that you have posted for me. Now I just need to work out which Joseph it was (whether it was my G.G Granddad or his son my G. granddad) I know it was definately one of them. It's such a shame I can't get his service records as they may have given me his date of birth. They were both born in Bristol. Thank you again

:)

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The 1911 Census has two called Joseph Marment living in Bristol. One aged 38 and born in 1873 and the other 16 years of age and born in 1895.

This information from a search on Findmypast website but I do not have a subscription to go any further. Census dates and ages must be treated with caution but the elder one correlates with Freebmd.

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Vanessa.

Have you tried the freeBMD.org.uk website to track down birth/marriages dates etc? - I found a Joseph Marment born in Stroud area, between Apr-Jun 1873. No other Joseph Marments are listed born until 1923, which means the 19 yr old Joseph might be called a different name? - it appears that the card originally just said "J" so maybe the son was James Marment or similar?

Take a look at FreeBMD and see if that helps, then cross ref. with the online England 1911 Census (search function) might give you clues if you can find the household - you could put "Joseph" as the main person and his c1873 birth year, and try variations of names of "others" in the household.

How is Christ Church doing after the quake? Trust you guys are OK?

Andrew

Hi Andrew,

Thank you for your reply. I have found my G G Granddad Joseph Marment b. 1874 on the 1901 census (miss transcribed as Mormant) it also has his son my G Grandad Joseph b.1896 on it. I’ve also found them on the 1911 census although I no longer have full access to it now. The Joseph Marment born in dec 1922 was my Great Uncle.

Our house is damaged, foundations, roof etc but it’s still standing. We’re still getting aftershocks & we have to boil water before using it. It’s going to be a long time before things get back to normal here but we are doing OK...thank you for asking

:)

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The 1911 Census has two called Joseph Marment living in Bristol. One aged 38 and born in 1873 and the other 16 years of age and born in 1895.

This information from a search on Findmypast website but I do not have a subscription to go any further. Census dates and ages must be treated with caution but the elder one correlates with Freebmd.

Hi Roger,

Yes that’s them. I’m still looking for a birth record for Joseph b. 1896 but I have his death record which shows his age at death & makes the census date of birth about right. Thank you for your help

:)

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Hello jadzia , from his Mic it states he was in the 1/4 Battalion

Battalions of the Territorial Force

1/4th (City of Bristol) Battalion

August 1914 : in Clifton, Bristol. Part of Gloucester and Worcester Brigade in South Midland Division. Moved on mobilisation to Swindon but very quickly on to Maldon in Essex.

30 March 1915 : landed at Boulogne.

15 May 1915 : formation became the 144th Brigade, 48th (South Midland) Division.

November 1917 : moved with the Division to Italy.

and from his mic he was entitled to the Victory medal, British war Medal and to the 1915 Star. He enter france on 31/3/1915

You are trying to find his service record!!. That could be a problem because in the second world war the German bombs destroyed most of the records and only a few were saved but badly damaged by fire and by water

Best regards

Ian

Ian - if part of the Worcesters then yes the 7th and 8th were here in town

from September 1914. the 1/8th left in the Spring of 1915.

Regards.

SPN

Maldon

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  • 3 months later...

Hi

My relative also served in the 1/4 Gloucestershire. I have a diary of Cpt. Wookey who led them for a while if your interested in having a look. Its quite a good read.

Dan

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Dan

Does it cover 16th August 1917 please?

If so can you summarise or repeat on here what he says.

Thank you

Roger

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Looking at his entries on the ''soldiers of Gloucestershire" website it shows that he joined 1/4 btn as 1247 (going by the posting from rogerh probably in early 1911).

He then transferred to 1/5 originally as 020326 then 242306.

For anybody researching people in Gloucestershire I would recommend the Gloucestershire Family History Society web page at http://www.gfhs.org.uk/

In association with the local archives they have transcribed a lot of the Gloucester BMD records which can be searched free online.

It has the 1873 Joseph Marment (Mothers maiden name FEREBEE, registered in the Stroud district Stonehouse office).

But no sign of the 1896 birth (I checked for Marment from 1894-98 for Marment surname in case registered with Joseph as second name, or just as J.).

Evan

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  • 1 month later...

Hi all,

I need some help if possible please,I am researching Joseph Marment. He was either my G.G Granddad or his son my G granddad (they had the same names one would have been 42 in 1915 and the other would have been 19, I think it maybe the younger one but i'm not sure). Joseph had three service numbers, 1247TF, 20326, 242306 and was a sergeant. He was not killed during the war but I am really struggling to find out much information about him and his service. I have attached his medal card in case it helps. does it mean anything that some of the writing is in blue and some is in red? I have not been able to find any service records or pension records etc on ancestry. I did find Joseph on a site called ‘soldiers of Gloucestershire’ that says his battalion was 1/5. My brain seems to have stopped working...so I’m a bit stuck, any help would be very much appreciated. Many thanks Vanessa :)

post-59572-0-43826800-1300951529.jpg

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Hi Vanessa, If Your Grandfather was also called Joe and he was married to Della then I can help you :) My Grandmother who died 3 years ago at 102 would have been your G Grandfathers sister Elsie Sheppard nee Marment. Georgina Eddolls Bristol U.K

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi

My relative also served in the 1/4 Gloucestershire. I have a diary of Cpt. Wookey who led them for a while if your interested in having a look. Its quite a good read.

Dan

Hi Dan,

I certainly would like a look at the diary if I could.

Would your relative happen to be Capt (later Major) E.E.Wookey.

If so he is mentioned in the 'Gloucestershire Regiment in the Great War 1914-1919) by Everard Wyrell.

Regards,

Simon.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi Andrew,

Thank you for your reply. I have found my G G Granddad Joseph Marment b. 1874 on the 1901 census (miss transcribed as Mormant) it also has his son my G Grandad Joseph b.1896 on it. I've also found them on the 1911 census although I no longer have full access to it now. The Joseph Marment born in dec 1922 was my Great Uncle.

Our house is damaged, foundations, roof etc but it's still standing. We're still getting aftershocks & we have to boil water before using it. It's going to be a long time before things get back to normal here but we are doing OK...thank you for asking

:)

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi Vanessa, If Your Grandfather was also called Joe and he was married to Della then I can help you :) My Grandmother who died 3 years ago at 102 would have been your G Grandfathers sister Elsie Sheppard nee Marment. Georgina Eddolls Bristol U.K

Thank you for your reply....I have sent you a pm.

:)

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  • 2 months later...

Only just caught up on this thread.

Alls well that ends well

I also have an interest in Gloucester my Grandmothers Family lived not far from the Cathedral. Charles LLewellyn Probyn, Great Uncle was in 5th Gloucesters, ( of whom I have history on, except I still dont know why he and one of the Sisters were born in Swansea, when all the rest of the Family were born in Gloucester).

On reading this thread it has opened up another gate via Evan L's link to Gloucester Family History Society, Cheers for that.

Regards MN

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