Liesl Posted 22 February , 2011 Share Posted 22 February , 2011 Hi all, I have this photo of a soldier who is a family member. I can see the rising sun on his cap badge so he is Australian. We think this is a WW1 photo but would like to have it confirmed by the experts on this site. What do you think? [/img] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liesl Posted 22 February , 2011 Author Share Posted 22 February , 2011 Ok I don't think that worked, I'm going to try an attachment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waddell Posted 22 February , 2011 Share Posted 22 February , 2011 Liesl, I'm not convinced that he is First World War and think that it might be post war. Australians did wear an SD cap early in the war with leather edging as shown. Are you able to enlarge any detail on the collar badges? I would expect them to be rising sun badges as well, however the shape looks different in that photo. He also appears to be wearing a lanyard on his right shoulder. Did you have a name for the relative? I note the Tom Peerman name on the image address. Scott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Stewart Posted 22 February , 2011 Share Posted 22 February , 2011 Liesl - Sadly not WWI, but late 1930's or 1940's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackblue Posted 22 February , 2011 Share Posted 22 February , 2011 I would agree Graham is correct. There is a Thomas Halsey who served in WW1 and a Halsey Peerman who served in WW2. Name: Thomas Halsey Service number: 1131 Rank: Private Roll title: 4 Infantry Battalion - 1 to 8 Reinforcements (December 1914 - August 1915) Conflict: First World War, 1914-1918 Date of embarkation: 22 December 1914 Place of embarkation: Melbourne Ship embarked on: HMAT Themistocles Ship number: A32 and Name PEERMAN, HALSEY Service Australian Army Service Number VX6574 Date of Birth 22 Sep 1918 Place of Birth CULCAIRN, NSW Date of Enlistment 6 Nov 1939 Locality on Enlistment ALBURY WEST, NSW Place of Enlistment WANGARATTA, VIC Next of Kin PEERMAN, AGNES Date of Discharge 2 Jun 1941 Rank Private Posting at Discharge INF 2/8 BN WW2 Honours and Gallantry None for display Prisoner of War No The service papers of both have been digitised here: http://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNRetrieve/Interface/SearchScreens/BasicSearch.aspx Rgds Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liesl Posted 22 February , 2011 Author Share Posted 22 February , 2011 Thank you all for your help. I appreciate the extra effort of the service records. I believe this is Halsey Peerman but pre WW2. I wonder if he was part of the Citizens Military Force before he joined. This could be their uniform. I agree the collar badges don't look like rising suns at all. I will try for a better image of them but if this is not WW1 I suppose I will need to go over to the other forum! Thank you again for your help! Liesl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackblue Posted 23 February , 2011 Share Posted 23 February , 2011 Hi Liesl, Page 9 of his service papers actually makes reference to him formerly being 59th Battalion (Militia) prior to the war. No militia papers could be found when the inquiry was made in 1957. I can't find any on National Archives for him, but his papers do indicate prior militia service. It beleive this is an early issue WW2 AIF uniform and cap. This sort of cap for AIF men was not unusual early in the war. If he was in militia uniform he should probably be wearing a militia cap badge (likely 59th Battalion). I note that he appears to have the requisite service to be awarded the 1939-45 Star, but does not appear to have been issued one on his Medal Issue Slip (Page 1). I think the criteria were relaxed after the war so perhaps he is now eligble or this is an oversight? May be worth writing to Defence Honours and Awards to inquire? "The 1939-45 Star was awarded for a period of six months (180 days) operational service for RAN and Army personnel and RAAF non-air crew personnel and two months operational service for air crew personnel during the period from 3 September 1939 until 2 September 1945". He appears to have had more than 6 months operational service, even though in hospital for a time (which should count anyway). He missed out on the Africa Star as he did not serve West of Suez and was awarded the Defence Medal instead for his service in the Middle East. He was also awarded the War Medal and Australian Service Medal. Rgds Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liesl Posted 23 February , 2011 Author Share Posted 23 February , 2011 Tim, Thank you so much for the wealth of information you have added for me! I have filled in the form to check for medals for another family member so I will print another one out and see how I go with it! Keep fingers crossed. I will go through his service record over the weekend, it seems very interesting. You guys are so knowledgeable it amazes me. Thanks again Liesl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackblue Posted 23 February , 2011 Share Posted 23 February , 2011 Not a problem Liesl. We are all glad to help. If you need more information PM me as we have established this now off topic for this forum (as he is not Great War). Honours and Awards are pretty efficient these days so it shouldn't take long. There may be some obscure reason that he wasn't awarded the 39-45 Star...but it is always worth asking the question. This tells you about the 2/8th Battalion: http://www.awm.gov.au/units/unit_11259.asp This is their War Diary which will be worth a troll through to see if he is mentioned: http://www.awm.gov.au/collection/war_diaries/second_world_war/diary.asp?levelID=1107 Rgds Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leigh Mc Posted 26 May , 2011 Share Posted 26 May , 2011 If you look at the base of the right epaulet in the picture you can just make out the metal 'Australia' title. This badge was only worn by members of the AIF during WW2 and not the Militia. ( AIF men in Militia units did - Though I digress). Also this version of the Commonwealth Pattern Service Dress Jacket was not worn by members of the CMF (Militia) before the war. Their Service Dress Jackets were of a different cut. The version shown was only worn by Militia soldiers after the war began. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackblue Posted 26 May , 2011 Share Posted 26 May , 2011 You have probably misunderstood me Leigh. I was making the point that this man was AIF...likely 2/8th Bn and this is not a pre war militia uniform. If you can ID a shoulder title you have far better eyes than me! Rgds Tim D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piorun Posted 27 May , 2011 Share Posted 27 May , 2011 If you look at the base of the right epaulet in the picture you can just make out the metal 'Australia' title. This badge was only worn by members of the AIF during WW2 and not the Militia. ( AIF men in Militia units did - Though I digress). Also this version of the Commonwealth Pattern Service Dress Jacket was not worn by members of the CMF (Militia) before the war. Their Service Dress Jackets were of a different cut. The version shown was only worn by Militia soldiers after the war began. Leigh: what have you been taking for your eyesight??!! I can't even see a title on his shoulder, far less make it out. Yours, Antony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leigh Mc Posted 27 May , 2011 Share Posted 27 May , 2011 Tim, you are of course, right with your hypothesis. My comments were directed at the thread in general not yourself, as many people are not aware of the Militia or its distinctions from the AIF. Antony, if you look at soldier's right epaulet just where it meets the left hand edge of the photograph (as you view it) you will see the darker outline of the 'Australia' title. Another point of reference is the lanyard. Maybe I have spent too much time looking at old photographs for detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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