private Alfred Pritchard RAMC

[dave8888]

Hi all , had some great help with researching my grandma's cousin from you all so was hoping for any info regarding my grandad, Alfred Pritchard who served in the RAMC.

One of the members on here -johnny doyle- found some info on him but i want to find out more ( on my own with your guidance or if anyone can find out more for me.

Id love to know where he served in france/flanders.

He survived the war.

here is what johnny found - 127466 Alfred Pritchard has a service record on Ancestry. 39 New Church Road, Camberwell. Aged 19 when attested 1917. Short at 4ft 11.5ins. Father given as William Pritchard of same address.

Any help greatly appreciated,thanks, Dave.

[sotonmate]

Dave

Enlisted 15.11.1917 joined 5 Training Battalion RAMC at Blackpool.

Posted to BEF 25.5.1918 with 96th reinforcements,landed Boulogne. Allocated from there to 26th General Hospital at Etaples. 5.10.1918 At Etaples,suspect this was just for another alocation as it was a large casualty centre,and on 9.10 joined 112 Field Ambulance (16 Division at the Final advance in Artois).Later on 26.10 joined 2/3 Wessex Field Ambulance (57 Division at Artois also). At some point from the end of 1918 he had UK leave and then returned to France/Germany to join 102 Field Ambulance (34 Division at Cologne bridgehead),and this appears to be his last active unit before discharge on 19.12.1919.He was certainly on the Rhine between Jul and Sept 1919 as he was on a charge and got 28 days FP No 2 !

Sotonmate

[dave8888]

Dave

Enlisted 15.11.1917 joined 5 Training Battalion RAMC at Blackpool.

Posted to BEF 25.5.1918 with 96th reinforcements,landed Boulogne. Allocated from there to 26th General Hospital at Etaples. 5.10.1918 At Etaples,suspect this was just for another alocation as it was a large casualty centre,and on 9.10 joined 112 Field Ambulance (16 Division at the Final advance in Artois).Later on 26.10 joined 2/3 Wessex Field Ambulance (57 Division at Artois also). At some point from the end of 1918 he had UK leave and then returned to France/Germany to join 102 Field Ambulance (34 Division at Cologne bridgehead),and this appears to be his last active unit before discharge on 19.12.1919.He was certainly on the Rhine between Jul and Sept 1919 as he was on a charge and got 28 days FP No 2 !

Sotonmate

Many thanks mate.

He was in Germany as family have told me this in the past, looks like he had too much spare time on his hands in the end to be given FP !!!!!!!

This info is amazing, i can now look into his movements a little deeper!

I have one more relative, my grandads brother William Pritchard (same address) who survived the war, but he was gassed and had trenchfoot (according to family memories of him) and had asthma as a result of the gassing . Do not know what regiment etc, would their be any way of finding information about him?? Thanks, Dave..

[dave8888]

I have one more relative, my grandads brother William Pritchard (same address) who survived the war, but he was gassed and had trenchfoot (according to family memories of him) and had asthma as a result of the gassing . Do not know what regiment etc, would their be any way of finding information about him?? Thanks, Dave..

By the way , here is a picture of my grandad, Alfred Pritchard RAMC

[dave8888]

I have one more relative, my grandads brother William Pritchard (same address) who survived the war, but he was gassed and had trenchfoot (according to family memories of him) and had asthma as a result of the gassing . Do not know what regiment etc, would their be any way of finding information about him?? Thanks, Dave..

By the way , here is a picture of my grandad, Alfred Pritchard RAMC

Think this is a better picture.........

[Verrico2009]

Good photo. I've trawled through the surviving service and pension records but can't find your William. I did find one in the RAMC (though not, of course, guaranteed that he'd go into the same regiment as his brother), but stopped when I saw his wife was Balham-based. Another William Pritchard from Camberwell unfortunately died of wounds, so not him. You probably know that not much in the way of records survives so that's not too surprising. It would be nice to find his MIC at least to give you something to go on, but as you can imagine there's lots of men by that or a similar name so it will require something to narrow him down by - no idea of a middle name, perhaps? Census returns might be worth a try.PS we've got Pritchards in the family from not a million miles away (they were in Lewisham by the time we can pick them up, though a large section of my family spent years in Camberwell too) but George seems to be the favoured name.

[sotonmate]

Dave

I meant to add Alfred's Field Ambulance War Diary references,they are all at Kew under:

WO95/2452 102 FA Jan 1916 to Jul 1919.

WO95/1967 112 FA Jan 1916 to Jun 1919,and,

WO95/2975 2/3 Wessex FA Feb 1917 to Jun 1919.

Sotonmate

[dave8888]

Good photo. I've trawled through the surviving service and pension records but can't find your William. I did find one in the RAMC (though not, of course, guaranteed that he'd go into the same regiment as his brother), but stopped when I saw his wife was Balham-based. Another William Pritchard from Camberwell unfortunately died of wounds, so not him. You probably know that not much in the way of records survives so that's not too surprising. It would be nice to find his MIC at least to give you something to go on, but as you can imagine there's lots of men by that or a similar name so it will require something to narrow him down by - no idea of a middle name, perhaps? Census returns might be worth a try.PS we've got Pritchards in the family from not a million miles away (they were in Lewisham by the time we can pick them up, though a large section of my family spent years in Camberwell too) but George seems to be the favoured name.

Many thanks again for the help, will have to try and find out a bit more about him...... my nan Alice Pritchard (also known as 'Nell') lived in lewisham most of her life and my dads (her son) brother and sister still live in and around that area now (Bromley/Catford )............maybe a link somewhere to the 'Pritchards' in your family!!!

Will give you more info on us if you want.......thanks, Dave.

Dave

I meant to add Alfred's Field Ambulance War Diary references,they are all at Kew under:

WO95/2452 102 FA Jan 1916 to Jul 1919.

WO95/1967 112 FA Jan 1916 to Jun 1919,and,

WO95/2975 2/3 Wessex FA Feb 1917 to Jun 1919.

Sotonmate

Thanks mate, you have been so helpful, do you mean that he was 'mentioned' personally in the diaries or as a unit? Can i view these at Kew or on a website?

[sotonmate]

Dave

None of these WDs are yet digital,those that are can be downloaded for 3.50,at the moment they seem to be mostly infantry battalions,and I don't know what the programme of digitisation is. The WD will just describe the day's business,where they are,the number of casualties through,if they were shelled etc,sometimes ORs will be named but usually it's Officers who have names shown,so you won't necessarily see his name. At least you will know what was happening in general,it would be an interesting day to spend at Kew with these papers and maybe a bit more of a look round as well.

Sotonmate

[dave8888]

Good photo. I've trawled through the surviving service and pension records but can't find your William. I did find one in the RAMC (though not, of course, guaranteed that he'd go into the same regiment as his brother), but stopped when I saw his wife was Balham-based. Another William Pritchard from Camberwell unfortunately died of wounds, so not him. You probably know that not much in the way of records survives so that's not too surprising. It would be nice to find his MIC at least to give you something to go on, but as you can imagine there's lots of men by that or a similar name so it will require something to narrow him down by - no idea of a middle name, perhaps? Census returns might be worth a try.PS we've got Pritchards in the family from not a million miles away (they were in Lewisham by the time we can pick them up, though a large section of my family spent years in Camberwell too) but George seems to be the favoured name.

Ive just spoken to my dad and he said william did not survive the war, a very old friend of my nans verified it a few minutes ago, and resided in camberwell so it must be him!! (sorry for the mistake) (information overload!!!)

my grandad had 8 brothers inc William so its going to be a long slog trying to find out about all of them ( most of them served in ww1 ).........

Any info on the William who died of wounds would be greatly appreciated....... thanks, Dave.

[Verrico2009]

Hi Dave,

Thanks for that. I'll drop you a PM (or "conversation" as I think it's known now) as it's complicated, as families tend to be! At least you've got an address which should help.

Louise

[dave8888]

Hi Dave,

Thanks for that. I'll drop you a PM (or "conversation" as I think it's known now) as it's complicated, as families tend to be! At least you've got an address which should help.

Louise

Ive just spoken to my dad and he said william did not survive the war, a very old friend of my nans verified it a few minutes ago, and resided in camberwell so it must be him!! (sorry for the mistake) (information overload!!!)

my grandad had 8 brothers inc William so its going to be a long slog trying to find out about all of them ( most of them served in ww1 ).........

Any info on the William who died of wounds would be greatly appreciated....... thanks, Dave.

[Verrico2009]

Sure - I'll have a look. And give you some brief details.

Edited to add: an overview...

Name: William John Pritchard

Estimated birth year: abt 1883

Age at Enlistment: 33

Residence: 117 Coleman Road, Camberwell

Document Year: 1916

Regimental Number: 184871

Regiment Name: Machine Gun Corps

[Verrico2009]

Trade or calling: French polisher

Royal Engineers crossed out and Machine Gun Corps stamp added.

Wife Alice. They married 14 August 1904

Son William George born 16 August 1905

Any of this sound promising? I'm sure others will already be working on SDGW and CWGC to identify him.

Edit - what I don't understand is that I'm looking at a dispersal notice for him dated 1919 but as I said, I'm sure I saw elsewhere he dies. Oh well, will plough on!

[Verrico2009]

Here we go - casualty form with a very faint DoW at the top: of course it's the hardest page to read so far. The last date on it is 19.1.19 but it says "transferred to AR Class Z" so he was still alive then. Will keep looking.

He was with the RE Inland Water Transport Section 1 September 1916. Trade given: Carpenter's Mate.

I can see two other numbers crossed out on one page - one is WR (Waterways and Railways, I think?) but can't read more than that - subsequent found another page showing them to be WR220597 and 186831[?]

He's classed as a "Superior" carpenter.

Might not have an MIC - so far I've only seen "Home".

Caught influenza in December 1916 (bad enough to be in hospital 13 days) but recovered.

And that's about it - no indication in those papers of why he died!

[dave8888]

Trade or calling: French polisher

Royal Engineers crossed out and Machine Gun Corps stamp added.

Wife Alice. They married 14 August 1904

Son William George born 16 August 1905

Any of this sound promising? I'm sure others will already be working on SDGW and CWGC to identify him.

Edit - what I don't understand is that I'm looking at a dispersal notice for him dated 1919 but as I said, I'm sure I saw elsewhere he dies. Oh well, will plough on!

I will have to get my dad to contact my nans oldest friend (my nan passed away some years ago) who is getting on a bit now.......... she is the one providing most of the info and can sometimes get confused.........

as i said , with 8 brothers to remember , she might be getting them mixed up. She once said that william survived but was gassed and suffered with asthma until he was killed in a motorbike accident in 1920, then totally done a u-turn and said that was wrong, it was another brother...........

Here we go - casualty form with a very faint DoW at the top: of course it's the hardest page to read so far. The last date on it is 19.1.19 but it says "transferred [something]". Think I need an expert! Will keep looking.

DoW?

[Verrico2009]

Died of Wounds. As distinct from KIA or just Died ("natural" - eg flu or dysentery, even if that was brought on by trench life). Oh - silly me: it's in the place where it would mean he signed up for the "Duration of War"! Showing my inexperience, but that appearing on a casualty form had me jumping to conclusions. And the fact that his NOK details are repeated at the bottom, which I would also have thought indicated he didn't make it. Help, anyone?

He has a protection certificate and certificate of identity which is stamped 19 January 1919 and gives Crystal Palace as the place. I can't find any details of service - it's a set that's suffered fire and water damage. But at least it's still there, unlike so many others.

Hopefully your family friend will be able to shed some light on it. Unfortunately my father's last surviving sister's memory is extremely poor, so at least you're getting some information: the truth is in there but it's just sorting it out!

Haven't been able to find an MIC which ought to indicate that he didn't serve abroad. Don't know enough about the MGC to assess whether this could be true or not. If he only saw Home service, I imagine he wasn't the one who was gassed.

[Verrico2009]

Hmmm - may be barking up the wrong tree entirely. A search of the 1901 census threw up this family already living at New Church Road (looks like several families packed into No.152) and they certainly look very likely:-

William Pritchard 39

Caroline Pritchard 31

Florrie Pritchard 12

Rose Pritchard 5

Caroline Pritchard 8

William Pritchard 6

Alfred Pritchard 3

Harry Pritchard 1

Alice Pritchard 3 weeks

In which case the 33 year old William James from Camberwell isn't your man.

I don't subscribe for the 1911 census, but you could go for the pay-as-you-go credits if you wanted to get all the names. From what you've said this is a growing family.

[dave8888]

Hmmm - may be barking up the wrong tree entirely. A search of the 1901 census threw up this family already living at New Church Road (looks like several families packed into No.152) and they certainly look very likely:-

William Pritchard 39

Caroline Pritchard 31

Florrie Pritchard 12

Rose Pritchard 5

Caroline Pritchard 8

William Pritchard 6

Alfred Pritchard 3

Harry Pritchard 1

Alice Pritchard 3 weeks

In which case the 33 year old William James from Camberwell isn't your man.

I don't subscribe for the 1911 census, but you could go for the pay-as-you-go credits if you wanted to get all the names. From what you've said this is a growing family.

Thats the one!!!!!!!!!!! Confirmed it with my family. Thanks so much for your intensive searching, hope i can help you also one day (when im a bit more used to all this). I am going to research this on pay as you go credits!!!!!

[Verrico2009]

Not at all, Dave. Happy to help. It seems only William and Alfred will have served (although I suppose Harry could have made a late appearance - maybe your family friend is thinking of National Service though I'm hazy on when that was in force?). The hunt is still on for William!

Going back to the confusion over whether William survived or not, this man is interesting:-

http://www.cwgc.org/search/casualty_details.aspx?casualty=75228868

He'd be the right age and my great-uncle from just along the (Walworth) road also ended up in the North Staffs (see my avatar), although that was 1916 when it seems men were put into depleted regiments.

[dave8888]

Not at all, Dave. Happy to help. It seems only William and Alfred will have served (although I suppose Harry could have made a late appearance - maybe your family friend is thinking of National Service though I'm hazy on when that was in force?). The hunt is still on for William!

Going back to the confusion over whether William survived or not, this man is interesting:-

http://www.cwgc.org/...sualty=75228868

He'd be the right age and my great-uncle from just along the (Walworth) road also ended up in the North Staffs (see my avatar), although that was 1916 when it seems men were put into depleted regiments.

Am i right in thinking that there is no address (New Church Road ) given on any document you have seen regarding William Pritchard....would his servicerecord state this or have you already looked (could of been destroyed in fire, right? )

[Verrico2009]

Yes, addresses were provided in service papers. However, fire and water damage took their toll even on the ones that survived. I've looked at anything possible but nothing matches, as far as I can see. Sadly I'd have to conclude William's are part of the "burnt series". I'd be happy to be proved wrong.

MICs relate to service and medal entitlement, so no personal details (apart from KIA etc - and sometimes they weren't completed). There are a lot of William and W Pritchards amongst these, but until you know his regimental number or regiment there's nothing to go on.

Unfortunately, it seems not all families completed the necessary forms for CWGC to give full details of all the dead. There are many other William Pritchards for whom no age, NOK or home details are given. Very sad.

Rolls of Honour and local War Memorials are somewhere else it's possible to look, I guess.

[dave8888]

Yes, addresses were provided in service papers. However, fire and water damage took their toll even on the ones that survived. I've looked at anything possible but nothing matches, as far as I can see. Sadly I'd have to conclude William's are part of the "burnt series". I'd be happy to be proved wrong.

MICs relate to service and medal entitlement, so no personal details (apart from KIA etc - and sometimes they weren't completed). There are a lot of William and W Pritchards amongst these, but until you know his regimental number or regiment there's nothing to go on.

Unfortunately, it seems not all families completed the necessary forms for CWGC to give full details of all the dead. There are many other William Pritchards for whom no age, NOK or home details are given. Very sad.

Rolls of Honour and local War Memorials are somewhere else it's possible to look, I guess.

Still looking into this, will let you know what i find out.....................