Fedelmar Posted 7 August , 2010 Share Posted 7 August , 2010 Tim and I spoke at length about this dilemma, however he failed to convince me to look at things in a different light than I do I believe that in cases like SCOTT and exception should be made to the rule in that the body be exhumed and DNA taken. I also think in a case like that of MELLOR (aka WILLS executed) that the right man needs to have his name on the headstone. Bright Blessings Sandra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tjap Posted 7 August , 2010 Author Share Posted 7 August , 2010 Whilst the amazingly detailed information in his earlier posts was fascinating (the basis for a great short story or a docudrama), given the latest additional information from Tim I have to agree with Sandra on the question of the unknown 32nd Battalion soldier in the grave formerly assigned to RGM Scott and believe that they should right their previous wrong by exhuming him and giving him the chance of an identity. best, Howard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianw Posted 7 August , 2010 Share Posted 7 August , 2010 The key point on this seems to be the likelihood that the man in the unknown grave is indeed a 32nd Battalion man. IMO if he is, excluding him from the ID process would be grossly unjust and arbitrary. However, I appreciate that the CWGC will be reluctant to exhume existing graves - but this is currently a very exceptional case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fedelmar Posted 7 August , 2010 Share Posted 7 August , 2010 My point exactly Ian. I don't believe that they should exhume willy nilly but Scott's case is exceptional in that the GRU made the error therefore it is up to the CWGC to correct it. I am not sure how we would proceed with an attempt at this but the CWGC need to be petitioned to attempt to ID this man on this basis. Bright Blessings Sandra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tjap Posted 7 August , 2010 Author Share Posted 7 August , 2010 "I don't believe that they should exhume willy nilly but Scott's case is exceptional in that the GRU made the error therefore it is up to the CWGC to correct it." Sandra Speaking as the "man" on the Clapham omnibus, or if you will, the "fellow" on the Manly Ferry I could not agree with you more. Best, Howard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auimfo Posted 8 August , 2010 Share Posted 8 August , 2010 Even though Sandra mentioned that we differ in opinion on this (and we do), I should qualify that a little. It's not that I don't wish we could try to identify those already buried as unknowns in CWGC cemeteries - I most certainly do. I just think it would be a logistical and financial nightmare that has the potential of turning into a complete farce. Even a single precedent like this would undoubtedly snowball until everyone begins to demand bodies be exhumed based on the flimsiest of evidence. What concerns me is that some bright spark will no doubt find a way to privatize and commercialise the recovery business and when that happens we risk damaging the honour and respect of the men buried there. I can just see the website slogan now: "Identify your relative now for just three easy payments...." Ok, so I'm being a total cynic and taking it to the nth degree - I just think there's too much to lose. Cheers, Tim L. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianw Posted 8 August , 2010 Share Posted 8 August , 2010 Tim, I understand your point and would also not like to see anything like the wholesale exhumation of unknowns or , heaven forbid, it turning into a commercial process. However, in this case, the grave has clearly been mis-identified and there is an ongoing official ID process for the discrete group of those lost at Fromelles to whom, it would appear, this soldier may well belong. In this specific case it would be absolutely invidious to exclude him even for the noble reasons that you describe. Regards Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melliget Posted 9 October , 2010 Share Posted 9 October , 2010 After the war, Johann FISCHER wrote to JOHNSON's father (we have a copy of the transcribed letter). Just came across Fischer's letter in a document on NAA. For interest, will post the link here (it's the last 2 pages, pages 78 and 79): Document title: Removal of bodies to Australia - Graves in Germany (1916-1924) http://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/scripts/Imagine.asp?B=362099 Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auimfo Posted 9 October , 2010 Share Posted 9 October , 2010 That's the one Martin. A couple of us discovered it a few months back at the NAA and had it digitised. Makes for very interesting reading although I think there's a bit more to be read into it than actually appears in the letter. Cheers, Tim L. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howardchinner Posted 7 November , 2010 Share Posted 7 November , 2010 Just to confuse the issue my name is also Howard and I am also a GWF Sergeant Major . When Robert Grieve Moncrieff Scott was first identified at Pheasant Wood earlier this year, I contacted the CWGC to point out that they already had him buried at Rue Petillon. They confirmed that he was definitely identified at Pheasant Wood by other means than DNA (they had not at that time traced any relatives). I suggested that they should consider exhuming the now "unknown soldier" at Rue Petillon, but they said that that was not CWGC policy. As at that time my relative, Lt. Eric Harding Chinner had not been identified, I tried to trace Scotts's relatives with the kind assistance of the "Dumfries & Galloway Gazette" (Scott's mother lived near Dumfries). Unfortunately this did not appear to produce any results. However, when I attended the Pheasant Wood Cemetery Dedication on 19th July 2010, I found my self seated next to some Scots and we got talking. I asked whether they had a relative buried at Pheasant Wood. "Yes - his name is Scott" - "Not Robert Grieve Moncrieff Scott!?" "Yes - how did you know his name?" I explained and we discovered that, after the Dumfries and Galloway Gazette article, another article appeared in a Scottish National Daily and they made contact with the CWGC as a result - just in time to attend the Ceremony! It's a small world!!!! Howard His service record contains a letter from Germany in 1916 confirming this death. His file also has a letter from the IWGC in 1924 responding to ongoing enquiries from his family saying there is a cross on a grave in Rue Petillon (Plot 1 Row L Grave 46) with his details and the words "Believed To Be". The letter goes on to detail that a permanent headstone and the "Believed To Be" would be removed if the family wished. Of course, the family wished and the words were removed. The 2 documents and the Rue Petillon grave Glen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wet255 Posted 16 December , 2014 Share Posted 16 December , 2014 HI, Does anyone have a photograph of Albert Pratt, he was a first class cricketer and I am writing a book about them? Many thanks. Nigel McCrery Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roel22 Posted 18 December , 2014 Share Posted 18 December , 2014 How can he be exhumed when he's in a large mass grave? I doubt his body will be exactly beneath the headstone. Roel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wet255 Posted 10 January , 2015 Share Posted 10 January , 2015 A photograph of Pratt. Comes from Aukland Grammar School Roll of honour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 10 January , 2015 Share Posted 10 January , 2015 Although the ID erroneous, it would appear from his service record that the Matilda took great comfort from the "finding" of his body in 1925. Personally, I am glad she had that comfort. Please see below a picture of his new gravestone from the relevant photos thread in the Fromelles section courtesy of our Pal Pierre. And, happily as has been said, the inscription wanted by Matilda is indeed there. Judy - I have read through his record. The contrast between the various official replies and her letters is heart-breaking. She would be so pleased that he really does rest in peace now. Pity to misquote the Bible, though, and ending up with bad English.. John 15:13King James Version (KJV)Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johntanner Posted 29 September , 2016 Share Posted 29 September , 2016 The body previously identified as Pratt was exhumed from 57 d X 11 c Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now