Animals in the trenches...........

[AlanCurragh]

I think that's up to Caryl really, John - I'm intending doing a bit of pruning this evening to remove from here some of the areas of the conversation covered in At Home Dad's subsequent (and now closed) thread

[SiegeGunner]

As an adjunct to cats in the trenches, I wonder whether some units also took ferrets with them into the trenches - not only as companions and vermin exterminators but perhaps also to work at tasks like carrying pilot lines through narrow openings, or even air-lines into collapsed mine workings.

Dogs, of course, were used as messengers and even, sometimes, to carry water, dressings etc to wounded men or medics out in no-man's land. Were cats used for any kind of 'work' other than ratting/mousing?

Oh, and regarding apparent indifference to shellfire, might this be attributable, at least in part, to deafness? I should have thought that with their acute hearing and comparatively exposed auditory apparatus, cats were particularly susceptible to noise-induced deafness.

[Dragon]

I've copied this material of mine from one of the 'other' threads because I think it's a nice account of men's relationship with a small cat and with wild birds. The writer is describing the role of animals in the life of the French troops in the Vosges mountains. He says that cats and dogs filled the emotional gaps in the soldiers' lives:

Dans les tranchées, chat et chiens comblent les carences affectives des soldats. Nos amis les bêtes sont partout, y comprise là où on les attend pas.

Animals would turn up where they were least expecting them. The men even gave nicknames to the wildlife which visited frequently. A couple of chaffinches had nicknames, a large jay was called François-Joseph, an owl was named Kaiser, a starling Guillaume, a blackbird Kronprinz... It was "une veritable volière [aviary]". These birds visited every evening to be fed. I can quite imagine it. When up in the Vosges, I see more jays than anywhere else I've been.

The men became protective of their bird companions. A letter describes seeing a look-out [is there a better military word for guetteur,please?] furiously dismembering a bird of prey which had attacked a bird which had built its nest above the trench:

Un guetteur de 356e, homme simple et doux, devient fou furieux d'avoir vu un rapace estropier un oiseau qui s' était construit un nid au-dessus de la tranchée. Il tire sur la buse et Henri Genet, son lieutenant, le retrouve accroupi, en train de dévorer la cervelle du rapace, qu'il tient entre ses jambes.

And the small cat? A soldier found it lying on his chest during the very cold spring of 1915. It was a small black and white cat trembling with fear, cold and hunger (which rather belies the 'indifference' claim). It became his loyal follower for the next few months.

En Avril, 1915, il trouve couché sur sa poitrine un petit chat noir et blanc tremblant du peur, de froid et de faim. Le chat le suivra des mois durant.

It doesn't take much imagination to envisage the warmth of their short relationship.

Gwyn

[CarylW]

Alan

Perhaps Caryl or yourself could now give a steer as to what direction the discussion should now take. The original point seems well answered and then we still have the "other matter" on view.

John

Don't really mind what direction it takes, as long as it's peaceful. I like threads that evolve as members contribute. I was thinking about changing the subtitle to something that included any animal adopted by service personnel as a pet because the thread has developed that way. ... Found this and it made me smile.......................................................................................... (Do not even go there. )

[Kath]

I haven't noticed my cats being particularly disturbed by fireworks.

Kath.

[Stanley_C_Jenkins]

What is, or is not regarded as food, or what can or cannot be eaten are complex and potentially-controversial questions, with cultural and racial overtones. It is well known, for example, that Jews and Muslims will not eat pigs, although the French seem to have no qualms about eating snails and frog's legs. In the English-speaking world, there is universal disgust about the idea of eating dogs, cats and horses - these particular animals being regarded almost as "humans".

In fact, one could say that, although horses were occasionally eaten (often unknowingly) cat or dog-eating is taboo, and there are well-recorded instances of people starving to death rather that eat their "best friends". Under these circumstances, I personally find it very difficult to believe that British soldiers (who were certainly not starving on the Western Front) could have eaten cats during the Great War.

[CarylW]

Thanks Stanley but we have sort of stopped talking about cat eating on this thread now, as AHD has had two threads on the subject one thread has been closed and one is still open here: http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=150346&pid=1448080&st=25entry1448080 as far as I know the remaining cat eating posts on this thread are going to be removed

[CarylW]

[regimentalrogue]

What is, or is not regarded as food, or what can or cannot be eaten are complex and potentially-controversial questions, with cultural and racial overtones. It is well known, for example, that Jews and Muslims will not eat pigs, although the French seem to have no qualms about eating snails and frog's legs. In the English-speaking world, there is universal disgust about the idea of eating dogs, cats and horses - these particular animals being regarded almost as "humans".

In fact, one could say that, although horses were occasionally eaten (often unknowingly) cat or dog-eating is taboo, and there are well-recorded instances of people starving to death rather that eat their "best friends". Under these circumstances, I personally find it very difficult to believe that British soldiers (who were certainly not starving on the Western Front) could have eaten cats during the Great War.

Whether or not the pantry is the objective, there is a big difference between "best friends", by which I assume you mean those animals taken as pets, and feral animals of any similar species. It is a very broad generalization to assume the affection one feels for a pet would be extended to one that is truly feral as some dogs and cats in the front line area must have been.

[BJanman]

Changed the title now to 'Cats in the trenches.........and other animals adopted by service personnel'

Hi Caryl

If you are interested in animals and/or wildlife adopted by service personnel then you may be interested to know that Richard Van Emden has written a book about it, due to be released in November. You may already be aware but just in case your not I have attached a link to the write up about it here There is a couple of snippets from soldier's diaries there.

Barbara

[CarylW]

Hi Caryl

If you are interested in animals and/or wildlife adopted by service personnel then you may be interested to know that Richard Van Emden has written a book about it, due to be released in November. You may already be aware but just in case your not I have attached a link to the write up about it here There is a couple of snippets from soldier's diaries there.

Barbara

Thanks Barbara. I had heard about the book and I'm looking forward to reading it when it comes out, but I hadn't seen the link. Didn't realise that animals adopted by service personnel were included and I hadn't realised that cats were going to be mentioned until a member posted about the book way back in the thread. Thought it was just wildlife. Interesting to read in the snippet online that 61 species are mentioned in the book!

Another one, last one for today

.

[Heid the Ba]

To echo Kate, every cat I have owned has been fascinated by fireworks and not in the least disturbed by the noise. They have all been easily startled by other things.

This anecdote was brought to you by an anonymous bloke on teh interwebs and is worth precisely what you have paid for it.

[salesie]

Elegy On the Death of Bingo Our Trench Dog

Weep, weep, ye dwellers in the delved earth,

Ah, weep, ye watchers by the dismal shore

Of No Man's Land, for Bingo is no more;

He is no more, and well ye knew his worth,

For whom on bully-beefless days were kept

Rare bones by each according to his means,

And, while the Quartermaster-Sergeant slept,

The elusive pork was rescued from the beans.

He is no more and, impudently brave,

The loathly rats sit grinning on his grave.

Him mourn the grimy cooks and bombers ten,

The sentinels in lonely posts forlorn,

The fierce patrols with hands and tunics torn,

The furtive band of sanitary men.

The murmuring sound of grief along the length

Of traversed trench the startled Hun could hear;

The Captain, as he struck him off the strength,

Let fall a sad and solitary tear;

'Tis even said a batman passing by

Had seen the Sergeant-Major wipe his eye.

The fearful fervour of the feline chase

He never knew, poor dog, he never knew;

Content with optimistic zeal to woo

Reluctant rodents in this murky place,

He never played with children on clean grass,

Nor dozed at ease beside the glowing embers,

Nor watched with hopeful eye the tea-cakes pass,

Nor smelt the heather-smell of Scotch Septembers,

For he was born amid a world at war

Although unrecking what we struggled for.

Yet who shall say that Bingo was unblest

Though all his Sprattless life was passed beneath

The roar of mortars and the whistling breath

Of grim nocturnal heavies going West?

Unmoved he heard the evening hymn of hate,

Unmoved would gaze into his master's eyes,

For all the sorrows men for men create

In search of happiness wise dogs despise,

Finding ecstatic joy in every rag

And every smile of friendship worth a wag.

Major E. De Stein

Major De Stein served with the K.R.R.C. (60th Rifles) from 1914 to 1918 and survived the war. The precise year he wrote this poem is unknown but it was published in Punch in 1918 so is contemporary to the war.

Cheers-salesie.

[dfaulder]

Whether or not the pantry is the objective, there is a big difference between "best friends", by which I assume you mean those animals taken as pets, and feral animals of any similar species. It is a very broad generalization to assume the affection one feels for a pet would be extended to one that is truly feral as some dogs and cats in the front line area must have been.

29 July 2010 07:52 PM:

The mods have asked me to move my reply to the above post to the Eating Cats in the Trenches thread.

David

[battle bowler]

Hi all

My loves are history and cats so I was delighted to think that they got a look in. Wonder if they ever got a medal? DCM ? Don't Come Meowing? How did they avoid the pidgeons from the messenger service?

Was it Simon from HMS Amethyst who got the Dicken Medal?

[AlanCurragh]

Just a reminder, folks - can we try and avoid any more "eating" posts please

Thanks

Alan

[centurion]

Oink

[Kate Wills]

Worth a look?

Pets

[CarylW]

Posted this somewhere else on the forum originally

The first one is an original photo that I bought with a group of WW1 postcards. I would like to identify the regiment but realise that may be impossible

Looks to be on board a ship, maybe when the regiment were travelling, or I did wonder if they were dockside and he was brought on board to entertain them but finding other photos that I've included below he may well have been a regimental mascot

Caryl

[CarylW]

Hi all

My loves are history and cats so I was delighted to think that they got a look in. Wonder if they ever got a medal? DCM ? Don't Come Meowing? How did they avoid the pidgeons from the messenger service?

Was it Simon from HMS Amethyst who got the Dicken Medal?

Yes it was Simon who was awarded the Dickin medal, (and a Blue Cross medal) the animal version of the VC. Simon was the ships cat aboard HMS Amethyst during the Yangtze Incident in 1949

No idea how the messenger pigeons fared with trench cats, unless the cats couldn't get into the baskets they were kept in in the trenches. There is a story here of how a messenger pigeon called Cher Ami saved the lives of 194 American soldiers and was awarded the Croix de Guerre with Palm here:

http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/pigeons_and_world_war_one.htm

salesie thanks for the poem. It is hard to tell when Bingo died from that, as you said. He was obviously loved by his master. A reminder that a number of the pets would have died on the battlefield

Kath and Heid the ba. Yes, I noticed cats we've owned not being bothered by fireworks. Everyone has convinced me now that cats, or some cats, were indifferent to shell fire. I should amend my first post now really

Caryl

[Ron Clifton]

As an adjunct to cats in the trenches, I wonder whether some units also took ferrets with them into the trenches - not only as companions and vermin exterminators but perhaps also to work at tasks like carrying pilot lines through narrow openings, or even air-lines into collapsed mine workings.

I can't put my finger on the reference but I am pretty sure that both ferrets and rats were used to pass signal cable through drainpipes and sewers. There is even one story of a small Belgian boy in Ypres being sent down a sewer for this purpose!

Ron

[centurion]

I can't put my finger on the reference but I am pretty sure that both ferrets and rats were used to pass signal cable through drainpipes and sewers. There is even one story of a small Belgian boy in Ypres being sent down a sewer for this purpose!

Ron

The ferret was used to carry cable through ducting in aircraft by Boeing in the 70s to 90s but I've never seen any reference to this use in WW1. I suspect that rats would be useless for this

[CarylW]

According to the caption, this was "Lyddite", ship cat of the HMS Shark, sunk with many lives lost at the Battle of Jutland 1916

More about the loss of the HMS Shark here:

http://www.northeastmedals.co.uk/britishguide/jutland/hms_shark_casualty_list_1916.htm

Caryl

[MACRAE]

If i was given the choice of a Cat or Dog in the trenches I would chose a Cat . I have two at home the latest pic is attached a true survivor, she has one eye and has cataracts in it, do not be misslead that she cant see, my hands can testify to the fact she is spot on with direct hits with her paws, and she caught a fly last week.

Dan

[CarylW]

Agree with you McRae. Even though I prefer dogs, If I'd had to choose a pet to live in a trench I might have chosen a cat. Much more resourceful and more able to go off and fend for themselves when the going got tough. Lovely cat

This quote made me smile

Source: Leaves from a field note-book (1916) Morgan, John Hartman

Chapter 25: The day's work

" .........."Well, you may think yourself lucky you haven't my job," said the Deputy Assistant Adjutant General at length. " I'm getting rather fed up with casualty lists and strength returns. I'm like the man who boasted that his chîef literary recreation was reading Bradshaw, except that I don't boast of it and it isn't a recreation it's damned hard work. I have to read the Army List for about ten hours every day, for if I get an officer's initials wrong there's the devil to pay. And I spent hall an hour between the telephone and the Army List to-day trying to find out who ' Teddy' was. The 102nd Welsh sent him in with their returns of officers' casualties as having died of heart failure on the 22nd inst." " Well, but who is ' Teddy,' anyhow ? " asked the Camp Commandant. '" He is the regimental goat," replied the D.A.A.G. "I suppose they thought it amusing. When I tumbled to it I told their Brigade Head- quarters on the telephone that I quite understood their making him a member of their mess, as they belonged to the same species......."

Caryl