FAWV

[Rockdoc]

I found the following in the Diary of 73rd AA Section for 19th December 1916: received Report that this unit will be attached to 10th FAWV for repairs etc while in this position. I have no idea what FAWV might stand for. Field Artillery Workshop V....... makes some kind of sense but why would an RFA-associated workshop be based at Salonika when the majority, if not all, field guns were on the front lines?

Keith

[pjjobson]

Keith

I've never come across this one, and that's after years of researching RA terms and abbreviations. I'll be interested to see what other members make of it.

Phil

[Rockdoc]

It isn't the only time this occurs, Phil, and another such unit is referenced elsewhere. I've checked the original and it's clearly FAWV, the other having (Workshops) after it. I have to wonder if it's a mobile workshop, with the V being vehicle, because the AA Sections usually send their equipment to the nearest IOM Workshops for anything major. Unfortunately, this Diary gives almost nothing away about the sites for its guns so I have no idea why they wouldn't have been able to get to the IOM Workshops if need be.

Keith

[kevinrowlinson]

If it was a "U" instead of a "V" then it could be Field Ambulance Workshop Unit. If it is then finding out where the 10th was may confirm it. 10th Division maybe.

Kevin

[centurion]

FAWV is a valid abbreviation but for French American War Veterans which is not relevant here. I suspect that V does stand for vehicle and W for workshop but FA may not be Field Artillery

[Rockdoc]

It could be a U but other examples on the same page don't have the 'flair' on the RH side. Here's the section iself.

Keith

[Ron Clifton]

Hello Keith

I think Kevin has the right answer.

Each division had a "Workshop for Motor Ambulance Cars", a very small ASC unit attached for admin to one of the div's Field Ambulances. 10th Division was in Salonika for a while, so I think it's the 10th Div's "Field Ambulance Workshop for Vehicles".

These units were actually the only repair sources for MT within a division and it was presumably convenient for nearby non-divisional units to get relatively small vehicle repairs done there, rather than send them back to an Ordnance Workshop at Corps level or higher.

Ron

[Rockdoc]

Thanks for the clarification. The Section was attached from 28th FAWU to 10th FAWU on 3rd December 1916 and formally transferred on 19th. The Section was operating entirely under XVI Corps until 11th December, when the Diary records Detached from 16th Corps and attached to Base Troops Salonika for administration, supply & tactical purposes only. GHQ RA as per message (Signals) 11-12-16 so it appears these were all part of a reorganisation of responsibilities around Salonika.

If the units FAWU refers to are Divisional, 10th and 28th are both within XVI Corps so that sort of fits but I still don't understand why Field Ambulance-related units were operating close to Salonika when the Corps was well away from the city by late 1916.

Keith

[Rockdoc]

I think I've tripped over part of the answer in Under the Devil's Eye. On page 154, it quotes Major TB Bardon of the Ordnance Corps as saying that the main Ordnance Depot was sited at Dudular and that the first workshops facilities consisted of two Light Mobile Workshops. "...these were on lorries and consisted of a lthe, drilling machine, grinder, mounted on and driven by the lorry."

So there were, as you'd expect, mobile workshops in the Salonika Front but I'm still a little surprised that, more than a year after the first landing, they were still dependent on them away from the front lines. Perhaps, though, I'm looking at this the wrong way round. I wonder if minor repairs to the lorries were done by these units throughout the War rather than blocking the main workshops with minor stuff? I'm always amazed by what could be achieved in the field. I've come across drive-shafts being swapped between lorries on the road when one on a gun lorry failed so it could be the FAWU were more capable than we might think.

Keith

[Ron Clifton]

Keith

It might also be due to the difficult terrain in Macedonia, decreasing the ability of motor vehicles to operate very far forward. Even the ASC had to rely heavily on pack transport, as horse-drawn wagons had similar problems.

Ron

[Rockdoc]

There's no doubting the poor state of the roads throughout this Theatre and XVI Corps is said only to have had the Salonika-Seres road that was capable of handling serious traffic. AA Sections working on the front lines with both Corps really struggled to reach some positions and I remember one Sub-section recording that had to leave its motor-transport about a mile away from the gun position, which must have made ammunition supply to the gun itself an entertainment for the gunners.

Even in 1918 things were bad in some parts. 95th complained bitterly about the state of the roads along Lake Tahinos and the need to use pack-transport and mule teams because its 30-cwt lorries couldn't cope.

I think the niggle for me is the Field Ambulance part of the designation. It had been labelled as an ASC mobile workshop I'd be quite happy but I doubt if there were many field ambulances around Dudular. There were hospitals aplenty so why would there be a need for field ambulance facilities? They'd be pretty near the front lines, surely?

I wonder if I'm over-analysing again?

Keith

[kevinrowlinson]

Keith,

You can see a photo of the 10th FAWU at http://rpc12437.tripod.com/strathavencemetery.htm . I think you do have a tendency to try and justify what you read in the diaries to what you want to believe, and take the written word too literally. "Training" to me, for example, may not mean that.

Kevin

[Rockdoc]

Thanks, Kevin. It's too easy to get overly focused on something relatively trivial and worry it like a dog with a bone when researching anything. I try not to but don't always succeed!

It's certainly possible that training could have been used as a jargon term in some circumstances because some attachments are "for a course of instruction". That ought to mean the same thing but if it were that simple why would there be two expressions? I'm sure that some attachments that were recorded as being for training were more ways of keeping spare men occupied in situations where they could keep their skills up into the bargain. On the other hand, I came across a situation where four men from a newly-mobilized Section were sent to an established one to train as observers. To allow the new one to go into action two observers were temporarily attached to it until the other men were sent back. Of course, some variation in terminology may simply reflect the men writing the various Diaries. Every one seems to have its own quirks.

Keith

[Ron Clifton]

I think the niggle for me is the Field Ambulance part of the designation. It had been labelled as an ASC mobile workshop I'd be quite happy but I doubt if there were many field ambulances around Dudular. There were hospitals aplenty so why would there be a need for field ambulance facilities? They'd be pretty near the front lines, surely?

I wonder if I'm over-analysing again?

Keith

Keith

The Field Ambulances themselves (i.e. the personnel) would almost certainly have been forward with their divisions, but the state of the roads might cause them to leave most, if not all, of their motor ambulances behind. That being so, there would have been no need for the FAWV to come forward with them: it could more usefully employed further back to do light/medium repairs for other motor vehicles as well. Whatever its actual title was, its role was to act as a light forward workshop for a div's MT, most of which were ambulances anyway. Its attachment to a FA was for convenience of admin. There was more flexibility in the use of small supporting units than the strict framework of "War Establishments" suggests!

Ron

[Rockdoc]

That's a very fair point, Ron. When 24th AA Section left England for Alexandria it took a full complement of lorries and a motorcycle. When it was posted to Sulva Bay, only the gun lorries went and all the MT vehicles and personnel were left behind. In Salonika, as far as I can tell from the Diaries, the AA Sections all kept their GS lorries with them wherever they were stationed but, as I wrote yesterday, the lorries - especially the 30-cwt Daimlers that were substituted for the 3-ton versions issued at first - were neither effective nor reliable where roads were poor. At least one Section had to revert to pack transport and there could easily have been more because not all records are equally detailed. Even close to Salonika, some roads were iffy. 73rd was initially attached to Lembet for rations but successfully requested a change to Dudular because of the state of the road to Lembet. Very late in the war roads could still be problematic. When one Sub from 94th AAS moved from Ismailli, near Snevce, to Baisilli on 13th September 1918 it was held up en route because a GS lorry went off the road. It took from 22.30 hours on 13th until 19.00 hours on 16th to get the lorry back on the road so it must have been well and truly mired.

Keith

[kevinrowlinson]

Keith

I have sometimes wondered whether the need for hospitals/ambulances was disproportionally higher in Salonica compared to the amount of personnel actually there to that of the western front. It seems to me, after looking at quite a few mens records, that although there may have been fewer combatant casualties there was a very high hospitalisation rate for those suffering from malaria, and to a lesser degree dysentery. So much so that I would be surprised if your relative did not suffer from malaria at some stage. Whether this is recorded in the diaries I have no idea, but I wonder whether these sicknesses had a greater bearing on the working of the sections/batteries than those being sent for leave or training. Just a thought, and therefore speculation, but gives another possible avenue to consider when looking at the units history.

Kevin

[Rockdoc]

I don't think my Grandfather had malaria, at least I don't remember him ever having a relapse like my father-in-law did who had been a Japanese POW in Singapore and elsewhere. He certainly had dysentery not very long after the Section became active. It seems to have gone right through the Section. Unfortunately, that level of detail disappears quite early on, which is a shame for us!

It's an interesting thought that there would have been a need for a lot of ambulances around Salonika. There were a lot of them, to be sure, and Adrian Wright's said that they opened temporary sites on the Hortiach plateau in the summer months. That would all need transport.

The Diaries only start to make any reference to health right at the very end and not all did even then. 95th moved from Lembet to Lake Tahinos in mid-1918. They record these stats for the end of July:

A Gun Kucos highest reading 6%

B Gun ANO highest reading 21%

Transport Tasli highest reading for week ending 27th only 14%

These readings are the percentage of ration strength not on full duty. They were due chiefly to Dysentry & Malaria.

They moved from Kucos and Ano Kreusoves to Middlesex Bridge, Tasli, and Kato Kreusoves, nearer Stavros and this helped. The following month records:

Health of Unit somewhat improved, possibly due to change of positions. A Gun average 7% for month. B 5 - 7%, Transport lines 6%. % = men marked LD or XD on Ration Strength.

Presumably, LD and XD relate to the degree of disability? Light and eXtreme, perhaps?

Keith

[Ron Clifton]

Presumably, LD and XD relate to the degree of disability? Light and eXtreme, perhaps?

Keith

I would guess that these were for men put on Light Duties or Excused Duties. You commonly find "M&D " which means Medicine and Duties, basically "take this pill (often a No.9!), get back to work and come back to see me again if it doesn't get better after a couple of days."

Casualties through illness were noticeably higher than battle casualties in the Dardanelles, Salonika and Meopotamian theatres of war. The actual figures are given in "Casualties and Medical Statistics" edited by Major T Mitchell, one of the volumes in the Medical Official History series.

Ron

[Rockdoc]

Thanks, Ron. I really should have thought of those. After all, I was brought up on The Army Game and Pte Bisley was "Excused Boots", hence his nick-name of Bootsie.

Keith