Frajohn Posted 20 April , 2010 Share Posted 20 April , 2010 I have been researching my Grandfather, H.F Knight for a number of years, without a great deal of success. I have his MIC, but although he was in the Goldstream Guards, I have not been able to locate his records, the archivist said there was no trace of his records. I have recently located another MIC which has the same regimental number, but the initials H.S. Am I safe to assume that this card relates to my Grandfather? If so, why two cards? Is it possible that his records have been filed under H.S and hence the reason for not being located? Is it worth contacting the archivist again? Thanks for any advice / thoughts Kind regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinThwaite Posted 20 April , 2010 Share Posted 20 April , 2010 I have been researching my Grandfather, H.F Knight for a number of years, without a great deal of success. I have his MIC, but although he was in the Goldstream Guards, I have not been able to locate his records, the archivist said there was no trace of his records. I have recently located another MIC which has the same regimental number, but the initials H.S. Am I safe to assume that this card relates to my Grandfather? If so, why two cards? Is it possible that his records have been filed under H.S and hence the reason for not being located? Is it worth contacting the archivist again? Thanks for any advice / thoughts Kind regards John Hello John, Members Coldstreamer or CT Guards will be your best bet for assistance. I do know that Records for the Coldstream Guards are held at the RHQ Wellington Barracks in London. Good luck, Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roughdiamond Posted 20 April , 2010 Share Posted 20 April , 2010 I'm taking it John you're talking about 1730 WO2 Harry F Knight and 1730 CSM H.S. Knight? What's on both Cards John, is one for a Star and the other for the War and Victory? TBH the likeliehood of the archivist not recognising your man by Surname, Rank and Number because of a discrepency in the middle initial is very minimal I'd think, but it's worth a call anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CT-Guards Posted 21 April , 2010 Share Posted 21 April , 2010 Same man different medal entitlement, you are correct in assuming they both belong to the same man. Early number that one enlistement 1898! (thats from memory), i'll have a check later - time permitting! Contact the barracks (Wellington, Birdcage Walk) directly as given by border/1 suggests, you should be able to get hold of his papers. I have found men whose papers couldn't be found so good luck. Put up on here all the info you do have on him we'll find something. NB - border/1 i'll be in touch by the weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 21 April , 2010 Share Posted 21 April , 2010 from Paul Nixon's superb blog: 130 joined on 22nd June 1895 400 joined on 7th February 1896 773 joined on 22nd January 1897 1327 joined on 8th January 1898 2521 joined on 6th March 1899 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinThwaite Posted 21 April , 2010 Share Posted 21 April , 2010 Same man different medal entitlement, you are correct in assuming they both belong to the same man. Early number that one enlistement 1898! (thats from memory), i'll have a check later - time permitting! Contact the barracks (Wellington, Birdcage Walk) directly as given by border/1 suggests, you should be able to get hold of his papers. I have found men whose papers couldn't be found so good luck. Put up on here all the info you do have on him we'll find something. NB - border/1 i'll be in touch by the weekend. Roger that, Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roughdiamond Posted 21 April , 2010 Share Posted 21 April , 2010 John My question may have seemed strange about the MIC's, but at work I can't see images. Something worth looking at is that he may have carried on serving after the war especially as a pre-War regular, in that case his Service Records wouldn't be held in the Guards Museum but by the MOD, have you considered this option? Sam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frajohn Posted 21 April , 2010 Author Share Posted 21 April , 2010 Many thanks for all of the replies I will post fuller details this evening Kind regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frajohn Posted 21 April , 2010 Author Share Posted 21 April , 2010 Hi Some more detail I know that he served with the 2nd Battalion CG during the Boer War as I have his QSA for that period. He was a drummer. I have various certificates to say that he was in the Coldstream Guards, 2nd Battalion. On his marriage February 1st 1909 he was a Corporal and resided at Chelsea Barracks. My father was baptised 25th September 1910 at the Royal Military Chapel, Wellington Barracks, at that time Henry was a Lance Sergeant. In January 1917, he sadly lost his daughter at the age of 2years, at that time his wife and family were living in Windsor and Henry was the rank of Company Sergeant Major. Henry had left Military service by May 1924. A couple of years ago I contacted the Archivist at Wellington Barracks for his service record. He contacted me soon after to advise taht the record was not there. 'Coldstreamer' had a further look a while later, again without success. "Something worth looking at is that he may have carried on serving after the war especially as a pre-War regular, in that case his Service Records wouldn't be held in the Guards Museum but by the MOD, have you considered this option? " This might well be another avenue worth exploring. Do you know that date after which, if they were still serving, the MOD might have the records? Again. many thanks for any suggestions Kind regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinThwaite Posted 22 April , 2010 Share Posted 22 April , 2010 Hi Some more detail I know that he served with the 2nd Battalion CG during the Boer War as I have his QSA for that period. He was a drummer. I have various certificates to say that he was in the Coldstream Guards, 2nd Battalion. On his marriage February 1st 1909 he was a Corporal and resided at Chelsea Barracks. My father was baptised 25th September 1910 at the Royal Military Chapel, Wellington Barracks, at that time Henry was a Lance Sergeant. In January 1917, he sadly lost his daughter at the age of 2years, at that time his wife and family were living in Windsor and Henry was the rank of Company Sergeant Major. Henry had left Military service by May 1924. A couple of years ago I contacted the Archivist at Wellington Barracks for his service record. He contacted me soon after to advise taht the record was not there. 'Coldstreamer' had a further look a while later, again without success. "Something worth looking at is that he may have carried on serving after the war especially as a pre-War regular, in that case his Service Records wouldn't be held in the Guards Museum but by the MOD, have you considered this option? " This might well be another avenue worth exploring. Do you know that date after which, if they were still serving, the MOD might have the records? Again. many thanks for any suggestions Kind regards John Hi John, In which case suggest you contact: Army Personnel Centre Historical Disclosures Mail Point 400 65 Brown Street Glasgow G2 8EX I got my dad's full regular Service Record 1933-46 from there last year. There is a cost but fairly minimal. Good luck. Cheers, Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roughdiamond Posted 22 April , 2010 Share Posted 22 April , 2010 According to the Long Long Trail the service records of those those serving after 1920 are held by the MOD, here's the contact details and everything you need to know about a request. http://www.veterans-uk.info/service_records/army.html Sam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldstreamer Posted 23 April , 2010 Share Posted 23 April , 2010 i have some 2nd btn pics of nco s will dig them out ....fingers crossed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldstreamer Posted 23 April , 2010 Share Posted 23 April , 2010 nothing sorry - the date suggests 4th battalion the CG records are all numerical - so the spelling wouldnt matter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldstreamer Posted 23 April , 2010 Share Posted 23 April , 2010 just checked the 4th btn roll - he is on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldstreamer Posted 23 April , 2010 Share Posted 23 April , 2010 invalided 5.12.15 from the 4th btn - no other entry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frajohn Posted 26 April , 2010 Author Share Posted 26 April , 2010 Hi All Again thank you for the advice and information Hi Coldstreamer Many thanks for taking the time to look and see if you had a photo. Believe it or not I do not have a clue what he looked like, never having seen a photo of him. The info on the 4th Battalion is interesting, does that mean he transferred after the war started to the 4th? As he was a regular I was surprised that he did not go earlier with the 2nd Battalion. There was a statement made by my Grandmother at his inquest which stated he was an instructor in the army. Also, invalided 5.12.15 from the 4th btn - no other entry, does that mean he would have left the army at that point? Why I ask is that he had a daughter die January 1917. On the death certificate it states, under father's occupation, CSM Coldstream Guards. What are your thoughts? Thanks very much for your input, it is really appreciated. Kind regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldstreamer Posted 27 April , 2010 Share Posted 27 April , 2010 Id suggest that was the date he left the battalion - he could well have been needed to train the new rerecuits and a new Btn would need experience NCOs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frajohn Posted 27 April , 2010 Author Share Posted 27 April , 2010 Thanks for that Coldstreamer After looking on the website mentioned in post #11 I see that; ARMY RECORDS • Historical Disclosures has access to the records of all Army personnel discharged from regular or reserve service between 1921 and 1997 except Officers and Soldiers of the Foot Guards Regiments. These records are held at the Regimental Headquarters in Wellington Barracks, Birdcage Walk, London, SW1E 6HQ. I am now confused if there is any point in contacting Army Personnel Centre, Historical Disclosures. Any advice?? Kind regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinThwaite Posted 28 April , 2010 Share Posted 28 April , 2010 Thanks for that Coldstreamer After looking on the website mentioned in post #11 I see that; ARMY RECORDS • Historical Disclosures has access to the records of all Army personnel discharged from regular or reserve service between 1921 and 1997 except Officers and Soldiers of the Foot Guards Regiments. These records are held at the Regimental Headquarters in Wellington Barracks, Birdcage Walk, London, SW1E 6HQ. I am now confused if there is any point in contacting Army Personnel Centre, Historical Disclosures. Any advice?? Kind regards John Hello again John, I suggest you give RHQ a ring on 020 74143246 - they will confirm where the records are, Wellington Bks or APC Glasgow. Cheers, Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frajohn Posted 28 April , 2010 Author Share Posted 28 April , 2010 Thanks Border Phoned RHQ to enquire and was told that all Coldstream Guards records would be kept by them. However most Guards records were destroyed in WWII. As such cannot help me! .............. another ................. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinThwaite Posted 28 April , 2010 Share Posted 28 April , 2010 Thanks Border Phoned RHQ to enquire and was told that all Coldstream Guards records would be kept by them. However most Guards records were destroyed in WWII. As such cannot help me! .............. another ................. Dont give up!! I've just been on the CG website (found via google) www.rhqcoldmgds.co.uk They have to do a manual search but you may be lucky - my grandad's were still there! There is a form to download & submit with £35 - anyway best of luck, Regards, Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldstreamer Posted 28 April , 2010 Share Posted 28 April , 2010 hmmm - did you speak with the coldstream archivist ? Ive always found ww2 papers.....and the coldstream archivist I thought was on holiday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frajohn Posted 28 April , 2010 Author Share Posted 28 April , 2010 No. it was not possible to speak with the archivist. The lady I spoke with did not want to listen as to what i was trying to say. All she would repeat was that if the archivist had said to my original enquirey (some years ago) that he found nothing, them there was nothing to be found. I tried to explain that I thought my Grandfather might have served beyond 1921, she then said that the majority of the WW1 records had been lost in WW2. I did say that i was under the impression that this did not apply to the Guards records she said that I was was wrong. When I requested if I might be able to speak with him, I was told no as there was no point. As I said a brick wall Kind regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldstreamer Posted 29 April , 2010 Share Posted 29 April , 2010 send me a pm and i will forward to the archivist for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frajohn Posted 4 May , 2010 Author Share Posted 4 May , 2010 "send me a pm and i will forward to the archivist for you" Many thanks for that kind offer. I will send the PM with relevant details in the next day or two. Kind regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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