1st Battalion South Staffs Regiment

[riverbrooke]

My grandfather Pte (later Sgt) 6156 William Richards was a Boer War veteran and served with the BEF from October 1914 until his discharge on 14.12.18 with 1st Battalion S. Staffs. He was awarded the 1915 Star. We know his history but would like to know how to trace the battles that the Battalion fought in. Also, he was reputed to have saved the life of the Battalion Major (Major C.H. Green) who was so grateful that he built four houses in Duke St, West Bromwich after the war, three of which he allowed my grandfather and members of his family to live in. How can we find out about the incident concerned?

[sotonmate]

Coomera

No service record seems to have survived the 1940 bombing.

His Medal Card shows he was entitled to 1914-15 Star,British War and Victory Medals.

He first landed in a war theatre in France on 17.12.1914,the Battalion first landed in Aug 1914 so he would have been in a replacement batch. He was discharged on 14.12.1918.

There are three War Diaries for the 1 SSR.

On landing in France in Aug 1914,with 22 Brigade of 7 Division,the Diary ref is WO95/1664,and runs to Dec 1915. It is digital and can be downloaded on payment of GBP3.50.

In Dec 1915 the Bn left 22 Brigade and joined 91 Brigade of the same Division,the Diary ref is WO95/1670,runs to Nov 1917,and is also digital and downloadable for 3.50.

In Nov 1917 1 SSR and 7 Div left for Italy,the Diary ref is WO95/4227 and runs to Mar 1919. It is not digital.

Here the page from the LLT at top left of this page,for 7 Division's war:

http://www.1914-1918.net/7div.htm

Sotonmate

[riverbrooke]

Coomera

No service record seems to have survived the 1940 bombing.

His Medal Card shows he was entitled to 1914-15 Star,British War and Victory Medals.

He first landed in a war theatre in France on 17.12.1914,the Battalion first landed in Aug 1914 so he would have been in a replacement batch. He was discharged on 14.12.1918.

There are three War Diaries for the 1 SSR.

On landing in France in Aug 1914,with 22 Brigade of 7 Division,the Diary ref is WO95/1664,and runs to Dec 1915. It is digital and can be downloaded on payment of GBP3.50.

In Dec 1915 the Bn left 22 Brigade and joined 91 Brigade of the same Division,the Diary ref is WO95/1670,runs to Nov 1917,and is also digital and downloadable for 3.50.

In Nov 1917 1 SSR and 7 Div left for Italy,the Diary ref is WO95/4227 and runs to Mar 1919. It is not digital.

Here the page from the LLT at top left of this page,for 7 Division's war:

http://www.1914-1918.net/7div.htm

Sotonmate

[riverbrooke]

sotonmate

Thank you for the info. We believe that he was not a replacement, as you suggest, as he had left the Regiment about 1904/05, when he married. So was recalled as a reservist or re-enlisted. We would guess he, and others like him, would not have been combat ready by early October, so they did not disembark at Belgium but went on to France and continued training until Dec when they went to the Front. We know that he was injured at some point and do not believe that he went to Italy. Do you think his very early discharge has any significance in this regard?

Coomera.

[Roy Evans]

Hi Coomera,

There are a couple of 'standard' books covering the 1st South Staffords in WW1 but I'm away from home at the moment and can't give you the exact titles but undoubtedly Chris Baker will be along soon. They are both long out of print but still crop up on second-hand book sites fairly frequently.

Also, check out Chris Bakers ‘Long Long Trail’ website (see LLT link at the top left on the forum Home page).

I've checked with the war diary and I'm afraid that your Grandfather doesn't get a mention.

Roy

[Chris_Baker]

Major (then Captain) Charles Henry Green, C Company, was wounded on 25-26 October 1914. The diary makes no mention of him returning to the battalion. It might be worth checking to see if his service record is at the National Archives, and a call to the regimental museum might throw a bit more light on the incident or what happened to Green after October 1914.

A check of William Richards' entries in the two medal rolls would also be worthwhile, just to make sure he only served with 1st Bn.

[Chris_Baker]

We believe that he was not a replacement, as you suggest

I think Sotonmate meant that he arrived with a reinforcement draft, coming to replace casualties. That is undoubtedly true. The battalion had to be rebuilt after coming out of First Ypres with fewer than 100 men.

so they did not disembark at Belgium but went on to France and continued training until Dec when they went to the Front

It would not work like that. On being recalled William would have trained with 3rd (Reserve) Battalion, initially at Lichfield and then at Plymouth, until joining a draft for France in mid December. It took a few days to get from the port to the battalion in the field. When William arrived the battalion was billeted at Sailly-sur-la-Lys.

[Roy Evans]

Here are the war diary entries for 25 - 26 October '14;

The whole Battalion were in the wood near the Brigade Headquarters just off the Ypres Road. At 4 a.m. the Regiment moved off towards KRUSEIK where we were attached to the 20th Brigade.

‘D’ Company under Captain Ransford was left under Colonel Earle who commanded the Grenadier Guards and who was a son of General Earle who was killed with Colonel Eyre at the Battle of Kirbekae on the 10th February 1885. Here you see that history repeats itself again. Of course to those who do not know, General Earle commanded the force at the battle of Kiebekae, Colonel Eyre was the Colonel who commanded the 38th Regiment at this battle and who had risen from the ranks being granted a Commission for distinguished service in the Crimea.

The rest of the Battalion entrenched at the bottom of the hill behind the Grenadier Guards section and near the Brigade Headquarters. ‘A’ Company dug trenches along the road and ‘B’ and ‘C’ occupied the bomb-proof shelters near the Battalion Staff H.Q.

On the night of the 25th, about 7 p.m. ‘D’ company who were in Reserve with the Grenadiers were ordered to go up and reinforce the firing line and after they had been there some considerable time they captured 19 German prisoners behind the Grenadiers trenches. As ‘D’ Company entered the village behind the Grenadier Guards trenches they surprised a German patrol of snipers and took them prisoners. Captain Ransford and Lieut. Twiss moved on with two platoons and, having moved forwards about 250 yards, came under very heavy rifle fire from the Scots Guards trench which was now in the possession of the Germans. At about the same time the Scots Guards behind commenced firing thinking they were the enemy.

It was here that Captain Ransford, I am informed by an officer that was present, told Lieut. Twiss to carry on. Captain Ransford, who had already been wounded a second time in the arm, went forward alone to reconnoitre the enemy’s position and has not been seen of heard of since. This officer, I am informed by all ranks, did excellent work, both on this day and many other days previous to the one described. This detachment was practically wiped out to a man.

Before midnight Lieut. Twiss who had also done very hard work, had been wounded. Orders were brought back to reinforce the party under Lieut. Twiss. This was being carried out when they came under heavy fire unexpectedly from the front, being under the impression that they were being fired at by their own men, they moved 70 yards to their left flank and got into the Grenadier Guards trenches and remained there until one hour before dawn.

In the course of the night a party of Germans came up to the front of the trench saying “Don’t shoot we are Scots Guards and South Staffords.” but when within about 10 yards the spikes of their helmets were plainly seen and the troops of course fired on them, and those that were left beat a hasty retreat.

Late this night, which was a very miserable one of continuous heavy rain the whole night through, ‘A’ Company under Major Welchman reinforced the Border Regiment. They had to advance to this position under a terrible hail of bullets. With reference to this advance, No. 2 Platoon under Lieut. McGeorge was ordered by Major Welchman to lie down in extended order. The Major moved forward to a farmhouse to see if he could see anybody there, and he shouted back “There is only one wounded”, and he was immediately returning when No. 4 Platoon under 2nd Lieut. Tomlinson came from the farmhouse and caught 6 German snipers. He brought them to Major Welchman who gave the order for them to be taken away to the 22nd Brigade Headquarters, immediately after which he ordered the N.C.Os. and men to get into the Border men’s trenches, after which they remained there until 8 a.m. on the 26th. The casualties here were very heavy. Major Welchman was wounded during the night or early morning. Lt. McGeorge was wounded about 7.15 a.m. on the 26th. Lieuts. Tomlinson and Bean, about 7.30 a.m. on the 26th, were both hit in the leg by a bullet; the latter two have not yet been heard of.

‘B’ Company were used on patrol in rear of the Grenadier Guards trenches, where they patrolled all night and retired from there at 7 a.m. on the 26th, going into our original barracks near the Battalion Headquarters. We remained there until 10 a.m. about which hour we received orders to reinforce ‘C’ Company. Two Platoons were sent forward under Lieut. Hume for this purpose and during the heavy firing several men were killed and wounded, including Lieut. Hume who did so well. He was undoubtedly one of the pluckiest and cheeriest of Officers and was smoking a cigarette at the time he was hit, and had previously been directing his men where to fire.

‘C’ Company advanced at 7.30 p.m. to reinforce the Border Regt. under very heavy rifle fire. They had instructions under Major Loder-Symonds and Lieut. Shore that the position was to be held at all costs. Early next morning a message for reinforcements was sent to the Colonel, who dispatched Lieut. Hume and party of ‘B’ Company. Major Buckle was also with this party.

It was this day that Colonel Ovens and Captain Bonner were ordered by the Brigadier of the 20th Brigade to hold the trenches or position in rear of the Gordons and the remainder of ‘B’ and ‘C’ Coys.

It was here that Colonel Ovens, who was fearfully pressed for men, saw a sort of general retirement. Captain White was sent to ascertain the reason of it and found that a message or word of command “Retire” had been given by, I think, a German. All Corps, numbering about 250 men and Officers were making a retirement in a disorderly mob. Captain White explained the retirement had not been ordered: he got the men together and with difficulty brought them forward to the firing line under fearful shell and rifle fire. This was of course what was badly wanted, as every man was urgently needed at this critical moment, and as these men were brought forward, Colonel Ovens and Captain Bonner, who had worked trying to cope with one of the most critical situations, managed to reinforce the most dangerous positions and kept the general line intact.

The 25th and 26th of October were the most trying days the Battalion had seen during the campaign to date. The Germans had been pressing hard all day to push through our very weak trenches, which had been very much reduced by fearful shell and rifle fire.

About 2 p.m. a party under Colonel Ovens and Captains Bonner and White took up a position along a ridge of ploughed land, also along a road and wood running N.E. to Gheluvelt, where we held the road until nearly dark, in view of, it was thought, a forced retirement of our Brigade who had suffered so severely. The enemy then were bursting their shrapnel beautifully on this ridge and Jack Johnsons were falling beside our hasty entrenchments dug with the small entrenching tool and even hands alone.

The following Officers and total men were killed and wounded during the days of the 25th and 26th October: -

‘A’ Company

Major Welchman wounded.

Captain de Trafford, prisoner.

Lieut. Bean, wounded and prisoner.

Lieut. McGeorge wounded.

Lieut. Tomlinson, wounded and prisoner.

‘B’ Company.

Lieut. Hume, killed.

‘C’ Company.

Captain Green, wounded.

Lieut. Shore, wounded.

Lieut. Moore-Radfield, wounded and missing.

‘D’ Company.

Captain Ransford, wounded and missing.

Lieut. Twiss, wounded.

Lieut. Bower, wounded.

Lieut. Riley, prisoner.

About 80 killed and 360 wounded and prisoners.

Roy

[archangel9]

Is this the same Major C.H. Green -

http://www.cwgc.org/search/casualty_detail...casualty=898288

Name: GREEN, CHARLES HENRY

Initials: C H

Nationality: United Kingdom

Rank: Major

Regiment/Service: South Staffordshire Regiment

Unit Text: 1st Bn.

Secondary Regiment: Nigeria Regiment, W.A.F.F.

Secondary Unit Text: attd. 3rd Bn.

Age: 35

Date of Death: 08/11/1917

Awards: Twice Mentioned in Despatches

Additional information: Fourth son of the late Sir Frederick Green, K.B.E., and Lady Green, of Oaklawn, Wimbledon Park, London, England; husband of Ruth Green (now Mrs. John Badham. of 14, Hill St., Knightsbridge, London, England.). Also served in France with the 7th Division from Oct., 1914, and was seriously wounded at the first Battle of Ypres.

Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead

Grave/Memorial Reference: Spec. Mem. No. 7.

Cemetery: DAR ES SALAAM WAR CEMETERY

If so perhaps it was his family who built the houses after the war? Or maybe the houses were built before he died?

John

[Chris_Baker]

Of course it is - I had forgotten all about that.

[riverbrooke]

Coomera

No service record seems to have survived the 1940 bombing.

His Medal Card shows he was entitled to 1914-15 Star,British War and Victory Medals.

He first landed in a war theatre in France on 17.12.1914,the Battalion first landed in Aug 1914 so he would have been in a replacement batch. He was discharged on 14.12.1918.

There are three War Diaries for the 1 SSR.

On landing in France in Aug 1914,with 22 Brigade of 7 Division,the Diary ref is WO95/1664,and runs to Dec 1915. It is digital and can be downloaded on payment of GBP3.50.

In Dec 1915 the Bn left 22 Brigade and joined 91 Brigade of the same Division,the Diary ref is WO95/1670,runs to Nov 1917,and is also digital and downloadable for 3.50.

In Nov 1917 1 SSR and 7 Div left for Italy,the Diary ref is WO95/4227 and runs to Mar 1919. It is not digital.

Here the page from the LLT at top left of this page,for 7 Division's war:

http://www.1914-1918.net/7div.htm

Sotonmate

[riverbrooke]

Thanks to all who provided further information re my grandfather. The reason I thought he trained in France is because his record shows his disembarkation date as 4.10.14. the same date as the battn disembarked in Belgium, but his record states only service in France.

It is likely that the houses were built by Major Green's father as some notes from a now deceased uncle speak of them being built by a "Mr Green", though after many years he may not have remembered that the gentleman had a title. New info is that they were, in fact built in 1932/33 and my father moved into one of them (next door to his father William) when I was six months old. So we do not know of the connection between the Major and my grandad, though it may have been something when the Major was wounded.

Reading the diaries I cannot but be amazed that my grandfather survived not only the full four years but also the Boer war previously - a lucky man!.

coomera.

[riverbrooke]

I think Sotonmate meant that he arrived with a reinforcement draft, coming to replace casualties. That is undoubtedly true. The battalion had to be rebuilt after coming out of First Ypres with fewer than 100 men.

It would not work like that. On being recalled William would have trained with 3rd (Reserve) Battalion, initially at Lichfield and then at Plymouth, until joining a draft for France in mid December. It took a few days to get from the port to the battalion in the field. When William arrived the battalion was billeted at Sailly-sur-la-Lys.

Please excuse my ignorance of these matters - I am a bit new to it. However, on further examination there are two medal cards for William Richards but with different numbers (Sgt 6156 & Pte 8250) & the Roll No's and Page No's are different. The Sgt receiving the '15 Star the Pte not for some reason. My grandfather was a Sgt and the earlier No would , perhaps be from his Boer War time? If this is the case, your explanation seems to be the correct one with the Pte going over on 4.10.14 and g'pa in mid Dec - explaining his '15 Star rather than a '14.

Coomera

[riverbrooke]

Re: W.O. William Richards, 1st Bttn South Staffs Regt. I have now learnt that my grandfather was Warrant Officer when he was discharged, and regularly attended Regimental reunions between the wars. I have further information, at this stage only anecdotal but I am investigating. Firstly he is said to have been twice mentioned in dispatches, once for shooting two enemy snipers, and again for bringing back a wounded Officer - Major Green presumably. I am also told that he was Regimental Heavyweight Boxing Champion and fought the professional British Heavyweight Champion - Bombadier Billy Wells - on five occasions, Wells winning three times and W.O. Williams twice. As these were not professional fights they are not recorded. They were probably inter - regiment fights, Wells being in the R.A. I believe.This was in the twilight of Wells' career but nevertheless quite an achievement. W.O. Richards lived in the house at Duke Street, West Bromwich until his death in the mid-sixties.

coomera.

[Roy Evans]

There are several metions of Boxing matches in the South Stafford's war diaries, I'll look for any mention in the 1st Batt'ns when I get a chance.

Roy

[Chevin92]

Would anyone happen to know the war diaries for the 1st Battalion south Staffordshire from say August /October 1917??

Many thanks Callan

[Chris_Baker]

Downloading a digitised copy from the National Archives website would cost you a princely £3.50: http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_q=1+battalion+south+staffordshire+regiment&_hb=tna&_col=200

[Ancre1917]

Or you could try your local library which I know has a subscription to Ancestry. From memory, I think you need to find

www.ancestrylibrary.com

The Search drop down menu will take you to

Military. Histories.

Then it's a matter of searching for the relevant diary in

All UK, WWI War Diaries (France, Belgium and Germany), 1914-1920

Richard

[GraemeClarke]

Hi

Are you looking for something in particular, you've posted quite a large date span ?

Regards,

Graeme

[Blue Dragoon]

On 14/04/2010 at 08:09, Roy Evans said:

Here are the war diary entries for 25 - 26 October '14;

 

Roy this is brilliant, cant thank you enough!  I can now add that war diary summary to this service summary for my 1st Cousin Charles.  Just the MGC element of his career to work out!

 

Charles Barratt (8753) 1st Bn S Staffs and (19243 or 19245) MGC - 1892–1960 - An Old Contemptible

 

https://wolverhamptonswar.wordpress.com/2017/09/29/the-barratt-brothers/

The Midland Counties Express of 11 September 1915

Charles (22) of the 1st Battalion South Staffordshire Regiment, was in South Africa when war was declared. He went out to France and was wounded on 26 October, being shot through the left forearm. He was sent home on sick leave but went out to France again in February 1915.

 

Charles was born in Wolverhampton on 14 November 1892. From 1899 onwards, he attended St Michael’s Church of England Junior School. He survived the war and died in 1960 in Bilston at the age of 67.

 

Circa Dec 1909/Jan 1910 - Enlistment – South Staffordshire Regiment service number 8619 joined on 4th August 1909 and South Staffordshire Regiment service number 8761 joined on 5th January 1910.  It is assumed, therefore, that Charles probably joined late 1909 or early 1910.

1911-1912 -  Lichfield and Gibraltar - The 1911 Census shows he was an army groom for a Captain Sidney Chaytor Welchman (who joined MI5 on 2^nd August 1915) living in Ivy Cottage near Whittington Barracks, Lichfield.  In 1911 the 1^st Battalion moved to Gibraltar. While in Gibraltar, new colours were presented to the battalion by King George V on 31 January 1912.

1913 – South Africa - The battalion was then posted to South Africa in 1913 where it was based when Britain declared war on Germany on 7 Aug.  On this date the British Expeditionary Force (BEF) starts to land in France to assist the French and Belgians in stopping the German offensive. Although much smaller than the French Army, the BEF are all seasoned professional volunteers, rather than raw conscripts.

(The Midland Counties Express of 11 September 1915 states that:  ‘Charles (22) of the 1st Battalion South Staffordshire Regiment, was in South Africa when war was declared.’)

19 September 1914 – Landed Southampton

4 Oct 1914 – Deployed BEF France and Flanders - 1st Battalion landed at Zeebrugge as part of the 22nd Brigade in 7th Division in October 1914 for service on the Western Front).

19 Oct – 22 Nov - The First Battle of Ypres - The last major battle of the first year of World War I, ends the Race to the Sea. The Germans are prevented from reaching Calais and Dunkirk, thus cutting off the British Army’s supply lines. Part of the price paid for the victory is the complete destruction of The Old Contemptibles – the highly experienced and professional British regular army will be replaced by fresh reserves of conscripts. Only 100 1st Battalion soldiers were effective at the end of the battle

26 Oct 1914 – Wounded in First Battle of Ypres.

(The ‘Midland Counties Express’ edition of 11 September 1915 states he ‘was wounded on 26 October, being shot through the left forearm. He was sent home on sick leave but went out to France again in February 1915.’ )

 

MGC Unit and Transfer Date – TBC

19249 transferred to MGC 28 May 1916

 

7th Mar 1919 – Discharged to Section B Army Reserve - The most common form of army reserve service for men who had completed their service in the regular army and were serving their normal period (typically of five years) on reserve. Section B reservists could only be called upon in the event of general mobilisation. Pay was 3 shillings and 6 pence a week.

Soldiers were only eligible for the Silver War Badge (SWB) if they were discharged from the army under the relevant Kings Regulation.  The majority were discharged under Para 392: no longer fit for further war service.  Expiry of a normal term of engagement did not entitle a soldier to a SWB even if he had been wounded and Charles was simply demobbed at the end of his service.