British Uniforms & Equipment of The Great War 1914-18

[Krithia]

Quoting from the MLRS book site "For those with an interest in the uniforms of the Great War, this book fills a long-vacant gap in the available published material. Even the keenest student will find much new material and yet more which will be unfamiliar. None of this has been available in any title yet published. Whatever titles on uniforms - that the reader already has on his bookshelf - are effectively redundant. In over 400 pages, this title describes more than the sum total of all titles yet seen".

Quite a statement, but this is from the publisher so may be a little biased. Well, with most of this I have to agree, the 445 pages, 600 full colour and 500 period black and white photos makes this a mammoth book that does not scrimp on the subject. From the standard service dress jackets, caps and helmets to Jumpers, serge, blue, tunnellers or Rugs, motorcar, officers and to quote a section of the book “the Galosh was attached to a Vamp Lining, with a Tongue sewn to this sandwich” would have any non cobbler confused, until now.

John Bodworth’s book has done a lot to plug the gap in British uniforms and equipment of WW1, an area many authors have dabbled, but none taking on the task of producing a work with this amount of detail. When I wrote a similar work, namely “Uniforms & Equipment of the British Army in World War One” which was published by Schiffer back in 2005 my aim was to cover the same subject but purely with period photographs. John has gone much further, including not only period photographs, but modern day colour photos of clothing and necessaries, drawings and a huge array of period adverts, AO’s, price listings and trade catalogues. There is excellent and detailed coverage of Scottish dress regulations which has always been scanty in most other publications, and also coverage, albeit brief, of the 'others', e.g. RFC, Australian, New Zealand, Canadian, Kitcheners Army, VT, etc. The ‘english’ line regiment clothing and general necessaries coverage is also good.

I would dispute the publishers statement that “None of this has been available in any title yet published”, a vast majority of it has, but in smaller periodicals, fragmented over the years. For example our pal Joe Sweeney’s excellent Militaria Magazine articles. Where John’s book really succeeds, and I must congratulate him on this, is pulling this altogether and then adding a lot of missing information through his knowledge and what must be many years of research, to provide us with a massive work on uniforms and necessaries that we, until now, had not seen. Being really picky it would have been nice to see more photos of the actual items instead of using illustrations or period photos, but saying that, this is me being picky as I realise that so many of these items today are very rare. The promising title to the book is the subtitle which states it is volume one, we all wait with baited breath for volume 2 ... I hope this is the long awaited volume on British equipment, and if as good as this book it will be worth saving your money and room on the book shelves now.

The main and only real negative is the price versus the quality of the book. By quality I do not mean the contents of John’s text, photos or examples of uniform etc included, but rather the book bindings which after a few hours read is beginning to weaken already. The A4 book should have been hardback, not softback with what appears low grade paper. This type of book will be used by many of us as a regular reference so I can foresee pages loosening very quickly. The reproduction quality of the illustrations is also not that good, saying that I have seen worse. For £60 you will have to forgive the odd pixelly photo and suspect colour reproduction, as the contents and quality of John’s research is more than worth it. It’s a superb reference work that all with an interest in WW1 Brit should, actually MUST have.

regards, Krithia

http://www.mlrsbooks.co.uk/bookstore/index....html?CatID=116

[Muerrisch]

I cannot see me parting with £60 for a book that will fall to pieces, however good the content. As for low grade paper! I think I will talk my local library into having a punt.

As I am still sorely tempted, please how does it deal with all the things sewn, clipped, etc to the SD jacket ..... badges, for want of a better single word?

[Krithia]

I cannot see me parting with £60 for a book that will fall to pieces, however good the content. As for low grade paper! I think I will talk my local library into having a punt.

As I am still sorely tempted, please how does it deal with all the things sewn, clipped, etc to the SD jacket ..... badges, for want of a better single word?

In my view it is still worth the money. Re all things sewn, clipped, pinned etc, there is a fair bit included, but its focus is uniforms and necessaries as in the title, if its the latter you want, this could be the book for you. Saying that, I know you are biased towards a bit of cloth and metal ! :-)

[Joe Sweeney]

Krithia,

Thanks--I look forward to the book and I think it will be well worth the money--although I do agree with Grumpy--it is in the price range of some very well done other publication that are well bound etc. I'm sure I'll have it in pieces in months-but if that is my only complaint its minor.

I empathize with John B. Leave it to a seller to put up as advertisement the one picture some-one like me would latch on too "Isn't that a Post war cap?"

Joe Sweeney

[Muerrisch]

In my view it is still worth the money. Re all things sewn, clipped, pinned etc, there is a fair bit included, but its focus is uniforms and necessaries as in the title, if its the latter you want, this could be the book for you. Saying that, I know you are biased towards a bit of cloth and metal ! :-)

Thank you.

Me, biased?

Perish the thought!

Library it is.

[Sapper Will]

Krithia: Does the book discuss kilts, and does yours as well?

[Krithia]

Krithia: Does the book discuss kilts, and does yours as well?

Hi Sapper,

Yes, John Bodsworth has good coverage of kilts, photographing many in full colour along with the relevant hose. I did include quite a few B&W wartime photographs as well of soldiers wearing kilts, but none of the individual items in colour as John has shown.

Hope this helps, Krithia

[trenchtrotter]

Taken the plunge and ordered a copy.

TT

[Andrew Hesketh]

Thread reinstated following some edits.

The publisher has responded with comments relating to the binding and paper issues highlighted above on the following thread: http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/i...p;#entry1373855

[squirrel]

My copy arrived this morning and I was waiting with some trepidation after reading the two threads regarding the book.

I have to say that I was pleasantly surprised. The paper is good quality and the binding what you would expect from a paperback (laminated cover by the way). I have other large size paperbacks that are not as well made as this one and they were not cheap either. Looking after the book as you would any other similar paperback is all that is needed.

The text is crisp and clear, the coloured illustrations bright and detailed and the reproduction of the photographs, considering that the originals are over 90 years old, more than acceptable.

It as an excellent book as regards content and a labour of love by the author as far as I can see.

An excellent addition to the book shelves of anybody with an interest in WW1 uniforms IMHO.

[Muerrisch]

Now, to be constructive.

The book, we are agreed, is an important addition to the genre.

The book, we will probably agree, has inevitable errors of omission and commission, which will be picked up here and there in various fields of expertise. .

It would be useful to have a continuation of this thread where we note the few problems we find, so that individual copies can be annotated with the collective wisdom.

I have a few in the pipeline for later in the week.

[Muerrisch]

First comment.

The armband/armlet/brassard illustrations.

I can find no indication that these are artists attempts to portray these armbands .......... they are certainly not all photos of specimens.

If I and others more learned have pondered long and hard as to whether lettering was upper case or lower case, what the font was, what the point size, what the shade of red etc .........

Surely there should be a disclaimer?

Without an example, some of the RACD ledger and PVCN descriptions do NOT give enough information to go on.

Its one thing to put a mock-up on the site here, quite another to publish it without [again I say, as far as I can see] a disclaimer.

So my suggestion for a pencilled note is:

"treat these illustrations with considerable caution".

[Muerrisch]

Second comment.

Cloured shoulder straps SD jacket Great War period

can find no mention of these in index or indeed text or ills.

This quoted from a forum thread:

The blue shoulder straps indicate a signaller. This was an per an order in 1917. I'm sorry I can't quote chapter and verse, but someone showed me the order many years ago in a period document. I've seen several of these over the years, all to different units and all with the brass sigs. qualification badge.

Regards,

W.

Graham StewartDec 8 2009, 01:02 PM

Wainfleet is probably correct, as I have photos of the N.F. Signallers also wearing the light blue and even oblongs shapes on the lower arm and also coloured shoulder straps.

GRUMPYDec 8 2009, 04:21 PM

The order has escaped my diligent reading and copying of AOs, but there you go.

A lot of trouble to go to, one wonders why anyone thought it necessary?

Still, an army that could solemnly issue an order that saluting with either hand was to cease [in favour of right only] presumably had time on its hands!

tocemmaDec 8 2009, 04:47 PM

To echo what has been said about the shoulder strap colour (and I think it might have been me that passed the information to Wainfleet some years ago) this was definitely ordered. Not only that I believe red was used by runners and also yellow (from memory salvage or follow up parties) I will try and locate the copy of the relevant orders.

I once owned an NF SD jacket with red shoulder straps which also had bomb collar badges.

I'm sure I posted a photo a few months back showing signallers with the blue shoulder straps specifically mentioned in the original caption handwritten on the reverse. I will repost. I also have a photo of a 38th Div signaller with the blue shoulder straps being worn.

If memory serves I believe the order to have been in 1917 around the time the cloth shoulder slides were ordered to be stitched to the upper sleeves (but I could be wrong here)

I'll see what I can dig out.

Regards

Tocemma

I assume these were 'clothing' as defined.

Recommendation:

insert note to effect 'strap colours intro. c. 1917, red = ...........etc etc etc'

[Muerrisch]

Third comment.

The Philosophy behind the book ..... the 'Objective' as it were.

In the Foreword, John notes that there are published compendia of cap badges, collar badges, shoulder titles etc, and makes it clear that he is not concerned with them, but with 'the actual clothing'.

I suspect he then came to believe that these subjects were needed to add [literally] colour to the book, and to prevent it being too narrow.

Be that as it may, what we now have as part of our £60 softback book is a brief unsatisfactory skirmish with the above subjects, and with rank badges, and armlets, and one or two other intrinsically interesting disciplines. Medal ribbons, a focus of the soldier's pride, receive the most glancing of blows [And yet detailed coverage is given, for example, of the short-lived officer rank badges of 1902].

None of the objects pinned, stitched, or otherwise attached to SD are particularly well covered, and all of which are susceptible to good coverage given a little diligence or a little asking for help, even a little use of the Forum facilities.

In my next comments, I will seek to address detailed errors, principally of commission, on these 'compendia' subjects.

Recommendation: none possible, the book is the book is the book.

[Muerrisch]

Fourth comment.

Overseas Service chevrons. p26.

Might with advantage have quoted cut-off date for qualification, as this effectively put a maximum on total possible.

AO 57/ Feb 1920, .... qualifying service to cease from 1st May 1920.

Reccommendation: pencil addendum.

[Grovetown]

Grumpy: what about the production values - paper, repro and binding quality etc?

Were Krithia's and Tocemma's 'rogue' copies as suggested?

Best wishes,

GT.

[Andrew Hesketh]

David, whilst I appreciate the clear expertise with which you uncover errors or concerns, you are giving the impression that it's a very unreliable book. Are you coming to that conclusion? Or are these errors / concerns merely needles in haystacks?

[Muerrisch]

The paper and the printing and the binding ..... whereas "not a 60 quid book" by comparison with many another, are fully acceptable on my copy, and, in areas where I have no expertise, provide a great deal of information which I am very grateful for. In particular, a photo is a photo is a photo, and a tailor's advert is just that, and a quote from an AO, ACI or whatever is just that. Certainly I have never seen anything like as wide and deep a coverage of Clothing. John appears out of his depth on some "badges" to use a blanket description, and would have done well not to have bothered with them, or to have consulted more widely. Needles in haystacks? A matter of judgement.

What motivates my comments is precisely because I can envisage that the book will become a bible, but a bible with warts, some of which I can identify, some of which others can identify. This Forum is uniquely well served with people who can help to improve this reference book.

Do I regret buying it? No, but it is pricey for the format adopted.

[as an aside, my co-edited/ co-everything-else Old Soldiers Never Die and Old Soldier Sahib retailed at £25. I am very very proud of them. They will last a lifetime and beyond, they look good, feel good, smell good and [as far as I am aware] probably taste good. The subject book could have done with:

.peer review or very critical scrutiny before publishing

.a publisher willing and able to go for a big project

.or a lower price.

[Muerrisch]

Fifth Comment

Good Conduct Badges and Pay p.56.

1. the periods quoted 18,23,28 were reduced by 2 years each if soldier of continuous good conduct.

2. unless a soldier had enlisted before 1906, and had opted to continue to receive Service Pay, there was no financial reward after that date.[this is because Proficiency Pay superceded many 'extras' including those for musketry, signalling etc. A soldier was expected to be Proficient and was paid accordingly.

Reccommendation:

this is a straightforward error, which I can prove, so annotate this page accordingly.

[davidflies]

The paper and the printing and the binding ..... whereas "not a 60 quid book" by comparison with many another, are fully acceptable on my copy, and, in areas where I have no expertise, provide a great deal of information which I am very grateful for. In particular, a photo is a photo is a photo, and a tailor's advert is just that, and a quote from an AO, ACI or whatever is just that. Certainly I have never seen anything like as wide and deep a coverage of Clothing. John appears out of his depth on some "badges" to use a blanket description, and would have done well not to have bothered with them, or to have consulted more widely. Needles in haystacks? A matter of judgement.

What motivates my comments is precisely because I can envisage that the book will become a bible, but a bible with warts, some of which I can identify, some of which others can identify. This Forum is uniquely well served with people who can help to improve this reference book.

Do I regret buying it? No, but it is pricey for the format adopted.

[as an aside, my co-edited/ co-everything-else Old Soldiers Never Die and Old Soldier Sahib retailed at £25. I am very very proud of them. They will last a lifetime and beyond, they look good, feel good, smell good and [as far as I am aware] probably taste good. The subject book could have done with:

.peer review or very critical scrutiny before publishing

.a publisher willing and able to go for a big project

.or a lower price.

I feel, as publisher, that I should comment on the last items in this post:

Peer review is a good idea if one has the time to wait (up to three years probably) but I felt that the book was of such significance in its field as to warrant our going ahead with publication as it stood - after all it represents many years research by the author and was over two years in the writing. Needless to say the peer review is now taking place and I am quite sure that JB will take everything on board so that revisions cab be published at a future date - probably along the lines of amendments with which I assume everyone is familiar. As far as critical scrutiny is concerned I felt that my knowledge of the subject precluded me from making any comment at all apart from the general feeling that the book was and is well worth publishing, and has been prepared by JB to an extraordinarily high standard. We have changed absolutely nothing in the text apart from the odd spelling/typo error - the book is as JB wrote and assembled it.

We were and are willing to go for this project - and I think we have proved that. Admittedly a great majority of the titles in our list are reprints of excellent work done many years ago, but I think we have the right to go for different areas - the fact that some copies were badly printed was our mistake, but I do not think that this debars us from trying to get a worthwhile reference book onto the market. The fact that we, as a company, are very small does not have any real significance - we may not be part of a big house, but we are making every effort to publish worthwhile and significant material - and this book forms part of that. Incidentally to improve our print quality we have just invested over £12,000 in new printers, and as they come on stream the effect will be seen.

I would add that when I saw the extent and content of the book I did offer it for hardback production to a mainstream publisher who took a year's licence back in January 2009. When this expired and nothing had appeared we decided that the waiting was over and that we would go it alone. We did so, and have no regrets.

Price: many of our books go out through the trade, and we have to be able to offer a competitive discount. When one ties in all the costs of printing the book (even discounting the time spent marketing and other tasks) the total comes to quite a considerable sum. Now if we were Schiffer or another house we could have 2,000 copies printed in China or elsewhere and be quite happy to remainder the book after six months. We however print every copy ourselves in house, and we bind it by hand, and laminate the covers by hand as well. All of this takes time and therefore money, which has to be added to the cost of ink and other consumables so the price represents a reasonable profit to us and allows us to sell at a decent discount to the trade. If we were to reduce the price it would mean that the margin would shrink and in no time at all we would lose money on every copy - and we are not in business to lose money, however much we may love doing what we do - and this last matter is what makes it all worth while to all of us - and there are only four of us in the firm.

So, please keep the critique going and I will follow all comments with a view to issuing a free amendment list at a future date (probably before Volume 2 comes on the market). We will offer the amendments to all purchasers free of charge when the amendments have been verified and assembled into a coherent list.

[trenchtrotter]

David,

Nice gesture. I welcome the book and accept all comments. I think you run a company that rerally cares and that is important. Without companies such as yours taking a gamble (if it was) then it may never have been printed which would be a shame!

Kind regards

TT

[Andrew Hesketh]

Just an aside and not wearing an Admin hat...

I'm thrilled with the fact that a publisher of a very specialised book that will be of huge benefit to many Great War enthusiasts is willing to partake in debate with us and take on board any comments that are made. It takes guts. The publisher is also clearly willing to accept recommendations for alterations in a reprint etc. and has made a generous offer in his most recent post. He has clearly understood David's well made point that such a tome might quickly be regarded as a 'bible' and incorrect information becomes accepted as true.

But I'm concerned that a publisher who takes a risk on a book that (let's face it) is not going to trouble the bestesellers list might take the view that he doesn't need non-stop criticism and hassle and the next time a worthy Great War manuscript lands on his desk may think 'stuff that'.

As our new member is showing willing, perhaps we should also let him know what's good about it?

[davidflies]

Just an aside and not wearing an Admin hat...

I'm thrilled with the fact that a publisher of a very specialised book that will be of huge benefit to many Great War enthusiasts is willing to partake in debate with us and take on board any comments that are made. It takes guts. The publisher is also clearly willing to accept recommendations for alterations in a reprint etc. and has made a generous offer in his most recent post. He has clearly understood David's well made point that such a tome might quickly be regarded as a 'bible' and incorrect information becomes accepted as true.

But I'm concerned that a publisher who takes a risk on a book that (let's face it) is not going to trouble the bestesellers list might take the view that he doesn't need non-stop criticism and hassle and the next time a worthy Great War manuscript lands on his desk may think 'stuff that'.

As our new member is showing willing, perhaps we should also let him know what's good about it?

Such kind and positive comments make my job worth while - and I can promise all prospective authors that if they put a proposal to me I will consider it in detail. We have taken a few fliers in our six years, and one or two have gone the way of the lead balloon - but that's what life is about. I have this strange dream that one day all books we publish will be best sellers, but we will never find a JK Rowling in the world of military history - the great writers are gone because their style is nowadays regarded as passé - perhaps we should consider reprinting Tacitus and Thucydides? But, seriously, we try our best and even then sometimes drop a brick or two - but we are not going to give up, and we don't give up on our authors (normally).

As far as publishing non-bestseller list books, that's what we are in business for - to print and reprint material that would otherwise be regarded as too time-consuming for mainstream publishers to bother with. Many of our books include hand-folded A3, A2 and even A1 illustrations and maps because the size is important in reading such maps and illustrations - cutting them to A4 is both lazy and non-productive - and they are big in the original for a reason - clarity! So we will go on producing single copies (although sometimes we get a print run of 10 or even 15 copies at once!) in the belief that what we are doing IS valuable, even if we do drop the occasional clanger - after all we always replace duff copies.

By the way, keep an eye on our web site over the next week or two - we have just been awarded another MoD contract, details of which will be made available once we have a countersigned contract from DIPR.

[davidflies]

Quoting from the MLRS book site "For those with an interest in the uniforms of the Great War, this book fills a long-vacant gap in the available published material. Even the keenest student will find much new material and yet more which will be unfamiliar. None of this has been available in any title yet published. Whatever titles on uniforms - that the reader already has on his bookshelf - are effectively redundant. In over 400 pages, this title describes more than the sum total of all titles yet seen".

Quite a statement, but this is from the publisher so may be a little biased. Well, with most of this I have to agree, the 445 pages, 600 full colour and 500 period black and white photos makes this a mammoth book that does not scrimp on the subject. From the standard service dress jackets, caps and helmets to Jumpers, serge, blue, tunnellers or Rugs, motorcar, officers and to quote a section of the book “the Galosh was attached to a Vamp Lining, with a Tongue sewn to this sandwich” would have any non cobbler confused, until now.

John Bodworth’s book has done a lot to plug the gap in British uniforms and equipment of WW1, an area many authors have dabbled, but none taking on the task of producing a work with this amount of detail. When I wrote a similar work, namely “Uniforms & Equipment of the British Army in World War One” which was published by Schiffer back in 2005 my aim was to cover the same subject but purely with period photographs. John has gone much further, including not only period photographs, but modern day colour photos of clothing and necessaries, drawings and a huge array of period adverts, AO’s, price listings and trade catalogues. There is excellent and detailed coverage of Scottish dress regulations which has always been scanty in most other publications, and also coverage, albeit brief, of the 'others', e.g. RFC, Australian, New Zealand, Canadian, Kitcheners Army, VT, etc. The ‘english’ line regiment clothing and general necessaries coverage is also good.

I would dispute the publishers statement that “None of this has been available in any title yet published”, a vast majority of it has, but in smaller periodicals, fragmented over the years. For example our pal Joe Sweeney’s excellent Militaria Magazine articles. Where John’s book really succeeds, and I must congratulate him on this, is pulling this altogether and then adding a lot of missing information through his knowledge and what must be many years of research, to provide us with a massive work on uniforms and necessaries that we, until now, had not seen. Being really picky it would have been nice to see more photos of the actual items instead of using illustrations or period photos, but saying that, this is me being picky as I realise that so many of these items today are very rare. The promising title to the book is the subtitle which states it is volume one, we all wait with baited breath for volume 2 ... I hope this is the long awaited volume on British equipment, and if as good as this book it will be worth saving your money and room on the book shelves now.

The main and only real negative is the price versus the quality of the book. By quality I do not mean the contents of John’s text, photos or examples of uniform etc included, but rather the book bindings which after a few hours read is beginning to weaken already. The A4 book should have been hardback, not softback with what appears low grade paper. This type of book will be used by many of us as a regular reference so I can foresee pages loosening very quickly. The reproduction quality of the illustrations is also not that good, saying that I have seen worse. For £60 you will have to forgive the odd pixelly photo and suspect colour reproduction, as the contents and quality of John’s research is more than worth it. It’s a superb reference work that all with an interest in WW1 Brit should, actually MUST have.

regards, Krithia

http://www.mlrsbooks.co.uk/bookstore/index....html?CatID=116

Actually the quote is from a review of the book which appeared in the "Armourer".

[Peter Doyle]

Interesting debate. I think I brought this book to the attention of several members in one of my threads (that on simplified jackets), and as an 'early adopter' I have to say that I read this book avidly from the moment it thudded on my hall floor.

In response to the many comments made so far, I have to say that in my experience as an author I know how hard it is to produce the perfect article, and how easy it is for others to stand back and snipe.

I personally would not hesitate to recommend this book, and for me, with this niche market, the price is justified (but then I am used to high-priced academic tomes in my 'day job').

Well done John, and well done MLRS!

Peter

(PS - In the light of this I will definitely be running for the hermit's cave when the book on Great War cap badges, penned and illustrated by me and Chris Foster, comes out in July...)