Chinese Bde in Palestine

[ddycher]

All

Have been reading some communication between Wingate and Allenby in September 1917 on the subject of a potential Chinese Bde. Initially it was proposed that they would go to Europe but because of shipping issues it was suggested to re-direct them for deployment in Palestine. Wingate believed the bde would not be welcomed in Egypt but saw no such issues with deploying these troops in Palestine. Allenby seems to have immeddiately pushed back on this offer citing that the appearances of Chinese troops in the theatre would give the Turks the impression that british resources were stretched too thin.

I'm not sure as yet just how close this came to happening - anybody know anything more about this or where, if ever, these troops were eventually despatched to?

Regards

Dave

[centurion]

Allenby also refused the offer of Brazilian troops on the grounds of language problems. I suspect he simply didn't want to accept men that he thought might be insufficiently trained/motivated (with all the problems that would bring) just to allow someone's political gesture

[michaeldr]

I suspect he simply didn't want to accept men that he thought might be insufficiently trained/motivated (with all the problems that would bring) just to allow someone's political gesture

Cent,

This may be true, but only to a certain and limited extent,

and he certainly did not exclude help from the Orient

After Allenby lost a lot of British regiments to the WF following the German's spring offensive

he wrote to the CIGS on June 8th, 1918

"Odds and sods like Jewish Battalions and regiments of Hottentots are useful in a way; but they won't win wars. Americans and lame French Territorials do not make an army; and are merely an encumbrance, if immobilized by lack of transport. Give me some fighting Japanese Divisions, and I'll give you a lot of help"

regards

Michael

[ddycher]

As a side topic, and given that I live in China, this one continues to intrigue me. I have not been able to track down any combat troops in any theatre outside of China itself.

I am still trying to find out if there were any further discussions between the Sirdar and Allenby and where the original suggestion came from.

Any further thoughts ?

Regards

Dave

[michaeldr]

Dave,

you may wish to have a look at 'Chinese Diplomacy 1914-1918' by By Madeleine Chi [available in preview form on Google]

Page 129 briefly describes the Labour which China provided and also mentions that in Jan 1918, the Supreme War Council approved the question of Chinese troops in Europe. What if anything became of this I cannot say but it may be worth checking the full text

regards

Michael

[Staffsyeoman]

There's also "China and the Great War: China's Pursuit of a New National Identity and Internationalization" by Xu Guogi (Cambridge UP 2005) hard to find and expensive but impressive and "Forgotten Regiments" by Barry Renfrew (Terrier Press, 2009) which deal with the Chinese troops issue (Renfrew's is a chapter on the CLC but covers the broader issue of Chinese troops). There was a conference in China in 2008, and if I have it right there's one in France in May. An issue that is coming up the agenda, not least down to 'emergent China'.

[ddycher]

Michael / staffs

Thanks for the replies. I did take a look at "Chinese Diplomacy" - interesting. Have not as yet been able to find a copy of China and the Great War but will keep looking.

Thanks again.

Dave

[PeterH]

A Chinese Regiment deployed to Vladivostok in 1918.

Refer here: http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php...01&t=100582

[ddycher]

Interesting - thanks Peter.

Regards

Dave