207 General Hospital RAMC(v)

[housecarl]

Could any body tell me if and where 207 General Hospital RAMC(v) served?

Regards,

Carl.

[Sue Light]

Carl

It's too high a number for a General Hospital either WW1 or WW2

Sue

[chrisharley9]

This Thread should answer your question

Chris

[housecarl]

Carl

It's too high a number for a General Hospital either WW1 or WW2

Sue

Sue, I was in 207 prior to joining the regs, but I have forgotten when it became designated 207, now it's split into support squadrons. Options for change did what it said in the tin.

Thanks,

Carl.

[housecarl]

This Thread should answer your question

Chris

Chris there was no thread. Unless I'm been an IT biff.

Cheers,

Carl.

[Sue Light]

Carl

It's probably because have less than ten posts - lost of forum features don't activate until then. It's a very long thread about No.2 Western General Hospital, Manchester, but this is the bit of interest. The writer does make some rather broad assumptions about the hospitals evolving in a continuous pattern, which doesn't seem to be the case. From what's written it seems that 207 was formed anew sometime in the sixties?

Sue

BRIEF HISTORY OF 207 (MANCHESTER) FIELD HOSPITAL (VOLUNTEERS)

A Short History of the Volunteer Medical Service in Manchester and it’s Personnel

On 23rd June 1898 Queen Victoria signed the royal warrant signifying her pleasure that a ‘Corps was formed styled the Royal Army Medical Corps’ and on the 1st July 1898 the Royal Army Medical Corps (RAMC) came into existence. More than ten prior to this a young London Graduate, Dr William Coates, arrived in Manchester to set up a practise in Moss Side. He was to spend the next 78 years, until his death at the age of 102 in 1962, working and living in the Moss Side area. The place of his death, now a block of flats, being named after him (Coates court, Moss Side). The importance of his work in the provision of medical care to the men and women of the armed forces in the North West has, over the years, has been greatly forgotten. Without his hard work and dedication it is unlikely the ex-servicemen of today would have the care and attention they presently receive at Broughton House, the last remaining of three homes set-up during the First World War for the care of disabled ex-servicemen.

On his arrival in Manchester William Coates met Dr H.B. Crockwell, at that time second Surgeon in the 16th Lancashire Rifle Volunteers (later the 7th Battalion the Manchester Regiment (TA)) who persuaded him to join the Volunteers.

Coates became commissioned in the 20th Lancashire Rifle Volunteers (later the 8th (Ardwick) Battalion the Manchester Regiment (TA)).

Surgeon Major Evatt (originator of the Volunteer Medical Staff Corps) and Colonel Cantlie (commanding the London Volunteer Medical Staff Corps) communicated with the Dean of Owens College with a view to establishing a Company in Manchester.

Major Evatt addressed a meeting of students and Volunteer Medical Association was formed in December 1885, composed of various professors and lecturers at Owens College and certain influential Manchester gentlemen.

Surgeon Captains Corckwell, Darwin and Coates transferred from the Volunteers Infantry Units and Mr H. Crossley Rayner, a barrister, became the Quartermaster.

After inspection by the Manchester Brigade Commander, the Unit was taken over by the War Office on 1st April 1887, (strength 101) as the 4th Division, Volunteer Medical Staff Corps.

In 1897 William Coates was gazetted to Command, which on take-over had strength of 9 officers, 157 rank and file.

In 1898 the Volunteer Medical Staff Corps became A Corps Royal Army Medical Corps (RAMC) and the prefix Surgeon was dropped from the Officers’ commissions.

A new Headquarters was opened on January 18th 1905 by General Sir Henry MacKinnon, Director General of the Auxiliary Forces, and was designed for a complement of 1000.

By 1908 the RAMC in the East Lancashire Division had been organised into:

1st (East Lancashire) Field Ambulance

2nd (East Lancashire) Field Ambulance

3rd (East Lancashire) Field Ambulance

General Hospital (Second Western)

In 1914 the 2nd Western General Hospital had a strength of 3 officers and 43 rank and file. In addition it had 20 ‘a la suite’ specialists who were mobilised.

Taking over buildings, it provided a 500 bed hospital and was ready to admit patients from 16th August 1914.

On 20th September 1914 the first ambulance train arrived and the hospital was treating casualties until long after the end of the war. The nursing staff was organised by the Principal Matron of the Manchester Royal Infirmary (MRI). Local hospitals in the East Lancashire area, from Bury to Chester, gave over beds for use by the military. Over half the beds of the MRI were filled by casualties from the war and St. Mary’s nearly closed to the civilian population due to the demands of the military. By 1918 over 25,000 beds came under the command of the 2nd Western General Hospital and more than 500,000 casualties had been treated.

Following the war the Territorial Force was put into suspended animation. It was, however, reorganised in 1920 and the Manchester Hospital became the 2nd Western General Hospital Territorial Army (TA).

In 1927 the Hospital became the 12th (2nd Western) General Hospital TA.

In 1938 the 5th (Western) General Hospital was also established.

The 12th (2nd Western) General Hospital TA mobilised at Ormskirk and eventually went to Egypt and became 61st General Hospital.

The 5th (Western) General Hospital TA went to Davyhulme and in 1940 became Military Hospital Davyhulme and it is this Unit which is really the predecessor of the 7th (Manchester) General Hospital.

Colonel Sir William Coates came to see the Units move off to war (then aged 79) and was there to welcome them back at the end.

In 1947 the Territorial Army was reformed. In 1953 the hospital was honoured by the City of Manchester and became the 7th (Manchester) General Hospital (TA).

In Manchester the Field Ambulances and the Divisional Medical Headquarters were disbanded leaving only the Hospital.

Now designated 207 (Manchester) General Hospital RAMC (Volunteers) it remained in this drill hall as designed and build for the RAMC and is therefore one of the oldest Units in the Corps. The officer’s mess, which is argued to be the oldest in the RAMC, bears the name of William Coates who did so much in the early part of the 20th century for the provision of medical care to military personnel.

In 1967 a detachment was formed in Blackburn, a second was formed in Macclesfield in 1977 and a third in Lancaster in 1981. During the ‘options for change’ reorganisation in the mid 1990s the Macclesfield and Lancaster detachments closed and the Hospital gained a new detachment in Ashton-under-Lyne (a former detachment of the Fusiliers (Volunteers)). The hospital reduced in size and dropped the RAMC from its title to become 207 (Manchester) Field Hospital (Volunteers).

The hospital still plays its part within the role of the Army Medical Services. With personnel serving in the Gulf War, Northern Ireland, the former Republic Yugoslavia (one member receiving the Queen’s Commendation Medal). At present members of the hospital are serving in Bosnia and Cyprus with one member serving some where in the world but we are never quit sure where until we get a post card!

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[housecarl]

Carl

It's probably because have less than ten posts - lost of forum features don't activate until then. It's a very long thread about No.2 Western General Hospital, Manchester, but this is the bit of interest. The writer does make some rather broad assumptions about the hospitals evolving in a continuous pattern, which doesn't seem to be the case. From what's written it seems that 207 was formed anew sometime in the sixties?

Sue

BRIEF HISTORY OF 207 (MANCHESTER) FIELD HOSPITAL (VOLUNTEERS)

A Short History of the Volunteer Medical Service in Manchester and it's Personnel

On 23rd June 1898 Queen Victoria signed the royal warrant signifying her pleasure that a 'Corps was formed styled the Royal Army Medical Corps' and on the 1st July 1898 the Royal Army Medical Corps (RAMC) came into existence. More than ten prior to this a young London Graduate, Dr William Coates, arrived in Manchester to set up a practise in Moss Side. He was to spend the next 78 years, until his death at the age of 102 in 1962, working and living in the Moss Side area. The place of his death, now a block of flats, being named after him (Coates court, Moss Side). The importance of his work in the provision of medical care to the men and women of the armed forces in the North West has, over the years, has been greatly forgotten. Without his hard work and dedication it is unlikely the ex-servicemen of today would have the care and attention they presently receive at Broughton House, the last remaining of three homes set-up during the First World War for the care of disabled ex-servicemen.

On his arrival in Manchester William Coates met Dr H.B. Crockwell, at that time second Surgeon in the 16th Lancashire Rifle Volunteers (later the 7th Battalion the Manchester Regiment (TA)) who persuaded him to join the Volunteers.

Coates became commissioned in the 20th Lancashire Rifle Volunteers (later the 8th (Ardwick) Battalion the Manchester Regiment (TA)).

Surgeon Major Evatt (originator of the Volunteer Medical Staff Corps) and Colonel Cantlie (commanding the London Volunteer Medical Staff Corps) communicated with the Dean of Owens College with a view to establishing a Company in Manchester.

Major Evatt addressed a meeting of students and Volunteer Medical Association was formed in December 1885, composed of various professors and lecturers at Owens College and certain influential Manchester gentlemen.

Surgeon Captains Corckwell, Darwin and Coates transferred from the Volunteers Infantry Units and Mr H. Crossley Rayner, a barrister, became the Quartermaster.

After inspection by the Manchester Brigade Commander, the Unit was taken over by the War Office on 1st April 1887, (strength 101) as the 4th Division, Volunteer Medical Staff Corps.

In 1897 William Coates was gazetted to Command, which on take-over had strength of 9 officers, 157 rank and file.

In 1898 the Volunteer Medical Staff Corps became A Corps Royal Army Medical Corps (RAMC) and the prefix Surgeon was dropped from the Officers' commissions.

A new Headquarters was opened on January 18th 1905 by General Sir Henry MacKinnon, Director General of the Auxiliary Forces, and was designed for a complement of 1000.

By 1908 the RAMC in the East Lancashire Division had been organised into:

1st (East Lancashire) Field Ambulance

2nd (East Lancashire) Field Ambulance

3rd (East Lancashire) Field Ambulance

General Hospital (Second Western)

In 1914 the 2nd Western General Hospital had a strength of 3 officers and 43 rank and file. In addition it had 20 'a la suite' specialists who were mobilised.

Taking over buildings, it provided a 500 bed hospital and was ready to admit patients from 16th August 1914.

On 20th September 1914 the first ambulance train arrived and the hospital was treating casualties until long after the end of the war. The nursing staff was organised by the Principal Matron of the Manchester Royal Infirmary (MRI). Local hospitals in the East Lancashire area, from Bury to Chester, gave over beds for use by the military. Over half the beds of the MRI were filled by casualties from the war and St. Mary's nearly closed to the civilian population due to the demands of the military. By 1918 over 25,000 beds came under the command of the 2nd Western General Hospital and more than 500,000 casualties had been treated.

Following the war the Territorial Force was put into suspended animation. It was, however, reorganised in 1920 and the Manchester Hospital became the 2nd Western General Hospital Territorial Army (TA).

In 1927 the Hospital became the 12th (2nd Western) General Hospital TA.

In 1938 the 5th (Western) General Hospital was also established.

The 12th (2nd Western) General Hospital TA mobilised at Ormskirk and eventually went to Egypt and became 61st General Hospital.

The 5th (Western) General Hospital TA went to Davyhulme and in 1940 became Military Hospital Davyhulme and it is this Unit which is really the predecessor of the 7th (Manchester) General Hospital.

Colonel Sir William Coates came to see the Units move off to war (then aged 79) and was there to welcome them back at the end.

In 1947 the Territorial Army was reformed. In 1953 the hospital was honoured by the City of Manchester and became the 7th (Manchester) General Hospital (TA).

In Manchester the Field Ambulances and the Divisional Medical Headquarters were disbanded leaving only the Hospital.

Now designated 207 (Manchester) General Hospital RAMC (Volunteers) it remained in this drill hall as designed and build for the RAMC and is therefore one of the oldest Units in the Corps. The officer's mess, which is argued to be the oldest in the RAMC, bears the name of William Coates who did so much in the early part of the 20th century for the provision of medical care to military personnel.

In 1967 a detachment was formed in Blackburn, a second was formed in Macclesfield in 1977 and a third in Lancaster in 1981. During the 'options for change' reorganisation in the mid 1990s the Macclesfield and Lancaster detachments closed and the Hospital gained a new detachment in Ashton-under-Lyne (a former detachment of the Fusiliers (Volunteers)). The hospital reduced in size and dropped the RAMC from its title to become 207 (Manchester) Field Hospital (Volunteers).

The hospital still plays its part within the role of the Army Medical Services. With personnel serving in the Gulf War, Northern Ireland, the former Republic Yugoslavia (one member receiving the Queen's Commendation Medal). At present members of the hospital are serving in Bosnia and Cyprus with one member serving some where in the world but we are never quit sure where until we get a post card!

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Sue, you are a diamond. I'm painting a stretcher bearer figure. I was wanting to depict him as a member of 207, or it's predecessor unit.

I was in the Macclesfield detachment, options for change put pay to that as you said, they demolished a £1.000.000 drill hall that wasn't even 5 years old. Noel Chavasses's(VC and bar) desk is now in the mess at Stretford.

Thanks again,

Carl.

[loldham]

Sue, you are a diamond. I'm painting a stretcher bearer figure. I was wanting to depict him as a member of 207, or it's predecessor unit.

I was in the Macclesfield detachment, options for change put pay to that as you said, they demolished a £1.000.000 drill hall that wasn't even 5 years old. Noel Chavasses's(VC and bar) desk is now in the mess at Stretford.

Thanks again,

Carl.

Hi Sue, Carl,

The piece written about the Manchester Medical Units is a short piece aimed at giving an over view of 207s History. The building they still occupy was built in 1905. During Haldane's reform when the volunteer medical companies were replaced by Field Ambulances a General Hospital was also created. There has therefore been a TA Hospital based in Manchester since that time (apart from the post war years when the TA was disbanded). 207 Field Hospital regards 2^nd Western General and subsequent Hospitals as it lineage. The hospital gained the designation 207 in about 1967 during a period of reorganisation of the TA.

Members of 207 have served in the First Gulf War, Balkans, Northern Ireland and 207 took the lead role on Op Telic 4 (Iraq) as part of UK medical Group in 2004.

Just to clarify 207 is still a Field Hospital, the squadrons are not support squadrons but a geographical location (know in the past as detachment). And as far as I am aware Noel Chavasse's Desk is not at Stretford but his dinning table is at Bury squadron.

Regards

Lesley

[Guest one1]

I found the reference to the history of 207 man gen hosp interesting , (being a former member of it)

I know that "park hospital davyhulme" (not sure what its called now) was a forerunner of 207

This was built (for the yanks) as the 7th western general, and after the war, was amalgamated (I think with the 2nd western) to form 207 general hospital

I was a member of HQ based at the stretford drill hall for a good many years i was saddened to hear that it had lost its lancaster and maccelsfield detachments however no mention was made about its blackburn detachment?

[jonrb]

The unit still has squadrons located at Blackburn, Bury, Stockport and Ashton-u-Line with its HQ still in Stretford.