John D Posted 25 March , 2004 Share Posted 25 March , 2004 I am looking to find out some info on HMS Moth, and more specifically on the actions early in 1917. I have only uncovered the London Gazette report of 21 September 1917. If someone could point me in the direction where more info could be found, I would be very grateful. Many Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcolm Posted 25 March , 2004 Share Posted 25 March , 2004 John, HMS Moth was an Insect Class River Gunboat launched in 1915 in Sunderland, of 845 tons , 273 X 36 X 4 feet , Turbine was 20,000 ihp giving 14 knots using twin screws in tunnels ( grounding protection). Armed with 2 X 6 inch and 2 X 12 pounder. She was flat bottomed so dreadful at sea. Her No was P.7A in 1916 and P.8A in 1918. These ' China Gunboats' were ordered in February 1915 In Mesopotamia were Moth, Gnat, Mantis and Tarantula operating on the Tigris and Euphrates delta near Basra. HMS Moth was scuttled 21st December 1941 in Hong Kong, refloated and repaired by the Japanese she became the Suma until she was mined on 19th March 1945. Aye Malcolm I have a picture of Mantis if you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmsk212 Posted 26 March , 2004 Share Posted 26 March , 2004 Hi John There was a book published by New English Library in paperback in 1976 called " Armed with Stings" by A. Cecil Hampshire. This book deals with the history of the Insect Class Gunboats and it is worth trawling the secondhand bookstores for a copy. It states about 26th February 1917 :- " The Moth , last to round the turn, was greeted by a storm of shellfire and suffered the most damage of all. Five 5.9 inch Turkish shells scored direct hits on the little gunboat. One went through the casing of the port boiler and the boiler itself; another smashed through the bunker on the port side into the stokehold; two struck glancing blows on the port side of the boiler casing, and the fifth slammed into the starboard side of the after storeroom just above the waterline. Lieutenant Commander Cartwright, her captain, who, Nunn afterwards reported, handled his ship magnificently, was himself a casualty. Two of his three officers were also badly wounded, while two ratings were killed and eighteen wounded. Like the rest of the flotilla the Moth's funnels and superstructure were sieved by bullets and gashed by shell splinters. Yet, despite the terrible hammering she had received which sent her limping down to Abadan for repairs, the gallant little Moth was back in action again within four and a half days. Like her sisters she had an astonishingly long life ahead of her" Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooter Posted 26 March , 2004 Share Posted 26 March , 2004 Greetings John! Bryan Perrett's "Gunboat!" contains much the same details as Malcolm and Steve have already provided. It is still in print (Cassell) and contains a photo of Mantis and another of an "unnamed" insect - so possibly Moth. cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John D Posted 26 March , 2004 Author Share Posted 26 March , 2004 Many Thanks to Malcolm, Steve & Chris Very useful information - and I did not realise the HMS Moth scuttled in WW2 was the old one from WW1 !. I think I will have to start a hunt for the two books (with the photo of HMS Mantis to save Malcolm the trouble) Thanks again John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glosters Posted 26 March , 2004 Share Posted 26 March , 2004 Ref. 'Official History of the Mesopotamia Campaign. Vol. III' 24th Feb. 1917: Capt. Nunn, the Senior Naval Officer, proposed to General Maude that his gunboat flotilla (Mantis, Tarantula, Moth, Butterfly, Gadfly and Snakefly) should move up the Tigris. This was agreed to and the gunboats proceeded upstream, encountering some floating mines which they easily avoided, and anchored off Kut about 9.30 pm. 25th Feb.: The naval flotilla (S.N.O.) Mantis, Moth, Gadfly and Butterfly, having passed through the Shumran Bridge about 8 am, had also arrived and were co-operating with their guns in the 38th Brigade attack. 26th Feb: Capt. Nunn at once proceeded upstream at full speed, Tarantula (S.N.O.), leading, then Mantis and Moth, with Gadfly and Butterfly following. Just after passing Bughaila, with white flags flying over it, at 2 pm, the gunboats began to overtake numbers of enemy stragglers on the left bank, and these, holding up their hands as a sign of surrender, were sent back to be taken by the troops.... as his ship approached the Nahr al Kalek bend, Capt. Nunn observed a large body of enemy on which he ordered all guns to fire. This was the enemy rearguard entrenched at the apex of the complete hairpin turn which the river makes here, the ships would be under gun, machine gun and rifle fire.... Capt. Nunn did not hesitate but steamed on... the Moth which was last in line suffered most severely. Finally handled by her commander Lt-Com. C.H.A. Cartwright, she was hit 8 times by shell which pierced one of her boilers and holed her below the water line, while 4 our of her 5 officers and half her remaining complement were killed or wounded. But she managed to keep going. 27th: The Moth and Firefly were sent to Basra for repairs. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John D Posted 28 March , 2004 Author Share Posted 28 March , 2004 Hi Steve Thanks for the additional information. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmsk212 Posted 29 March , 2004 Share Posted 29 March , 2004 John A picture from "Warships of World War 1" by H. M. Le Fleming, published by Ian Allan. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kinnethmont Posted 7 April , 2004 Share Posted 7 April , 2004 Does anyone have a picture or details of HMS Grasshopper, another insect class river gunboat, lost off Rusuk Island, Sumatra on 14 Feb 1942 ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve11 Posted 11 April , 2004 Share Posted 11 April , 2004 There were twelve 'Insect' River Class Gunboats ordered in 1915 and none of these were named Grasshopper. The Grasshopper you refer to was a gunboat launched in 1939. It and several sister ships were named after insects and may in fact have been known as the Locust Class. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmsk212 Posted 17 April , 2004 Share Posted 17 April , 2004 Does anyone have a picture or details of HMS Grasshopper, another insect class river gunboat, lost off Rusuk Island, Sumatra on 14 Feb 1942 ? Hi Jas From HM Ships Lost/Damaged by Enemy Action Public Records Office - ADM 234/ 444 Page 405 GRASSHOPPER - River Gunboat 14th Feb 1942 Nature of attack - Two Direct Hit Bombs Time out of action - Beached on territory in enemy occupation Brief account of damage and lessons learned - GRASSHOPPER was en route from Singapore during the evacuation when she sustained two direct bomb hits aft. The ship was beached and abandoned North of Singkep, the after magazine blew up, and a serious fire started. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kinnethmont Posted 17 April , 2004 Share Posted 17 April , 2004 Steve Thanks for taking the trouble to check this out for me. The details are appreciated. I was aware that the ship was bombed by Japanse aircraft but had understood she had sunk within ten minutes of being hit rather than being beached. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmsk212 Posted 17 April , 2004 Share Posted 17 April , 2004 Steve Thanks for taking the trouble to check this out for me. The details are appreciated. I was aware that the ship was bombed by Japanse aircraft but had understood she had sunk within ten minutes of being hit rather than being beached. Hi Jas You are probably referring to HMS DRAGONFLY DRAGONFLY River Gunboat 14th Feb 1942 Nature of attack - Three direct hit bombs Time out of action - Sunk Brief account of damage and lessons learned - DRAGONFLY, during the Singapore evacuation, whilst near Blakan Outan, was hit three times and, after about 10 minutes, capsized and sank by the stern. No further information available. SCORPION, another River Gunboat, was sunk the day before. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest David P Posted 5 December , 2013 Share Posted 5 December , 2013 My grandfather, Walter Masterman Carter, an ex merchant navy captain was a reservist RNR, posted to the Moth. The first document dated 9.8.1916 states he will be a temporary Sub-Lieutenant, RNR as Navigating Officer. A later letter dated 12.9.16 gives him an appointment on HMS Moth as Acting Lieutenant, RNR. I have his Binoculars he used on board. As far as I recall from what my grandmother told me, he was involved in military action on the moth and was either injured or the ship damaged, as were the binoculars, which according to my grandmother, were all he had when he later left the ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James A Pratt III Posted 6 December , 2013 Share Posted 6 December , 2013 On the IJN site nihonkaigun.net It has the TROM of the Suma/Moth and quite a bit on the ships history. The moth went to North Russia after WW I before she went to China. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barkalotloudly Posted 6 December , 2013 Share Posted 6 December , 2013 the book you really to get a copy of is "Tigris Gunboats" by Nunn ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadsac Posted 6 December , 2013 Share Posted 6 December , 2013 John D. Here is the award to Lt.Cdr Cartwright ; CARTWRIGHT Charles H.A N/E Lt.Cdr. RN 81L049 Moth C in C East Indies 21.09.17 Gazette In Mesopotamia Operations of H.M. Gunboats Dec. 1916 to March 1917 M in D & promoted to Cdr. with effect from 26.02.17 Handled "Moth" magnificently on the 26th February, 1917, when rounding a bend of the Tigris under heavy fire at short range, and for his gallant conduct on all occasions. Sadsac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
centurion Posted 6 December , 2013 Share Posted 6 December , 2013 The Insect class were originally another of Winston's Wheezes and the designation Chinese was a security scheme as they were originally intended to be transported overland in pieces and used to blockade the Danube. Some did even get there - after WW1 but they served on the Tigris, in Russia, on the Yangtze as well in both world wars. Often modified and renamed during their service - see http://archive.is/wxY5b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9.5mm Posted 6 December , 2013 Share Posted 6 December , 2013 Film of (purportedly) HMS Moth, circa 1918: http://film.iwmcollections.org.uk/record/index/45044 http://film.iwmcollections.org.uk/record/index/45003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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