Loss of HMS Natal

[robwilliams]

I wonder if anyone can help, I am aware of the bare bones of the loss of the above ship at Cromarty. The ship blew up whilst at anchor in Cromarty Firth, probably through faulty cordite, 404 men died.

Does anyone have any more info, or know where there might be any more?

Would there be a file on it at the PRO, with a casualty list?

I am interested as I am researching an ERA2, Donald Weir. He was posted to this ship at the time and I am wondering if he was wounded.

Thanks in advance,

Rob

[Terry_Reeves]

Rob, from "Dictionary of Disasters at Sea" by Charles Hocking:

"The armoured cruiser Natal, Capt EPC Black, was a unit of the 2nd Cruiser Squadron. The ship had an official complement of 704 officers and men.

On December 30th, 1915, she was lying in Cromarty harbour when fire broke out on board. Within a short time the ship was torn assunder by the explosion of her after magazines and sank almost immediately. The loss of life was heavy, amounting to 25 officers, including Capt Black, and 380 ratings".

You may wish to check the Navy List for the period which oddly enough sometimes listed casualties as well.

Terry Reeves

[Jonathan Saunders]

A. Cecil Hampshire wrote a book about the Natal's loss but infortuantely I cant remember what it was called. You might find a copy through yr library's database of books held in the county by a search on the author's surname.

[Bob Coulson]

Just a little more,

The ship capsized and sank within five minutes.

Many of the sailors are buried in the churchyard at Cromartys Gaelic Chapel.

[Michael]

Jon

These are the PRO references for the Natal. Those from ADM 53 will be the ships logs. Plenty of stuff to get your teeth into. From previous experience, the casualty list will give NOK and details of any allotments, etc

ADM 1/8445/9 Loss of HMS NATAL - Court Martial 1916

ADM 137/3608 Loss of HMS NATAL 1915 Dec 30-1916 Feb 29

ADM 178/105 Salvage of HMS Natal 1915-1916

ADM 178/122 Loss of HMS Natal: casualties 1916

ADM 178/123 Loss of HMS Natal: Court Martial 1915-1916

ADM 156/162 Loss of ship. Proceedings of Court Martial on survivors of HMS NATAL 1916

ADM 53/52320 NATAL 1913 September 9 - 1914 August 31

ADM 53/52321 NATAL 1914 September 1 - 1915 February 28

ADM 53/52322 NATAL 1915 March 1 - 1915 March 31

ADM 53/52323 NATAL 1915 April 1 - 1915 April 30

ADM 53/52324 NATAL 1915 May 1 - 1915 May 31

ADM 53/52325 NATAL 1915 June 1 - 1915 June 30

ADM 53/52326 NATAL 1915 July 1 - 1915 July 31

ADM 53/52327 NATAL 1915 August 1 - 1915 August 31

ADM 53/52328 NATAL 1915 September 1 - 1915 September 30

ADM 53/52329 NATAL 1915 October 1 - 1915 October 31

ADM 53/52330 NATAL 1915 November 1 - 1915 November 30

Michael

[Alan Seymour]

Rob,

A. Cecil Hampshire's book is 'They Called It Accident' pub.1961

Three ships blew up during the Great War whilst in home waters, all unexplained, the book deals with all three

The first was HMS Bulwark, on 26 Nov 1914, whilst lying at Sheerness, most of her crew being killed.

The second was HMS Natal, on Dec 30th 1915, whilst lying in Cromarty Firth with her squadron, over 400 officers and men and a number of women and children perished with her.

The third was HMS Vanguard, on 9 Jul 1917, whilst at anchor in Scapa Flow; again there were very few survivors.

Alan Seymour

[Ralph J. Whitehead]

These events almost sound like the fate of the U.S.S. Maine that blew up and sank in Havana Harbor. The most likely cause of this explosion was improperly stored coal. The coal bunker involved was next to the 5 inch shell magazine and if I recall correctly there was an indication that the bulkhead was warm to the touch in the period just before the explosion. The U.S. Navy had a number of similar incidents in the period before the Maine but without the historical results that followed.

Ralph

[HERITAGE PLUS]

From 'The Sea Chaplains' by Gordon Taylor (1978)

'A week before Christmas the Natal proceded to the Cromarty Firth and anchored in a depth of 8 fathoms between Cromarty village and Invergordon. On the afternoon of 30 December, not long after several lady guests, including QARNNS sisters, a male civilian and some children, had arrived on board to see a film show, a terrific explosion occurred, followed by several lesser internal explosions, and a severe fire bean to rage below. The Natal slowly heeled over to port and lay on her beam-ends while some members of her company escaped into the water, and then she completely capsized. The cpalain Algernon Sidney Osborne Sweet was among the 390 who died.

The lossof the Natal was a tragedy, which caused the greatest sorrow and she still lies in Cromarty Firth a hazard to navigation marked on by a buoy.'

[Jonathan Saunders]

If interested - see this site on the loss of the VANGUARD ... some excellent photos, list of survivors, fatalities, personal accounts and Court of Enquiry ...

http://www.gwpda.org/naval/n0000000.htm

[Guest Stoner]

There was also a fourth Ship that blew up in British waters. HMS Princess Irene was a Steamship under construction, requisitioned by the Royal Navy at the outbreak of War and converted into a Minelayer. At 11.15 on the morning of Thursday 27th of May 1915 a catastrophic explosion ripped the Princess Irene apart at her bouy at Sheerness. She was in the process of priming her cargo of approxiamatley 500 mines. The explosion was so ferocious that parts of the ship and crew were thrown for miles around. All of the ships 225 crew bar 3 were onboard plus about 80 Petty Officers & 76 Dockhands from Sheerness who were carrying out last minute repairs before she set sail on the 29th. The wreck is an official War Grave and still poses navigational problems to this day.

[Jonathan Saunders]

There was a fifth a final British warship, a monitor, HMS Glatton that also blew up from an internal or from a undetermined source during WW1. This time off Dover in September 1915.

The Bulwark is believed to have hit a mine and the Princess Irene was through a faulty primer on one of the 500 mines that had just been loaded on her. For an account of the loss of the Princess Irene see the web address I gave above.

[robwilliams]

All,

First chance to day to have a look at the response. Thank you all very much, this will be most useful. Special thanks to Michael for all of the PRO references, that will save me a lot of time.

Proves how very useful this list is!

Rob

[Dolphin]

Heritage Plus's response mentions 'a male civilian' who was killed in the HMS Natal diaster. I think this is probably a reference to the former Scotland Rugby International John Dods [8 caps], who was a civilian contractor working for the Royal Navy when he was killed on board the ship.

Another small piece in the pattern.

Dolphin

[robwilliams]

All,

I have a copy of the casualty roll from Jutland. In it there are quite a few civilians. Unlucky enough to be on board working and, the job not having been finished, the ship set sail with them still on board, still working. In addition there were civilian canteen managers.

Rob

[Jonathan Saunders]

The list of Vanguard fatalties also included civilians - laundrymen and canteen workers as I recall.

Also it was not unusual for dockyard workers to be carrying out running repairs on ships in/near to port. The huge number of fatalties for the Princess Irene was swelled by about 70 CPO's and PO's from Chatham being on her under instruction at that time plus some dockyard workers.

Similarly two dockyard workers had just left the Vanguard hours before she exploded - I cant recall whether it was both or just one of them had also been aboard the Bulwark before she had exploded in 1914 and this gave rise to a sabotage theory that still exists amongst the families of descendants today. These two men were subsequently under surveillance for some time after before, the authorities dismissed the sabotage theory.