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chrisharley9

Mrs Gartside Tipping

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chrisharley9

GARTSIDE14031917.png

GARTSIDE12031917.png

This lady definitely died due to war causes but is the organisation one of those accepted by CWGC

Nice to see her commemorated with her husband

Name: GARTSIDE-TIPPING, HENRY THOMAS

Initials: H T

Nationality: United Kingdom

Rank: Lieut-Commander

Regiment/Service: Royal Navy

Unit Text: H.M. Yacht "Sanda".

Age: 67

Date of Death: 25/09/1915

Additional information: Son of Gartside Gartside-Tipping, of Rossferry, Belturbet, Co. Fermanagh; husband of Mary Stuart Gartside-Tipping, of ''Quarr Wood'', Binstead, Isle of Wight.

Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead

Memorial: NIEUPORT MEMORIAL

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Terry Denham

Chris

It does not appear on the list.

However, that may be due to there being no other candidates who qualify. Was the organisation 'attached to a Commonwealth military force'? That is the question to be asked as she qualifies in other respects.

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Stephen White

Chris

Her name appears on one of the panels of the main Southport War Memorial, I took a photograph of it a few years back for Jim Strawbridge, I believe he has some information on her.

Stephen

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chrisharley9

Stephen

I have already e mailed the cuttings over to Jim

Chris

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Stephen White

Chris

Ok, I'm positive Jim will find the information useful. When I took the photograph for him, it wasn't her name he was after and seeing her name on the panel was a total surprise.

The panel lists her as serving with Womens's EM. Canteen.

Stephen

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chrisharley9

Stephen

thanks for that

Chris

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Carmania

Chris

She was a lady worker with the Women's Emergency Canteens for Soldiers which was run under the auspices of the London Committee of the French Red Cross.

Aled

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Moonraker

Hi Chris. In you related thread you assured me that your interest was in the Women's Emergency Committee, not the Women's Emergency Corps, but I'm puzzled that you've included the former title in your header for this thread, whereas the cutting does not refer to "Committee" but to "Corps". I'm sure that there's a simple explanation for a simple soul such as myself!

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chrisharley9

Moonraker

the simple explantion is that Im a muppet who has got committee into his tiny brain & could not get it out - sorry for the confusion- will amend the title

Chris

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chrisharley9

Aled

do you have any documentary proof to that statement please - it will help me put her forward

Terry

the statement above re French Red Cross I believe sheds an entirely different light on this case

Chris

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Terry Denham

British civilians working with the French Red Cross do qualify under the extra crieria for such organisations but we still need the usual evidence.

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Carmania

Chris

Send me a PM with your email address and I'll be happy to send you a copy of my source.

Aled

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chrisharley9

Thanks to Aled it has been proved beyond a doubt as to her status - now to get the DC & try to find a grave

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chrisharley9

Terry

just a thought - is she a non world war grave in the care of the CWGC

secondly if she was buried in a French Military Cemetery how do I check their records

Chris

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Carmania

Chris

Don't know if you had seen this but there is an earlier thread here which gives details of her burial.

Aled

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chrisharley9

Aled

no I hadnt so thanks very much - Vauxbuin French National Cemetery. Plot III.B.5

Chris

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Terry Denham

The grave is a Non-World War Grave in CWGC Care.

There is also a note that she was originally buried in a vault in Compiegne South Communal Cemetery

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chrisharley9

Terry

what now is needed - we have a grave, we have proof that she is attached to the French Red Cross (will forward that later) - do you still need a DC?

Chris

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Terry Denham

No.

However, that does not mean the case will succeed. It will all depend on the proofs and whether the staus of the organisation is accepted. It seems that the French Red Cross did not report the death as one of theirs.

Still - we'll see what happens.

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chrisharley9

Terry

will forward all of the relevant paperwork to you later - thanks very much to Aled for all of his assistance

Chris

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chrisharley9

This case has been rejected by CWGC as the lady was attached to French Forces not Commonwealth Forces

Chris

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Sue Light

British civilians working with the French Red Cross do qualify under the extra crieria for such organisations but we still need the usual evidence.

Chris (or anyone!)

Is it possible to enlarge on the above. What are these extra criteria? If they revolve around women being 'attached to a Commonwealth Military Force', how many British members of the French Red Cross actually qualify, and how? Where were these women working that they could be 'French' rather than 'British' Red Cross but were attached to the British - I assume that being attached to US troops didn't count? The names of some of the French Red Cross workers on CWGC would be helpful to try and work out the anwers (assuming there are some).

Sue

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chrisharley9

Sue

I have asked Terry to comment

Chris

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Terry Denham

Sue

There are additional criteria for all the Recognised Civilian Organisations' personnel if they are to qualify. They vary from organisation to organisation.

They usually involve the qualifying date being 11.11.18 (for WW1) though later deaths due to wounds etc are accepted up to 31.08.21 if sustained before that date. There is always the stipulation that they can qualify "where death occurred whilst serving overseas with or attached to the Commonwealth military forces".

Sadly, this lady was rejected on these grounds as she was serving alongside French forces.

The British personnel with the French Red Cross, as I understand it, qualify because they were serving with British forces.

We tried with this one and rejection came after three years of waiting. Her grave remains classified as a Non-World War Grave in CWGC Care and so she is being looked after to the same standard as any war grave.

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Sue Light

Thanks Terry. I think my query is, in a way, slightly different, and I'm not asking it because I feel any errors have been made in commemorations. My problem comes in trying to discover if any British members of the French Red Cross at all have been commemorated by the CWGC. By reason of their affiliation to the FRC, few would have been serving with British and Commonwealth forces - the majority of the nurses with the FRC were attached to French hospitals and aiding French soldiers, though I realise that there were some who did care for British personnel in French hospitals. However, almost all would have been working outside of the British sector, which makes their basic position rather different.

I get quite a lot of queries about British nurses of the French Red Cross, and there seem to be few answers. Therefore, if it was possible to look at the details of those women of the FRC who are commemorated by CWCG, and then examine their units, or place of death, it might give some clues as to how they qualified, and why others do not. People seem to search in vain for any records for members of the British Committee of the FRC, which is not surprising as there are apparently none that survive, and trying to piece together information from little details like this might at least leave room to give a definite negative answer, if nothing else.

Sue

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