davidstones Posted 7 October , 2008 Share Posted 7 October , 2008 I am currently researching my family tree, and came across the above relative who was KIA. His regimental number is 805431, and he was in C Bty 231 Bde, he was killed on 10/01/1917 and currently lies in Bienvillers military cemetary. Could any of you old sweats out there please assist in providing any further info on him, CWG state that he was awarded the MM and I would be very interested to possibly find the circumstances. I have yet to download his medal card. Many Thanks Stonesy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamarazotherday Posted 8 October , 2008 Share Posted 8 October , 2008 Doesn't give much away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay dubaya Posted 8 October , 2008 Share Posted 8 October , 2008 Hi Stonesy, SDGW lists Harry Bailey as born Rudyard and enlisted Leek, he was KiA on the 10th January 1917. His TF number puts him with the 1/3rd Staffordshire Bty of the 2nd North Midland Brigade RFA (TF) which was renumbered 231st Bde during May 1916 when the 1/3rd Bty became 'C' Bty. Since both his numbers are present on the MIC it would suggest that Harry was already serving overseas when the TF numbering changes took place during late 1916 and early 1917, all TF units went from a 4 digit to a 6 digit number. No DoE on the MIC would also suggest that he didn't enter France until after December 31st 1916. There is another MIC for a Gnr 1088 H H Bailey available at the NA and ancestry.co.uk. I believe this will be for his MM, perhaps another forum member who pays their subs could pull it up. Jon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rflory Posted 8 October , 2008 Share Posted 8 October , 2008 According to the data I have the only H Bailey that received the MM with the RFA was 780042 Sjt H Bailey, RFA in the London Gazette of 19 November 1917. I could possibly have missed one. Regards, Dick Flory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PPCLI Posted 8 October , 2008 Share Posted 8 October , 2008 No DoE on the MIC would also suggest that he didn't enter France until after December 31st 1916. Should read 1915. The other MIC for a Gnr 1088 H H Bailey is not a MM card (its ref would be WO 372/23, not WO 372/1), it is a separate card for his 1915 Star entitlement. He entered France on 26th February 1915. [attachment removed] You will note that the M.M. denoted after his initials has been scored out. Looks like there has been a bit of a mix up (possibly with the man Dick mentions or it may be a simple case of his initials being confused with MM somewhere). It appears that the amended record has not been passed on to the CWGC. Stuart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay dubaya Posted 8 October , 2008 Share Posted 8 October , 2008 Thanks for pulling that one up Stuart and correcting my year, it does however confirm that he went out with the divisional artillery in February 1915. SDGW also records the MM. Jon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidstones Posted 8 October , 2008 Author Share Posted 8 October , 2008 Doesn't give much away Tam, many thanks for the medal card i really appreciate it, as you can tell i am new to this but am amazed at the willingness of the forum memebers to help, thanks again. Dave Stones Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidstones Posted 8 October , 2008 Author Share Posted 8 October , 2008 Hi Stonesy, SDGW lists Harry Bailey as born Rudyard and enlisted Leek, he was KiA on the 10th January 1917. His TF number puts him with the 1/3rd Staffordshire Bty of the 2nd North Midland Brigade RFA (TF) which was renumbered 231st Bde during May 1916 when the 1/3rd Bty became 'C' Bty. Since both his numbers are present on the MIC it would suggest that Harry was already serving overseas when the TF numbering changes took place during late 1916 and early 1917, all TF units went from a 4 digit to a 6 digit number. No DoE on the MIC would also suggest that he didn't enter France until after December 31st 1916. There is another MIC for a Gnr 1088 H H Bailey available at the NA and ancestry.co.uk. I believe this will be for his MM, perhaps another forum member who pays their subs could pull it up. Jon Jon, i am very grateful for your help in this matter, i am new to the forum so hopefully you will get this reply, If not i will try to get it to you somehow but i am a bit of a technophobe. Can you please tell me what SDGW stands for, and secondly harry bailey had a brother also KIA, I believe that his name was Isaac Bailey. From CWGC there is only one Isaac Bailey that fits, he was in the Royal Welsh Fusiliers Bth Bn, service No 18354. He was killed on 09/04/1919 in Basra. Do you have any access to onfo on him particularly where he enlisted which will hopefully help me to tie him to Harry Bailey Again Thanks Dave Stones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamarazotherday Posted 9 October , 2008 Share Posted 9 October , 2008 Dave, I'm new to all this military stuff too. People here have been so helpful to me, so I just try to give back where I can. Just realised I'm now a Lance-Corporal! We move up the ranks quickly here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay dubaya Posted 9 October , 2008 Share Posted 9 October , 2008 Hi Dave, SDGW (Soldiers that Died in the Great War) a database that was compiled in 1922, available now on CD and is fully searchable. I doubt the Isaac Bailey that you have found is Harry's brother. The most likely Issac Bailey that you are looking for is listed on CWGC as Isaac Baily who was born in Longsden, enlisted and a resident of Leek and was KiA on that date. Unlike his brother Isaac has no known grave and is remembered on the Arras Memorial. Forum member Steve Fuller has done a magnificent job of transcribing the Bedfordshire Rgt War Diaries and has made them avaiable here on his website. Just to echo what Tamara has already said...so many people have helped me so it's nice to give it back when I can, but beware this forum easily becomes addictive... cheers, Jon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidstones Posted 10 October , 2008 Author Share Posted 10 October , 2008 Hi Dave, SDGW (Soldiers that Died in the Great War) a database that was compiled in 1922, available now on CD and is fully searchable. I doubt the Isaac Bailey that you have found is Harry's brother. The most likely Issac Bailey that you are looking for is listed on CWGC as Isaac Baily who was born in Longsden, enlisted and a resident of Leek and was KiA on that date. Unlike his brother Isaac has no known grave and is remembered on the Arras Memorial. Forum member Steve Fuller has done a magnificent job of transcribing the Bedfordshire Rgt War Diaries and has made them avaiable here on his website. Just to echo what Tamara has already said...so many people have helped me so it's nice to give it back when I can, but beware this forum easily becomes addictive... cheers, Jon Jon, the Isaac Baily that you have found for me, I definately Harry's brother, as on CWGC they have the same next of kin. However the correct spelling of the family name is Bailey. Could you please tell me how you found out that he was born in Longsden and also his enlisting details. I do agrre that this reserching game is very addictive and I am suffering from lack of sleep but it is really worth it. Thanks again, Dave Stones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay dubaya Posted 10 October , 2008 Share Posted 10 October , 2008 It's all listed on the SDGW disc Dave, sometimes details are missing, it only lists where born, enlisted, resided, no dates or next of kin etc, Jon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Militia Posted 29 October , 2008 Share Posted 29 October , 2008 I am currently researching my family tree, and came across the above relative who was KIA. His regimental number is 805431, and he was in C Bty 231 Bde, he was killed on 10/01/1917 and currently lies in Bienvillers military cemetary. Could any of you old sweats out there please assist in providing any further info on him, CWG state that he was awarded the MM and I would be very interested to possibly find the circumstances. I have yet to download his medal card. Many Thanks Stonesy. Hi Stonesy, I have the MIC for both Cpl Harry Bailey of Rudyard and his brother Isaac Bailey, who one of your former correspondants was correct in pointing out as KIA 15/04/17 with the 4th Bn. Bedfordshire Regt as Pte 16995, aged 38, Son of Isaac and Harriat Bailey, of Harpers Gate, Rudyard, Leek Staffs. Issac is commemmorated on the Arras Memorial Bay 5. He is recorded in the Leek Post and Times for May 19, 1917. Harry Bailey is recorded in the London Gazette of Friday 27th October, 1916 as 357 Bombr H. Baily, RFA as receiving the MM. The 46th N. Midland War Diary of 10th January 1917 records 357 Cpl H. Bailey and 343 Bomb H. Crabtree 'were both killed at BIENVILLIERS. The enemy were shelling the vicinity ot the church. A shell exploded a bomb store & the two NCO's were killed. No trace of them could afterwards be found.' You would get further details of the old Leek Battery in the book:- "Over There", A Commemorative History of The Old Leek Battery 1908 to 1919' by J.E.Blore and J.R. Sherratt, first published in November 1991, and in both of my own works, but particularly in:- The Staffordshire Regiments: Imperial, Regular & Volunteer, 1705-1919 "Knotted Together', ISBN 1 904546 03 X Best wishes for your research Dave Cooper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rflory Posted 30 October , 2008 Share Posted 30 October , 2008 'Over There': A Commemorative History of The Old Leak Battery 1908 to 1919 gives the following information concerning Cpl. Harry Bailey (Baily): Page 99: 6 December [1916]: "LUCHEUX. Military Medals were awarded to: Sgt, JH Evans, Cpl S. Cartwright, Cpl. F Dunn, Cpl Beamish, Cpl E Stokes, Cpl H Bailey and Cpl. F Dunn." Page 103: 10 January [1917]: "Cpl Bailey and Bdr Crabtree, "C" Battery Signallers, were reported killed whilst repairing telephone lines at Pommier." There is a photo of the 'C' Battery Signal Section on page 97 but unfortunately there are no names given. Regards, Dick Flory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Militia Posted 30 October , 2008 Share Posted 30 October , 2008 Stonesy, I have a cut-out photocopy of the Leek Post newspaper report of Bailey and Crabtree being killed including a photograph of him, and a copy of his COs letter to his wife though they are too long to write here if thats of use? What other details are you trying to obtain? Dave Cooper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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