RobertBr Posted 21 June , 2008 Share Posted 21 June , 2008 I sent the attached photo to a fellow member who replied that he had been told that the RFA did not have buglers. Does anyone know the truth of the matter? I do not know who the bugler is. It's possible that he was in the 56th Division (280 or 281st Brigades) or from West Oxfordshire. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjjobson Posted 21 June , 2008 Share Posted 21 June , 2008 The RFA along with the RHA were known as the Mounted Branch of the Royal Artillery, whilst the RGA were known as the Dismounted Branch, so the short answer is yes the RFA would have had Trumpeters (not buglers) although the Trumpeter would carry both instruments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSMMo Posted 22 June , 2008 Share Posted 22 June , 2008 My grandfather started out as a Trumpeter in the Bute Mountain Battery, RGA (TF), however, as you an see from this photo, he blew a bugle (as a trumpeter). So, the RGA had trumpeters, not buglers. Mike Morrison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Bailey Posted 27 June , 2008 Share Posted 27 June , 2008 I set Bob on this train of enquiry because a close friend of mine (and forum member) had told me (with some authority) that the Artillery didn't have buglers. I would say from the answers that he was technically correct, but I always had in my mind how would the lads know when to 'come to the cook house door boys, come to the cook house door'? I'll go back and tell my friend about the trumpeters. Bob, Looking again at the badge, could they be hunting horns as used by Fox Hunters, rather than bugles? They look longer than bugles. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Clifton Posted 27 June , 2008 Share Posted 27 June , 2008 ... how would the lads know when to 'come to the cook house door boys, come to the cook house door'? Bob, Looking again at the badge, could they be hunting horns as used by Fox Hunters, rather than bugles? They look longer than bugles. John John I believe that both trumpeters and buglers in the mounted arms wore crossed trumpets as a badge. In the infantry, buglers were also drummers (except in the Rifles) and wore a drum! The trumpet and bugle calls were the same, irrespective of the instrument. But cavalry (and, I think, other mounted arms) had different calls for Reveille and Last Post, which you sometimes hear. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Bailey Posted 27 June , 2008 Share Posted 27 June , 2008 Thanks Ron. Nothing is simple when it comes to the Army, is it? John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnr.ktrha Posted 27 June , 2008 Share Posted 27 June , 2008 Hello, Just a quick one, in the RHA when dismounted ie, not on a horse, the calls are sounded on the Horse Trumpet. This would include things like 'to boots and saddle', 'Feed up', 'Alarm'. The bugle was used when mounted, cords over left shoulder and bugle held in Right hand [the trumpet was fastened across the back of the body using its cord] Calls such as 'Walk march' 'Trot' etc were called when mounted. Therefore the majority of calls are given on the Trumpet, this is probably why they are refered to as Trumpeters. The only time I recall RHA Trumpeters using their Trumpets when mounted was when doing the duty of 'Queens Life Guard' and there was a possibility of a Memeber of the Royal Family in the vicinity. There was a special call sounded by the duty trumpeter , same as the Household cavalry sound when HRH is about. Regards, Stewart [an ex RHA ad hoc Trumpeter] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrel Posted 27 June , 2008 Share Posted 27 June , 2008 Cavalry and RHA/RFA also had calls for "stables", "boots and saddles", "walk", "trot", "canter", "charge" and various other "horsey" requirements. Each regiment, cavalry, infantry etc and RHA, RFA and RGA, also had a unique "regimental call" which preceded the duty call being sounded so that they would know which unit the call was intended for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertBr Posted 27 June , 2008 Author Share Posted 27 June , 2008 Can we add sound to the Forum? (Not singing. If I did the forum would soon have no members left). Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-ted Posted 27 June , 2008 Share Posted 27 June , 2008 QUOTE (Bob B @ Jun 27 2008, 12:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Can we add sound to the Forum? (Not singing. If I did the forum would soon have no members left). Bob Bob, turn your speakers on and click on this link. http://www.farmersboys.com/MAIN/Bugles_Calls.htm Regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSMMo Posted 27 June , 2008 Share Posted 27 June , 2008 Had I the technological know-how, I might have been able to resize the photo of my grandfather sounding his trumpet-which-looks-like-a-bugle. The horses are being tended in picket lines and their ears are all up. As I understand it (and as it appears from the photo) the horses learned the various calls as well as the troops. Mike Morrison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick62 Posted 27 June , 2008 Share Posted 27 June , 2008 The RFA along with the RHA were known as the Mounted Branch of the Royal Artillery, whilst the RGA were known as the Dismounted Branch, so the short answer is yes the RFA would have had Trumpeters (not buglers) although the Trumpeter would carry both instruments. Just reinforcing what's already been said, this page from the forum's sister site may help: http://www.1914-1918.net/whatartbrig.htm BatteriesUsually lettered A to D, each of the Batteries numbered 198 heads at full establishment. Each was commanded by a Major or Captain, with a Captain as Second-in-Command, and 3 Lieutenants or Second-Lieutenants in charge of 2-gun sections. Battery establishment also included a Battery Sergeant-Major , a Battery Quartermaster Sergeant , a Farrier-Sergeant, 4 Shoeing Smiths (of which 1 would be a Corporal), 2 Saddlers, 2 Wheelers, 2 Trumpeters, 7 Sergeants, 7 Corporals, 11 Bombardiers, 75 Gunners, 70 Drivers and 10 Gunners acting as Batmen. Two trumpeters per battery of 198 men (nominal headcount). Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Clifton Posted 28 June , 2008 Share Posted 28 June , 2008 ... my grandfather sounding his trumpet-which-looks-like-a-bugle. The horses are being tended in picket lines and their ears are all up. As I understand it (and as it appears from the photo) the horses learned the various calls as well as the troops. Mike Morrison Hello Mike Sorry to be pedantic, but the trumpet and bugle are actually different (the trumpet's bore is cylindrical, the bugle's is conical). Your grandfather may indeed have been sounding a bugle. And yes, the horses did get to know the calls. A commentary on Trooping the Colour draws attention to the fact that the Household Cavalry horses' ears pricked up at the sound of "The Keel Row". Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSMMo Posted 28 June , 2008 Share Posted 28 June , 2008 Thanks for that information, Ron. My grandfather continued to play cornet until he could no longer for dental reasons. As did my great grandfather, my father (Trumpet) and me ("). The differences are minor, but they produce distinct sounds, don't they? To get back to the point of this thread, does anybody know why they made that distinction between Artillery and everybody else? I'm still curious. Mike Morrison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Strawbridge Posted 29 June , 2008 Share Posted 29 June , 2008 Medals from my collection :- R.F.A. 1883 TPTR. J.E. SMITH. 1914/5 star R.F.A. 576 TPTR. J. OLDFIELD. 1914/5 star K.R.RIF:C. C-658 BGLR: F. STANIER. 1914/5 star R.M.L.I. PLY.16436 BUGR. D.C. LUSCOMBE. victory medal R.M.L.I. PO.20744 B.BUGR. W.J. WOODROFFE. BWM R.M.L.I. PO.20490 BUGR. B.T. FORDHAM. BWM R.N. DEAL.456 BUGR. A. MOORE. BWM 1/K.A.R. 125 BUG. JOHN victory medal 1/PATIALA INF. No 907 BUGLR. MEMHA SINGH. 1914/5 star 1-55 RFLS.F.F. 57 BUGLR.MAJ. MAHMAD. BWM/victory pair 1-55 RFLS.F.F. 78 BUGLR. MOHD. HUSSAIN. victory medal 1/89/PUNJABIS. No 1572 BUGLR. KHAN MOHD. 1914/5 star 2-32 SIKHS. 186 BUGLR. JAI SINGH. victory medal 33 PJBIS. 733 BUG.MAJ. SUJAWAL. victory medal 52 SIKHS. 4281 BUGLR HADAYAT KHAN victory medal 124/INFY. NO. 3943 BUGLR. MUHD.ALI. 1914/5 star Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-ted Posted 29 June , 2008 Share Posted 29 June , 2008 Jim, that's an impresive collection. Has anyone tried the link to the bugle site? i would be interested to learn how authentic the calls are. regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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