ianhwason Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 Hello all, I'm planning a visit to Kew on my return from the Somme and Ypres area in early July to look up some diaries of the LF. Is getting hold of the readers ticket a long drawn out process? Roughly how long does it usually take from entering the building to being able to sit down in the readers room with the documents in your hands? Any advice on a visit would be excellent. Thanks, Ian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hartley Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 Ian Getting a readers card is a matter of only a few minutes. Before leaving home, double check that you have the ID that's requested and, more generally, you have all the information you need for research with you. IIRC, you can pre-order documents even without a readers ticket - but check this on the NA website. This will save you time and you'll be able to get cracking straight away. Get there when it opens and complete the ticket business. You've probably then time to get a coffee before the reading room opens. Other tips - bear in mind that many diaries are now available online and, as I understand things, the originals are not now generally available. And, take a camera - most useful for recording information - set it to silent operation and remember you can't use flash. If you're copying lots of diary pages, make sure you take a break now and again - otherwise it can be a killer on the back back and neck. Final tip - make sure you enjoy your day - handling the original documents connects you to the history like nothing else, in my view. It's some years since I was a Kew newbie, so I may have forgotten to mention something - hopefully others will chime in. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianhwason Posted 17 June , 2013 Author Share Posted 17 June , 2013 Hello John, I have the document reference numbers ready and the dates I'm interested in so I think I'm some way to being prepared. As you mention I was hoping to pre-order but according to the web site you require a readers ticket first. I keep checking to see if the diaries I require are available on line with no luck ( I was told by a member of staff 10 months ago that they would be by last Christmas). I was hoping to have them to hand before heading off to Ypres and the Somme area. Thanks for the tip on breaks - I'm one of the multitude of people with a dicky back. Cheers, Ian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue Light Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 Things have changed a bit over the last few months in relation to getting a reader's ticket. You have to go up to the top floor and use one of the computer terminals to fill in some forms and details of the documents you are supplying for ID purposes - check the website to go through the list to make sure you have at least two items which fit the different criteria. Having done that, you then have to sit through a fifteen minute online presentation which deals with handling documents. The last step is to go to one of the staff on the desk to have your photo taken, details verified, and get your card. Allow at least 45 minutes for the whole procedure, perhaps longer if it's busy. Even those renewing their old reader's cards have to go through the same procedure - so even if you've been visiting for the last couple of decades you still have to sit through the document handling video etc. And there is no way now to order documents in advance if you don't have a valid card - if your current card is out of date you will have to visit and renew before you can order anything else. Sue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianhwason Posted 17 June , 2013 Author Share Posted 17 June , 2013 Thanks Sue, I think I will get there early! Unfortunately I will only have a half day available at the archives, hence the need to get a resonable idea of timescales. Heading into Kew from Hastings then need to get on my way to Bath and then home to Scotland. I will have the correct ID on me as I will need that sort of thing for the trip to Belgium/France. Cheers, Ian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CGM Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 If you are not aware - they are closed on Mondays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 Went there in March and experience was as Sue says. Allow a good 30 to 45 min from door to readers ticket. If time is critical plan very crefully your route and read up on their web site. No bags allowed upstairs only clear bags and limited number of items - so go to cloak room and drop off all you do not need (locking lockers provided), get clear bag (provided) for limited items and go upstairs as Sue described to get your ticket. Then you can go down a floor to book a reading table (get one with a camera stand by the window) and request documents (you cannot preorder without a readers ticket) There are lockable lockers by the entrance to the reading room if you have to much stuff. (this for me took around 30 min) time for coffee and breakfast. Upstairs again and get documents. So about 1hour to 1:15 before you start reading documents. I found there was not enough time on a limited visit to read just photograph. There are power points at the desks for your camera. Follow their system and there should be no problems and staff generally helpfull. Again I would emphasise a thourgh read of their website for floor plans, how to get there etc (about 5-10 min walk from kew gardens) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 For writing, only pencils are allowed in the reading rooms - no pens or even pencils with rubber tips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamie92208 Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 One thing that I came up against last time I went ws that there is a limit to the number of documents that you can request in a day. I was looking for some very specific info and was able to scan large documents (Company minute books) very quickly as they all had a comprehensive index. The point about pre ordering documents is well made it saves you another half hour on average so you will be able to do productive research as soon as you ahve got your readers ticket. if you order your next 3 docs before you sit down then you have a head start. certainly if your time is limited , as mine was, pre planning pays dividends. Jamie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianhwason Posted 17 June , 2013 Author Share Posted 17 June , 2013 Thanks to all. Wow it all seems very organised - I can understand it when our history lies in these documents and they need treating with the respect they deserve. Jamie - unfortunately you can't pre-order without holding a valid readers ticket and to get hold of one you need to apply on site. Cheers, Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hartley Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 Ian Just to echo an earlier post......don't attempt to read anything while you're there. Time is valuable. Photograph it all and read later. If you've a lot from one file, get hold of one of the camera stands near the window. Dead easy then - click, turn page, click, turn page..... John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 Dont forget a utility bill with your current address on it G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianhwason Posted 17 June , 2013 Author Share Posted 17 June , 2013 Ian Just to echo an earlier post......don't attempt to read anything while you're there. Time is valuable. Photograph it all and read later. If you've a lot from one file, get hold of one of the camera stands near the window. Dead easy then - click, turn page, click, turn page..... John One of my worries was the quality of my photos and discovering when home that I could not read certain bits so I do like the sound of the camera stands, set up once and off you go! Ta, Ian Dont forget a utility bill with your current address on it G My driving licence will cover proof of address going by the list on the web site. Thanks, Ian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hartley Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 One of my worries was the quality of my photos and discovering when home that I could not read certain bits Assuming you're using a stand, check the first couple of shots and then periodically. Hand held can be a bit iffy with the lowish light conditions but, if you crank up the "ASA rating" even those should be fine (although I confess to having screwed up on one occasion) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stebie9173 Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 I will be taking a utility bill along with my photo driving licence - just in case! (Reader whose card expired in May) Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hazelclark Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 One thing that I came up against last time I went ws that there is a limit to the number of documents that you can request in a day. I was looking for some very specific info and was able to scan large documents (Company minute books) very quickly as they all had a comprehensive index. The point about pre ordering documents is well made it saves you another half hour on average so you will be able to do productive research as soon as you ahve got your readers ticket. if you order your next 3 docs before you sit down then you have a head start. certainly if your time is limited , as mine was, pre planning pays dividends. Jamie hi Jamie, I am intrigued by "company minute books". What are they? The title suggests a wonderful resource but i imagine that if it were what it suggests, mention would have been made somewhere before!! Thanks, Hazel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seaforths Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 I visited in April on my current reader ticket but had my daughter with me who didn't have one. She had her passport and driving licence and that was absolutely fine. She took the paper part and the photo-card of her licence. You have to register via one of the computers first as someone else pointed out. You also have to sit through a tutorial via the computer on how to handle documents. There is no getting around this but it only takes a few minutes. It then takes a few minutes to go through the document check and photograph with a desk clerk however, if you time it badly there will be a queue. There was about 4 people before us and they only had one person on the desk but after us there was around 8 - 10 people, so we didn't do too badly really. This was mid-morning and I expect that if you arrive at opening, you will be sorted a whole lot quicker than we were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 I will be taking a utility bill along with my photo driving licence - just in case! (Reader whose card expired in May) Steve. I was in exactly the same position last Friday. The room where readers' tickets are issued and renewed had just one person in it. It still took nearly an hour. Anyone who needs to renew a ticket might consider allowing more than an hour if they are in a queue. In my experience the overhead cameras are always in big demand and every time I have been there at least one or two were not working, and on one occasion the whole lot were out of action so dont rely on them. I would always recommend taking a camera as backup (and a recharger if you are going to take lots of photos) and book a seat with an overhaed camera gantry - which are near the windows for light If a doc is not available, it is always worth asking the desk why. I have managed to get 'unavailable' docs out...they were sitting in a queue to be digitised. It is worth pleading especially if you have travelled a long way. Regards MG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hartley Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 If a doc is not available, it is always worth asking the desk why. I have managed to get 'unavailable' docs out...they were sitting in a queue to be digitised. It is worth pleading especially if you have travelled a long way. The difficulty with these "unavailable" ones is that you usually have to access them in a back room. The lighting is very poor and there is no camera stand. Last time, I had to take notes as I couldnt hold the camera sufficiently steady to get decent photos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seaforths Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 The difficulty with these "unavailable" ones is that you usually have to access them in a back room. The lighting is very poor and there is no camera stand. Last time, I had to take notes as I couldnt hold the camera sufficiently steady to get decent photos. I put in an advanced order towards the end of last year and I received the email stating my request was successful. When I arrived I found the boxes I had ordered had been withdrawn for digitisation. I complained and while the guy was sympathetic I was not getting very far other than an apology for the admin mess-up, so I asked to see a supervisor. After I pointed out the distance I had travelled and costs incurred, coupled with the fact that no-one had contacted me about them being withdrawn, I was allowed access in the invigilating room. There are camera stands in the invigilating room but the lighting is so bad and the stands fixed to badly positioned desks that decent photography is out of the question. There was however a portable camera stand in there which I managed to manoeuvre into a better position and worked away quite happily on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin spof Posted 17 June , 2013 Admin Share Posted 17 June , 2013 They put camera stands in the back room when the war diaries were being digitised. Unfortunately, the lighting casts shadows on all of them so your photos come out with light and shade on them. As Ian will be on his way back to Scotland, I'm sure he'll endure that to get the photos he needs. Which reminds me....Ian, if you are looking at LF diaries, concentrate on the Gallipoli ones as the units on the Western Front will be online "by the cenetnary" according to TNA. Glen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamie92208 Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 hi Jamie, I am intrigued by "company minute books". What are they? The title suggests a wonderful resource but i imagine that if it were what it suggests, mention would have been made somewhere before!! Thanks, Hazel Sorry if I've misled you Hazel. I was doing some railway research and all the board minutes and those of the main board committees were available for the years I was interested in. (1897 to 1922). They were all in leather bound volumes, copperplate script with each entry numbered and cross referenced. Each volume had a pre printed index bound into it so it was a piecve of cake for me to see if there was any mention of the particular set of lines that I was researching. Sorry if this got you all agog but they weren't militayr 'companies' unfortunately, even if they did deal with events around the Great War. Jamie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hazelclark Posted 17 June , 2013 Share Posted 17 June , 2013 Sorry if I've misled you Hazel. I was doing some railway research and all the board minutes and those of the main board committees were available for the years I was interested in. (1897 to 1922). They were all in leather bound volumes, copperplate script with each entry numbered and cross referenced. Each volume had a pre printed index bound into it so it was a piecve of cake for me to see if there was any mention of the particular set of lines that I was researching. Sorry if this got you all agog but they weren't militayr 'companies' unfortunately, even if they did deal with events around the Great War. Jamie Thought it was too good to be true! Thanks, Hazel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianhwason Posted 18 June , 2013 Author Share Posted 18 June , 2013 As Ian will be on his way back to Scotland, I'm sure he'll endure that to get the photos he needs. Which reminds me....Ian, if you are looking at LF diaries, concentrate on the Gallipoli ones as the units on the Western Front will be online "by the cenetnary" according to TNA. Glen Hello Glen, To be honest I don't want to rely on the timescales that they quote - no offence to them intended as it must be a big job. As mentioned I was quoted by last Christmas. The plan is : head down backside up and go for it whilst trying to make sure the quality is OK. Thanks Ian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 18 June , 2013 Share Posted 18 June , 2013 The LF war diaries for the 1st Bn (86th Inf Bde 29th Div) and 9th Bn at Gallipoli (34th Inf Bde 11th Div) have already been digitised and are available online. The diaries of the TF Lanc Fus Battalions (1/5th, 1/6th, 1/7th and 1/8th) in 42nd East Lancs Div have not yet been digitised. Edit. I see from your footnotes it is the 1/6th 10th and 1/5th Bns...... The ref for the 42nd Div file is WO 95/4315 for Gallipoli. I strongly suspect that this is in the queue for digitisation so it might be worth calling them in advance to check. The 1/6th Bn diaries start from 1st Aug 1915. .....1/5th Bn starts from 1st May 1915. 10th Bn diaries have not been digitised yet. Ref is WO 95/2012/1 it starts on 1st Jul 1915 and runs through to 1919. MG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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