andy1400 Posted 18 April , 2005 Share Posted 18 April , 2005 I am trying to find out about the men on the memorial in Raunds, Northamptonshire. During my research I have found men from Raunds on other memorials and some of the men on my local one are not from Raunds.Would anyone know what the criterion were for having a name on the memorial apart from the obvious one of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Morgan Posted 18 April , 2005 Share Posted 18 April , 2005 I am trying to find out about the men on the memorial in Raunds, Northamptonshire. During my research I have found men from Raunds on other memorials and some of the men on my local one are not from Raunds.Would anyone know what the criterion were for having a name on the memorial apart from the obvious one of course. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> You can't say for certain, Andy. There were often local committees set up to decide on where a memorial would be sited, what it would look like, and they also drew up the "rules" for inclusion and style of commemoration. There was no national framework to ensure that everyone was commemorated, or to ensure that everyone was commemorated only once, or to apply any geographical guidelines about who should be commemorated where. Often, the steering committee couldn't possibly know the names of all the local dead themselves, so there had to be a system of collecting names. There was often no way of checking details, nor the expertise to do so accurately. For example, my own town is very small but has 500+ names on the memorial and in the accompanying Book of Remembrance. The details in the book often have errors such as non-existent regimental names ("The King's Guards") and strange ranks, such as a "Private" in the Royal Navy. With such a large number, it's not surprising that there are "Soldiers Died" known to have come from the town but not included on the memorial or in the book. There could be several reasons for this - no-one left to put the name forward, a conscious decision not to send in the name, an executive decision not to allow the inclusion of certain groups (soldiers who were executed often fall into this group) and so on. As the important decisions were often purely local, you need to go back to local sources such as local newspaper reports of the progress of the war memorial plans, etc., if you haven't already done this. All different - all interesting! Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy1400 Posted 19 April , 2005 Author Share Posted 19 April , 2005 Thank you for the information Tom. It does seem a shame that there are probably people who are not remembered on any memorials. Anyway, I shall do my best to find out about the 107 on the Raunds memorial. Once again thanks for the information. Regards Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J T Gray Posted 20 April , 2005 Share Posted 20 April , 2005 Andy, Another imponderable to add... I know of a village war memorial that has seven more names on it than the one in the parish church because those seven men were chapel, rather than church, goers. Yet in the next parish the chapel memorial has the same names as the church... And there is no WW2 memorial! Adrian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy1400 Posted 22 April , 2005 Author Share Posted 22 April , 2005 Thanks for the replies. I really would have thought there would have been some kind of centralised control. I shall press on and do my best Cheers Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick H Posted 28 April , 2005 Share Posted 28 April , 2005 Just to add further to this topic! The Cross of Sacrifice war memorial for Warley (as opposed to Great Warley) is situate in Lorne Road Cemetary where there are many individual graves, but no names on the Cross! The memorial tablet in Christ Church Warley lists the dead but does not include the Catholics who are listed on an outside wall of All Saints & Holy Cross immediately opposite Christ Church. I recall reading in the Parish Magazine for that time that the Catholics were invited to be on the Christ Church tablet memorial but the families refused ! They died together regardless of religion but are not commemorated together ! Patrick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOMMESOLDIER Posted 4 May , 2005 Share Posted 4 May , 2005 Hi There, I have found this problem in my village with men missing off the memorial. The one I do find strange though is, that a family lost three sons but only two of them are on the memorial. Why not the third ?!! Cheers Tim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hartley Posted 4 May , 2005 Share Posted 4 May , 2005 Hi There, I have found this problem in my village with men missing off the memorial. The one I do find strange though is, that a family lost three sons but only two of them are on the memorial. Why not the third ?!! Cheers Tim. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Not uncommon, Tim. I've come across several in Stockport. One son on the memorial, the other not - and no obvious explanation. Possibilities:- - son had moved away so didnt qualify according to the organising committee' rules. Or some other reason why he didnt meet the criteria. - son was "black sheep" of the family - son may have been married. Wife's religious beliefs may have been against memorials. Or she remarried and didnt want to be reminded of him. Or he was a ****. - son wasn't believed to be dead - probably loads of other reasons. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john w. Posted 4 May , 2005 Share Posted 4 May , 2005 Agree with all the above.. to get round it I created with the help of the webmaster a virtual memorial .. so now all are there and more can be added!!! John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kinnethmont Posted 4 May , 2005 Share Posted 4 May , 2005 Tim Can you advise the actual inscription text which is on the memorial ie Erected in grateful memory , etc, etc ? This often gives a clue as to the criteria used and may explain why your man is left off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stiletto_33853 Posted 5 May , 2005 Share Posted 5 May , 2005 It gets even better, I have come across someone on a memorial locally that had never even been to the town. His folks moved here in 1917 but as they were residents when the memorial was planned his name was included. There is also a name on there put on by his auntie and uncle, although he was not a resident, coming from a county a long way away. It does make you wonder about the criteria used from area to area. Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kinnethmont Posted 5 May , 2005 Share Posted 5 May , 2005 Andy If he was a single man, then that will have beeen his family home. There by current place of residence. Is he listed at his old address parish or the parish of his birth? That would not be unusual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hartley Posted 5 May , 2005 Share Posted 5 May , 2005 It gets even better, I have come across someone on a memorial locally that had never even been to the town.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> I'm told, by a reliable source, that there are several names on the main Chester memorial who have absolutely no connection with the City. Apparently, folk were invited to write names, for inclusion, in a book in the Cathedral. Chester was a tourist location even then and several names are simply relatives of people visiting the town on day trips. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Wayman Posted 6 May , 2005 Share Posted 6 May , 2005 Hi Andy I have come across a similar situation but on a large scale while researching the 48 names recorded on the war memorial in Pelsall village (near Walsall, ex South Staffordshire!). I have discovered sixty further names of men connected directly to the village whose names do not appear on the memorial. Equally, there are one or two names of men for whom I can find no connection to the village bar the existence of their names on the memorial! Two years of research have failed to provide acceptable answers. Ken Wayman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Morgan Posted 6 May , 2005 Share Posted 6 May , 2005 Welcome to the Forum, Ken. For Pals who might not know about it, Ken's book on his local memorial, "The True and Faithful Men" is excellent. In my opinion, it's one of those books which shows how it should be done. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keith Posted 12 May , 2005 Share Posted 12 May , 2005 T C Noel has this memorial on the wall at Exton church in Rutland. But also has his name on the memorials at Exton / Little Casterton / Great Casterton and Cottesmore in Rutland. keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john w. Posted 12 May , 2005 Share Posted 12 May , 2005 I have six village memorials and know of another in the local town where you will get multiple entrants and then those left off... there really is no consistency at all John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kinnethmont Posted 12 May , 2005 Share Posted 12 May , 2005 Keith There must be some explanation why he is on four. I have a man on three. He lived in a parish which was at one time split and so raised seperate memorials five miles apart. He is on another 20 miles away in the parish of his birth. The text may assist the criteria used. Do any these memorials state " connected with " rather than " left this parish " , "men of this parish " or similar? Are any of them church / school memorials ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keith Posted 13 May , 2005 Share Posted 13 May , 2005 Little Casterton is on a wall inside the church Great Casterton is on the gate at the entrance to the Church .Cottesmore is in the church yard, Exton he is on the village memorial (below ) and the plaque in the church. On the CWGC site . Son of Cecil and Edith Noel of Cottesmore Oakham Rutland . Educated at Eton collage Windsor. There is a Capt.The Hon R E T M Noel third son of the earl of Gainsborough , Exton park who died in 1918 He may have some thing to do with this family and may have worked in the four parishes ? Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kinnethmont Posted 13 May , 2005 Share Posted 13 May , 2005 The fact he might be a " son of the earl of Gainsborough " may account for him being on memorials linked to Gainsborough land. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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